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inJESUS
Guest
one thing is sure. She was a rich and succesful trader before Islam and Muhammad. She was the cousin of Waraqa bin Nawfal who belonged or was the priest of an unorthodox Christian sect.
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George_Waters
Guest
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khadijah_bint_Khuwaylid
"Khuwaylid ibn Asad (Khadijah’s father), who died around 585, was a merchant, a successful businessman whose vast wealth and business talents were inherited by Khadijah and who succeeded in managing her father’s business interests and preserving the family’s vast wealth. It is said that when Banu Quraish’s trade caravans gathered to embark upon their lengthy and arduous journey either to Syria during the summer or to Yemen during the winter, Khadijah’s caravan equaled the caravans of all other traders of Quraish put together. Fatimah bint Za’idah (Khadijah’s mother), died around 575, a member of the Banu `Amir ibn Luayy ibn Ghalib tribe and a distant relative of Muhammad.
Khadijah earned two titles: Ameerat-Quraish (Princess of Quraish) and al-Tahira (the Pure One), and was said to have had an impeccable character. She used to feed and clothe the poor, assist her relatives financially, and provide for the marriage of those of her kin who could not otherwise have had the means to marry. Another aspect of her character, unusual for her times and unlike the practices of her people Khadijah was said to have neither believed in nor worshipped idols."
All this BEFORE Islam.
Also:
uwacadweb.uwyo.edu/Religionet/er/islam/IGLOSSRY.HTM#ltr.k
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AgnosTheist
Guest
^ Thanks. But that could just be an exception. Mohammad at least standardized a better treatment of women across the region.
mind you, it was only better within the context of the past. those policies are quite barbaric compared to contemporary treatment of women.
mind you, it was only better within the context of the past. those policies are quite barbaric compared to contemporary treatment of women.
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George_Waters
Guest
While she may be the exception to the rule it will be difficult to confirm due to the lack of documentation/interest. It is far easier to simply claim things got better for women to support your cause than to prove they really did improve.
You know, reading about Khadijah has made me wonder; how much of Muhammed’s message changed after her death? She seemed like a good person. Did Muhammed’s behavior/attitude change after the death of this powerful women?
You know, reading about Khadijah has made me wonder; how much of Muhammed’s message changed after her death? She seemed like a good person. Did Muhammed’s behavior/attitude change after the death of this powerful women?
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inJESUS
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George_Waters
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Rodrigo_Bivar
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For one thing - there is no evidence Khatidja was an exception.
Secondly, it is totally false to say that Muhammad standardized a better treatment of women across the region. How do you know this? Did you just accept what a Muslim told you?
Some evidence would be nice. On the face of it - from Khatidja’s biography, the standing of women in Arab society went DOWN, not up, with Muhammad.
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Rodrigo_Bivar
Guest
This is an example of the standardized better standard for Arab women provided by the prophet Muhammad.
Imaam al-Ghazaali (RH) said that when a woman marries she becomes like a slave.
Nikaah (marriage) is a form of slavery for the woman, and this is confirmed by the hadeeth of ‘Aa’ishah (RA), who said:
النكاح رق فلينظر أحدكم أين يضع كريمته
“Nikaah is slavery (servitude), so let each one of you watch out (i.e. be cautious) to whom he gives his daughter.”
sawtulislam.com/?p=24
Imaam al-Ghazaali (RH) said that when a woman marries she becomes like a slave.
Nikaah (marriage) is a form of slavery for the woman, and this is confirmed by the hadeeth of ‘Aa’ishah (RA), who said:
النكاح رق فلينظر أحدكم أين يضع كريمته
“Nikaah is slavery (servitude), so let each one of you watch out (i.e. be cautious) to whom he gives his daughter.”
sawtulislam.com/?p=24
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inJESUS
Guest
Rodrigo, have you got any idea why muhammad did not allow the remarriage of his women after his death?
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Rodrigo_Bivar
Guest
Don’t know if it’s true but I heard a long time ago that someone expressed an interest in marrying Aisha after Muhammad died, but the old man got jealous and slapped a ban on his wives ever remarrying.
