Muhammed wanted to write a document which seems superior to Quran.

[Sam_777]

These are two authentic hadiths in which Muhammed before his death wanted to write document which seems more superior to Quran, but he was denied by his caliph Umar.

I wonder what was that document which Muslims will not go astray after it!!!
Maybe he wanted to write that Christianity is the true path…

Sahih Muslim, Book 013, Number 4016:
Ibn Abbas reported: When Allah’s Messenger (may peace be upon him) was about to leave this world, there were persons (around him) in his house, 'Umar b. al-Kbattab being one of them. Allah’s Apostle (may peace be upon him) said: Come, I may write for you a document; you would not go astray after that. Thereupon Umar said: Verily Allah’s Messenger (may peace be upon him) is deeply afflicted with pain. You have the Qur’an with you. The Book of Allah is sufficient for us. Those who were present in the house differed. Some of them said: Bring him (the writing material) so that Allah’s Messenger (may peace be upon him) may write a document for you and you would never go astray after him And some among them said what 'Umar had (already) said. When they indulged in nonsense and began to dispute in the presence of Allah’s Messenger (may peace be upon him), he said: Get up (and go away) 'Ubaidullah said: Ibn Abbas used to say: There was a heavy loss, indeed a heavy loss, that, due to their dispute and noise. Allah’s Messenger (may peace be upon him) could not write (or dictate) the document for them.

صحيح مسلم:
لما حضر رسول الله ‏ ‏صلى الله عليه وسلم ‏ ‏وفي البيت رجال فيهم ‏ ‏عمر بن الخطاب ‏ ‏فقال النبي ‏ ‏صلى الله عليه وسلم ‏ ‏هلم ‏ ‏أكتب لكم كتابا لا تضلون بعده فقال ‏عمر ‏ ‏إن رسول الله ‏ ‏صلى الله عليه وسلم ‏ ‏قد غلب عليه الوجع وعندكم القرآن حسبنا كتاب الله فاختلف أهل البيت فاختصموا فمنهم من يقول قربوا يكتب لكم رسول الله ‏ ‏صلى الله عليه وسلم ‏ ‏كتابا لن تضلوا بعده ومنهم من يقول ما قال ‏ ‏عمر ‏ ‏فلما أكثروا اللغو ‏ ‏والاختلاف عند رسول الله ‏ ‏صلى الله عليه وسلم ‏ ‏قال رسول الله ‏ ‏صلى الله عليه وسلم ‏ ‏قوموا ‏
​

(E) (A)

*Sahih Bukhari, Volume 7, Book 70, Number 573:
Narrated Ibn 'Abbas:
When Allah’s Apostle was on his death-bed and in the house there were some people among whom was 'Umar bin Al-Khattab, the Prophet said, “Come, let me write for you a statement after which you will not go astray.” 'Umar said, “The Prophet is seriously ill and you have the Qur’an; so the Book of Allah is enough for us.” The people present in the house differed and quarrelled. Some said “Go near so that the Prophet may write for you a statement after which you will not go astray,” while the others said as Umar said. When they caused a hue and cry before the Prophet, Allah’s Apostle said, “Go away!” Narrated 'Ubaidullah: Ibn 'Abbas used to say, “It was very unfortunate that Allah’s Apostle was prevented from writing that statement for them because of their disagreement and noise.” *

صحيح البخاري:
لما حضر رسول الله ‏ ‏صلى الله عليه وسلم ‏ ‏وفي البيت رجال فيهم ‏ ‏عمر بن الخطاب ‏ ‏قال النبي ‏ ‏صلى الله عليه وسلم ‏ ‏هلم أكتب لكم كتابا لا تضلوا بعده فقال ‏ ‏عمر ‏ ‏إن النبي ‏ ‏صلى الله عليه وسلم ‏ ‏قد غلب عليه الوجع وعندكم القرآن حسبنا كتاب الله فاختلف أهل البيت فاختصموا منهم من يقول قربوا يكتب لكم النبي ‏ ‏صلى الله عليه وسلم ‏ ‏كتابا لن تضلوا بعده ومنهم من يقول ما قال ‏ ‏عمر ‏ ‏فلما أكثروا اللغو ‏ ‏والاختلاف عند النبي ‏ ‏صلى الله عليه وسلم ‏ ‏قال رسول الله ‏ ‏صلى الله عليه وسلم ‏ ‏قوموا قال ‏ ‏عبيد الله ‏ ‏فكان ‏ ‏ابن عباس ‏ ‏يقول إن الرزية كل الرزية ما حال بين رسول الله ‏ ‏صلى الله عليه وسلم ‏ ‏وبين أن يكتب لهم ذلك الكتاب من اختلافهم ولغطهم ‏
​

(E) (A)

 

[famdigy]

This event is at the center of a dispute between the shia and sunni. We believe the Prophet (pbuh&hf) wanted to prevent sectarianism and divisions among the muslims by having them follow the instructions in this document.

The prophet (pbuh&hf) advised the muslims on many occasions that he leaves behind two weighty and heavy things. As long as the people follow these two, they will never go astray after him.

1. the Quran
2. His family, The Ahlul-bayt (Ali, Fatima, Hassan, Hussein and his 9 children)

Umar having being involved in two assassination attempts at the prophet, knew this document would be a thorn in his goal to get power. He already knew this document would spell out the successor, and so Umar could not allow the Prophet (pbuh&hf) to write it, and for anyone else to bring him his request.

The prophet (pbuh&hf) also knew of everything that would happen after he died, and so he was obligated to try and prevent it as well as to lay the burden of proof against Umar and his followers.

On a side note, there’s a misconception among Muslims and non-muslims alike that the Prophet (pbuh&hf) was illiterate. This is furthest from the truth. In reality the Prophet (pbuh&hf) could read and write in more than 70 languages. But he chose not to write so people would not accuse him of penning the Qur’an.

 

[Sam_777]

Umar having being involved in two assassination attempts at the prophet, knew this document would be a thorn in his goal to get power. He already knew this document would spell out the successor, and so Umar could not allow the Prophet (pbuh&hf) to write it, and for anyone else to bring him his request.

could be…

The prophet (pbuh&hf) also knew of everything that would happen after he died,

http://forums.catholic-questions.org/images/icons/icon13.gif I don’t think so, he was a normal man according to (Quran 17:93).

On a side note, there’s a misconception among Muslims and non-muslims alike that the Prophet (pbuh&hf) was illiterate. This is furthest from the truth. In reality the Prophet (pbuh&hf) could read and write in more than 70 languages. But he chose not to write so people would not accuse him of penning the Qur’an.

You are contradicting Quran …
(Quran 7:157):
“Those who follow the Messenger, the unlettered Prophet, whom they find mentioned in their own (Scriptures) - in the Law and the Gospel - for he commands them what is just and forbids them what is evil; he allows them as lawful what is good (and pure) and prohibits them from what is bad (and impure); he releases them from their heavy burdens and from the yokes that are upon them. So it is those who believe in him, honour him, help him, and follow the Light which is sent down with him, it is they who will prosper.”

الذِينَ يَتَّبِعُونَ الرَّسُولَ النَّبِيَّ الأمِّيَّ الذِي يَجِدُونَهُ مَكْتُوبًا عِنْدَهُمْ فِي التَّوْراةِ والإِنْجِيلِ
​

 

[famdigy]

could be…

http://forums.catholic-questions.org/images/icons/icon13.gif I don’t think so, he was a normal man according to (Quran 17:93).

context is everything, read the verse from it’s beginning and you will see the command “say I am only a man…” is a response to some of the outrageous demands the unbelievers made, such as requesting the prophet (pbuh&hf) summon God and the angels down to the earth. In other words " i am only a man" with respect to such requests. But knowledge of the unseen and being informed of the future is a separate matter all together.

You are contradicting Quran …
(Quran 7:157):
“Those who follow the Messenger, the unlettered Prophet, whom they find mentioned in their own (Scriptures) - in the Law and the Gospel - for he commands them what is just and forbids them what is evil; he allows them as lawful what is good (and pure) and prohibits them from what is bad (and impure); he releases them from their heavy burdens and from the yokes that are upon them. So it is those who believe in him, honour him, help him, and follow the Light which is sent down with him, it is they who will prosper.”