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jonfan
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jonfan
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Also this Valke-
Volume 1, Book 6, Number 301:
Narrated Abu Said Al-Khudri:
Once Allah’s Apostle went out to the Musalla (to offer the prayer) o 'Id-al-Adha or Al-Fitr prayer. Then he passed by the women and said, “O women! Give alms, as I have seen that the majority of the dwellers of Hell-fire were you (women).” They asked, “Why is it so, O Allah’s Apostle ?” He replied, “You curse frequently and are ungrateful to your husbands. I have not seen anyone more deficient in intelligence and religion than you. A cautious sensible man could be led astray by some of you.” The women asked, “O Allah’s Apostle! What is deficient in our intelligence and religion?” He said, “Is not the evidence of two women equal to the witness of one man?” **They replied in the affirmative. He said, “This is the deficiency in her intelligence. **Isn’t it true that a woman can neither pray nor fast during her menses?” The women replied in the affirmative. He said, "This is the deficiency in her religion."
Volume 1, Book 6, Number 301:
Narrated Abu Said Al-Khudri:
Once Allah’s Apostle went out to the Musalla (to offer the prayer) o 'Id-al-Adha or Al-Fitr prayer. Then he passed by the women and said, “O women! Give alms, as I have seen that the majority of the dwellers of Hell-fire were you (women).” They asked, “Why is it so, O Allah’s Apostle ?” He replied, “You curse frequently and are ungrateful to your husbands. I have not seen anyone more deficient in intelligence and religion than you. A cautious sensible man could be led astray by some of you.” The women asked, “O Allah’s Apostle! What is deficient in our intelligence and religion?” He said, “Is not the evidence of two women equal to the witness of one man?” **They replied in the affirmative. He said, “This is the deficiency in her intelligence. **Isn’t it true that a woman can neither pray nor fast during her menses?” The women replied in the affirmative. He said, "This is the deficiency in her religion."
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Rodrigo_Bivar
Guest
Just as I thought.
altafsir.com/Tafasir.asp?tMadhNo=0&tTafsirNo=73&tSoraNo=33&tAyahNo=53&tDisplay=yes&UserProfile=0
Tanwîr al-Miqbâs min Tafsîr Ibn ‘Abbâs
{ يٰأَيُّهَا ٱلَّذِينَ آمَنُواْ لاَ تَدْخُلُواْ بُيُوتَ ٱلنَّبِيِّ إِلاَّ أَن يُؤْذَنَ لَكُمْ إِلَىٰ طَعَامٍ غَيْرَ نَاظِرِينَ إِنَاهُ وَلَـكِنْ إِذَا دُعِيتُمْ فَٱدْخُلُواْ فَإِذَا طَعِمْتُمْ فَٱنْتَشِرُواْ وَلاَ مُسْتَأْنِسِينَ لِحَدِيثٍ إِنَّ ذَٰلِكُمْ كَانَ يُؤْذِي ٱلنَّبِيَّ فَيَسْتَحْيِي مِنكُمْ وَٱللَّهُ لاَ يَسْتَحْيِي مِنَ ٱلْحَقِّ وَإِذَا سَأَلْتُمُوهُنَّ مَتَاعاً فَٱسْأَلُوهُنَّ مِن وَرَآءِ حِجَابٍ ذٰلِكُمْ أَطْهَرُ لِقُلُوبِكُمْ وَقُلُوبِهِنَّ وَمَا كَانَ لَكُمْ أَن تؤْذُواْ رَسُولَ ٱللَّهِ وَلاَ أَن تَنكِحُوۤاْ أَزْوَاجَهُ مِن بَعْدِهِ أَبَداً إِنَّ ذٰلِكُمْ كَانَ عِندَ ٱللَّهِ عَظِيماً }
33:53
(O ye who believe! Enter not the dwellings of the Prophet for a meal) this verse was revealed concerning a group of believers who used to enter the rooms of the Prophet (pbuh) in the morning and evening and wait for the food to be served. They used to eat and speak with the wives of the Prophet (pbuh). The Prophet (pbuh) did not like this but felt shy of these believers and could not tell them to stop coming to his rooms without permission, or ask them to leave once they were inside. But Allah forbade them from this, saying: O believers, do not enter the rooms of the Prophet (pbuh) without permission from the Prophet to come and eat (without waiting for the proper time) for the food to be ready, (unless permission be granted you) to come in. (But if yeare invited, enter, and, when, your meal is ended) when you have finished eating, (then disperse) then leave. (Linger not for conversation) with the wives of the Prophet (pbuh). (Lo! That) coming in, sitting down and having conversation with the wives of the Prophet (pbuh) (would cause annoyance to the Prophet) Allah bless him and give him peace, (and he would be shy of (asking) you (to go)) or not to come in the first place; (but Allah is not shy of the Truth) Allah is not shy to command you to leave and not go in his rooms without his permission. (And when ye ask of them (the wives of the Prophet) anything) and when you speak with them, (ask it of them) speak with them (from behind a curtain. That is purer for your hearts and for their hearts) i.e. from doubts. (And it is not for you to cause annoyance to the messenger of Allah) by entering his rooms without his permission and conversing with his wives, (nor that ye should ever marry his wives after him) after his death.