الذِينَ يَتَّبِعُونَ الرَّسُولَ النَّبِيَّ الأمِّيَّ الذِي يَجِدُونَهُ مَكْتُوبًا عِنْدَهُمْ فِي التَّوْراةِ والإِنْجِيلِ
​

thanks for quoting the arabic here النَّبِيَّ الأمِّيَّ is transliterated to al-nabi al-ummi (the Ummi Prophet) the key word is Ummi, which can mean many things.

one explanation is ummi = unlettered
another explanation is that ummi is a reference to Umm al-qura = mother of all villages. A reference to the city of Makkah. Therefore in our view, when the Quran refers to the prophet as Al-Nabi Al-Ummi, it is referring to the prophet from Umm Al-qura, the prophet from the city of Makkah.

There is a hadith to this effect narrated by Imam Ja’far al-sadiq (as), the 6th great grandson of the prophet.

 

[Sam_777]

another explanation is that ummi is a reference to Umm al-qura = mother of all villages. A reference to the city of Makkah. Therefore in our view, when the Quran refers to the prophet as Al-Nabi Al-Ummi, it is referring to the prophet from Umm Al-qura, the prophet from the city of Makkah.

There is a hadith to this effect narrated by Imam Ja’far al-sadiq (as), the 6th great grandson of the prophet.

Oh come’on famdigy :hug1:that is totally illogical, that Arabic word is very clear and doesn’t need further interpretation.

 

[famdigy]

Oh come’on famdigy :hug1:that is totally illogical, that Arabic word is very clear and doesn’t need further interpretation.

why not SAM, check this out. no time to translate sorry, as I have head back to work.

1 ـ روى الشيخ محمد بن الحسن الصفار عن أحمد بن محمد عن أبي عبد الله البرقي عن جعفر بن محمد الصوفي قال سألت أبا جعفر (عليه السلام) محمد بن علي الرضا (عليه السلام) وقلت له: يا بن رسول الله لم سمي النبي الأمي قال: ما يقول الناس ؟ قال: قلت له جعلت فداك يزعمون إنما سمى النبي الأمي لأنه لم يكتب. فقال: كذبوا عليهم لعنة الله أنى يكون ذلك والله تبارك وتعالى يقول في محكم كتابه: (هُوَ الَّذِي بَعَثَ فِي الْأُمِّيِّينَ رَسُولاً مِنْهُمْ يَتْلُو عَلَيْهِمْ آيَاتِهِ وَيُزَكِّيهِمْ وَيُعَلِّمُهُمُ الْكِتَابَ وَالْحِكْمَةَ) فكيف كان يعلمهم مالا يحسن والله لقد كان رسول الله صلى الله عليه وآله يقرأ ويكتب باثنين وسبعين أو بثلاثة وسبعين لسانا وإنما سمى الأمي لأنه كان من أهل مكة و مكة من أمهات القرى وذلك قول الله تعالى في كتابه: (لِتُنْذِرَ أُمَّ الْقُرَى وَمَنْ حَوْلَهَا). بصائر الدرجات - محمد بن الحسن الصفار - صفحة 245 باب في أن رسول لله ص كان يقرأ ويكتب بكل لسان

 

[jakasaki]

I don’t know about mohamad speaking 70 or so languages, but in some other earlier posts we discussed the topic whether mohamad could read/write or not.

Narrated Anas bin Malik: **Once the Prophet wrote a letter or had an idea of writing a letter. The Prophet was told that they (rulers) would not read letters unless they were sealed. So the Prophet got a silver ring made with “Muhammad Allah’s Apostle” engraved on it. **As if I were just observing its white glitter in the hand of the Prophet (Book #3, Hadith #65)

… The Prophet said, “I am Allah’s Apostle and also Muhammad bin 'Abdullah.”

Then he said to 'Ali, "Rub off (the words) ‘Allah’s Apostle’ ", but 'Ali said, “No, by Allah, I will never rub off your name.”

So, Allah’s Apostle took the document and wrote, 'This is what Muhammad bin 'Abdullah has agreed upon: No arms will be brought into Mecca except in their cases, and nobody from the people of Mecca will be allowed to go with him (i.e. the Prophet ) even if he wished to follow him and he (the Prophet ) will not prevent any of his companions from staying in Mecca if the latter wants to stay…(Book #49, Hadith #863)
…'

Narrated 'Abdullah bin Abbas: Allah’s Apostle wrote a letter to Caesar saying, “If you reject Islam, you will be responsible for the sins of the peasants (i.e. your people).” (Book #52, Hadith #187)

Narrated Abdullah bin Abbas: **Allah’s Apostle wrote to Caesar and invited him to Islam **and sent him his letter with Dihya Al-Kalbi whom Allah’s Apostle ordered to hand it over to the Governor of Busra who would forward it to Caesar. (Book #52, Hadith #191)

Narrated Abu Humaid As-Saidi: We accompanied the Prophet in the Ghazwa of Tabuk and the king of 'Aila presented a white mule and a cloak as a gift to the Prophet. **And the Prophet wrote to him a peace treaty allowing him to keep authority **over his country. (Book #53, Hadith #387)

These are just some hadiths stating mohamad could write. Besides, he was a young merchant in the carvans selling/buying goods. Knowing to count money and goods sold and keeping some sort of inventory.

I don’t buy he was the “unlettered” prophet. The koran was written by man and man alone.

Narrated Zaid bin Thabit:** When we wrote the Holy Quran, I missed one of the Verses of Surat-al-Ahzab which I used to hear Allah’s Apostle reciting. Then we searched for it and found it with Khuzaima bin Thabit Al-Ansari. The Verse was:-- 'Among the Believers are men Who have been true to Their Covenant with Allah, Of them, some have fulfilled Their obligations to Allah (i.e. they have been Killed in Allah’s Cause), And some of them are (still) waiting" (33.23) So we wrote this in its place in the Quran. ** (Book #59, Hadith #379)

All hadiths posted above are from Sahih Bukhari.

Famdigy - nice to see you back on CAF - :hug1:

 

[jakasaki]

The opinion that this was so rests almost entirely upon the term An-nabiyyu’l Ummi (النّبِيٌ آلأُمِّيّ) in Surah vii, Al A’raf, vers. 156, 158.

But this does not mean “the Unlettered Prophet” but “the Gentile Prophet”, i.e. the prophet who is not an Israelite, but is from among the Gentiles (مِنَ الأُمِّيّيٍنّ).

This is clear from Surah iii, Al 'Imran, ver. 19, where the command is given to Muhammad: “And say thou to those who have been brought the Book and to the Gentiles” (وَاْلأْمِّيّيِنَ).

Here it is clear that the Arabs are called “the Gentiles” in contradistinction from “the People of the Book”. Hence the expression An Nabiyyu’l Ummi, “the Gentile Prophet,” is equivalent to the title so common today, An Nabiyyu’l 'Arabi, “the Arabian Prophet,” and does not imply illiteracy.

Scholars are also aware that there exist traditions, quoted by Muslim and Al Bukhari, which remove the stigma of want of education from Muhammad.

For instance, we are told that, when the Treaty of Hudaibah was being signed, Muhammad took the pen from 'Ali, struck out the words in which ‘Ali had designated him “the Apostle of God”, and wrote instead with his own hand the words, "Son of ‘Abdu’llah.’’

Tradition tells us too that, when he was dying, Muhammad called for pen and ink, to write a command appointing his successor, but that his strength failed him before writing-materials were brought. This tradition rests on the statement of Ibn 'Abbas, but is supported by both Al Bukhari and Muslim.

As it is a subject of dispute between the Sunni and the Shi’ah parties, we shall not attempt to decide upon its correctness. But the existence of such Traditions, supported by leading Traditionists, is of great weight, especially as there is nothing unlikely about them. Writing was not uncommon among the Arabs of Muhammad’s time.

THE MIZANU’L HAQQ
ميزان الحق
(BALANCE OF TRUTH)
C. G. Pfander, D. D.
by W. St. Clair Tisdall, M. A. D. D.
First Published in 1910

 

[jakasaki]

context is everything, read the verse from it’s beginning and you will see the command “say I am only a man…” is a response to some of the outrageous demands the unbelievers made, such as requesting the prophet (pbuh&hf) summon God and the angels down to the earth. In other words " i am only a man" with respect to such requests. But knowledge of the unseen and being informed of the future is a separate matter all together.

thanks for quoting the arabic here النَّبِيَّ الأمِّيَّ is transliterated to al-nabi al-ummi (the Ummi Prophet) the key word is Ummi, which can mean many things.

one explanation is ummi = unlettered
another explanation is that ummi is a reference to Umm al-qura = mother of all villages. A reference to the city of Makkah. Therefore in our view, when the Quran refers to the prophet as Al-Nabi Al-Ummi, it is referring to the prophet from Umm Al-qura, the prophet from the city of Makkah.