This verse was revealed about Talhah Ibn 'Ubaydullah who had in mind to marry 'A’ishah after the death of the Prophet (pbuh). (Lo! That) your open declaration and intention to marry the Prophet’s wives after his death (in Allah’s sight would be an enormity) it is an enormous sin which merits severe punishment.
Yet another situational, self-serving verse from Muhammad’s imaginary friend Allah, just because the old man was jealous.
Muhammad consigned poor 18 year old Aisha to nearly fifty years of widowhood when she could have found someone her own age to share her life with.
altafsir.com/Tafasir.asp?tMadhNo=0&tTafsirNo=73&tSoraNo=33&tAyahNo=53&tDisplay=yes&UserProfile=0
Tanwîr al-Miqbâs min Tafsîr Ibn ‘Abbâs
{ يٰأَيُّهَا ٱلَّذِينَ آمَنُواْ لاَ تَدْخُلُواْ بُيُوتَ ٱلنَّبِيِّ إِلاَّ أَن يُؤْذَنَ لَكُمْ إِلَىٰ طَعَامٍ غَيْرَ نَاظِرِينَ إِنَاهُ وَلَـكِنْ إِذَا دُعِيتُمْ فَٱدْخُلُواْ فَإِذَا طَعِمْتُمْ فَٱنْتَشِرُواْ وَلاَ مُسْتَأْنِسِينَ لِحَدِيثٍ إِنَّ ذَٰلِكُمْ كَانَ يُؤْذِي ٱلنَّبِيَّ فَيَسْتَحْيِي مِنكُمْ وَٱللَّهُ لاَ يَسْتَحْيِي مِنَ ٱلْحَقِّ وَإِذَا سَأَلْتُمُوهُنَّ مَتَاعاً فَٱسْأَلُوهُنَّ مِن وَرَآءِ حِجَابٍ ذٰلِكُمْ أَطْهَرُ لِقُلُوبِكُمْ وَقُلُوبِهِنَّ وَمَا كَانَ لَكُمْ أَن تؤْذُواْ رَسُولَ ٱللَّهِ وَلاَ أَن تَنكِحُوۤاْ أَزْوَاجَهُ مِن بَعْدِهِ أَبَداً إِنَّ ذٰلِكُمْ كَانَ عِندَ ٱللَّهِ عَظِيماً }
33:53
(O ye who believe! Enter not the dwellings of the Prophet for a meal) this verse was revealed concerning a group of believers who used to enter the rooms of the Prophet (pbuh) in the morning and evening and wait for the food to be served. They used to eat and speak with the wives of the Prophet (pbuh). The Prophet (pbuh) did not like this but felt shy of these believers and could not tell them to stop coming to his rooms without permission, or ask them to leave once they were inside. But Allah forbade them from this, saying: O believers, do not enter the rooms of the Prophet (pbuh) without permission from the Prophet to come and eat (without waiting for the proper time) for the food to be ready, (unless permission be granted you) to come in. (But if yeare invited, enter, and, when, your meal is ended) when you have finished eating, (then disperse) then leave. (Linger not for conversation) with the wives of the Prophet (pbuh). (Lo! That) coming in, sitting down and having conversation with the wives of the Prophet (pbuh) (would cause annoyance to the Prophet) Allah bless him and give him peace, (and he would be shy of (asking) you (to go)) or not to come in the first place; (but Allah is not shy of the Truth) Allah is not shy to command you to leave and not go in his rooms without his permission. (And when ye ask of them (the wives of the Prophet) anything) and when you speak with them, (ask it of them) speak with them (from behind a curtain. That is purer for your hearts and for their hearts) i.e. from doubts. (And it is not for you to cause annoyance to the messenger of Allah) by entering his rooms without his permission and conversing with his wives, (nor that ye should ever marry his wives after him) after his death.
This verse was revealed about Talhah Ibn 'Ubaydullah who had in mind to marry 'A’ishah after the death of the Prophet (pbuh). (Lo! That) your open declaration and intention to marry the Prophet’s wives after his death (in Allah’s sight would be an enormity) it is an enormous sin which merits severe punishment.
Yet another situational, self-serving verse from Muhammad’s imaginary friend Allah, just because the old man was jealous.
Muhammad consigned poor 18 year old Aisha to nearly fifty years of widowhood when she could have found someone her own age to share her life with.
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inJESUS
Guest
Interesting, thank you Rodrigo…
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inJESUS
Guest
But i don’t understand it…
Nor is it right for you that ye should annoy God’s Apostle, or that ye should marry his widows after him at any time. Truly such a thing is in God’s sight an enormity. S. 33:53
why is it such an enormity if a widow married again? in fact Islam does not promote celibacy and women have the right to get married again. Why would allah be so angry with this in the first place?its no sin, no crime. It is Muhammad’s jealousy that led him to have a “revelation” forbidding his wives from ever remarrying.It’s not a sin so that God feels so bad about it. Fact is, God said:
by law a married woman is bound to her husband as long as he is alive, but if her husband dies, she is released from the law of marriage.
If this is not bad, see this:
O wives of the Prophet! you are not like any other of the women; If you will be on your guard, then be not soft in (your) speech, lest he in whose heart is a disease yearn; and speak a good word. **AND STAY IN YOUR HOUSES **and do not display your finery like the displaying of the ignorance of yore;
How can anyone believe that these words are not mere human words that reflect a man’s jealousy and insecurity?
Nor is it right for you that ye should annoy God’s Apostle, or that ye should marry his widows after him at any time. Truly such a thing is in God’s sight an enormity. S. 33:53
why is it such an enormity if a widow married again? in fact Islam does not promote celibacy and women have the right to get married again. Why would allah be so angry with this in the first place?its no sin, no crime. It is Muhammad’s jealousy that led him to have a “revelation” forbidding his wives from ever remarrying.It’s not a sin so that God feels so bad about it. Fact is, God said:
by law a married woman is bound to her husband as long as he is alive, but if her husband dies, she is released from the law of marriage.
If this is not bad, see this:
O wives of the Prophet! you are not like any other of the women; If you will be on your guard, then be not soft in (your) speech, lest he in whose heart is a disease yearn; and speak a good word. **AND STAY IN YOUR HOUSES **and do not display your finery like the displaying of the ignorance of yore;
How can anyone believe that these words are not mere human words that reflect a man’s jealousy and insecurity?
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George_Waters
Guest
I always heard so much about Islamic logic, but here there is no logic.
If you get a good answer to this let me know.
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inJESUS
Guest
well i was just reading that because:I always heard so much about Islamic logic, but here there is no logic.
1-his wives are called the mothers of believers. While this verse is revealed about Aisha who became a widow at 18, am not sure in what sense she can be considered a mother to believers. Maybe give advice and so on? She was able to start a “war of believers” though because of her hatred to Ali, if not mistaken.
2- because his wives will be his wives in the next life
He had no prob. killing men and marrying their wives or take married women as sexual concubines of war but people hve got no right to take his widows because he wants them all in janna.
I don’t know if these can be considered “logical” reasons for prohibiting a legal marriage of a widow. I personally will refrain from giving my opinion for obvious reasons.
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