There is a hadith to this effect narrated by Imam Ja’far al-sadiq (as), the 6th great grandson of the prophet.

UMMI. . The title assumed by Muhammad, and which occurs in the Qur’an. Surah viii. 156: “Who shall follow the Apostle, the illiterate Prophet (an-Nabiyu 'l-ummi)”; and in the 158th verse of the same Surah.

Commentators are not agreed as to the derivation of tine word, the following are the three most common derivations of it:—

(1) From Umm. mother," i.e. one just as him came from his mother’s womb.

(2) From Ummah. “people,” i.e. a gentile, one who was ignorant: alluding to the time of Muhammad’s ignorance.

(3) From Umnmnu 'l-qura. “the mother of villages,” a name given to Makkah; i.e. a native of Makkah, Muhammad appears to have wished to be thought ignorant and illiterate, in order to raise the elegance of the Qur’an into a miracle.

Page: 649 - DICTIONARY OF ISLAM.

 

[jakasaki]

could be…

http://forums.catholic-questions.org/images/icons/icon13.gif I don’t think so, he was a normal man according to (Quran 17:93).

You are contradicting Quran …
(Quran 7:157):
“Those who follow the Messenger, the unlettered Prophet, whom they find mentioned in their own (Scriptures) - in the Law and the Gospel - for he commands them what is just and forbids them what is evil; he allows them as lawful what is good (and pure) and prohibits them from what is bad (and impure); he releases them from their heavy burdens and from the yokes that are upon them. So it is those who believe in him, honour him, help him, and follow the Light which is sent down with him, it is they who will prosper.”

الذِينَ يَتَّبِعُونَ الرَّسُولَ النَّبِيَّ الأمِّيَّ الذِي يَجِدُونَهُ مَكْتُوبًا عِنْدَهُمْ فِي التَّوْراةِ والإِنْجِيلِ
​

Hi Sam -

I was reading the Tafsir on 7-157 - regarding the “unlettered” word attached and it is ummi and they go to explain it as such…

157 So. now mercy has been assigned to those who follow this Messenger, the Ummi Prophet

Here the use of the word (ummi) for the Holy Prophet is very significant.

This title was used to break the national pride and arrogance of the Jews, who called the non-Jews ummis (gentiles).

In this respect, they were so arrogant that, as a nation, not to speak of acknowledging an ummi as their leader. they were not ready even to concede basic human rights to the gentiles.

They asserted, “… We are not to be called to account for our behavior towards the gentiles …” (III: 75). That is why Allah has used the word ummi before “Prophet”. as if to say. "Now your salvation solely depends on following this Ummi Prophet.

If you follow him, you will receive a portion of My mercy. otherwise you are doomed to the same wrath to which you have been subjected during the centuries of your deviation."

So it’s not about reading/writting & “rithmatic” unlettered or illiterate.

And after reading so much more today, somehow the “author and writters” of the koran made mohamad "illitereate and unlettered so mohamad cannot be accused for writting the koran.

Well, the koran wasn’t written or dictated by God, because God would not change his Word from the Torah and the NT - the koran is man made, man written and not the word of God.

 

[famdigy]

Hi Sam -

I was reading the Tafsir on 7-157 - regarding the “unlettered” word attached and it is ummi and they go to explain it as such…

Thank you and good to see you back as well.

I wonder where do they come up with this explanation? why don’t they take the explanations from the prophet’s family, as he advised all Muslims, my paraphrasing here “follow the Qur’an and my family, and both are inseparable until they return to me at the fountain of Kauthar”

Well, the koran wasn’t written or dictated by God, because God would not change his Word from the Torah and the NT - the koran is man made, man written and not the word of God.

This can be argued both ways, for example, the bible we have today wasn’t inspired by God, because God would not change his words from the original Torah and the NT - the bible is mixed with God’s true words and man’s mistakes, one can not tell what is true and what is not, especially when the original greek manuscripts are no longer with us. It was written by people 300 years later who never saw or met Jesus, and further more, they were Greeks, who had a completely different culture and way of life from the era of Jesus.
And how can one trust the bible is accurate when there are over 30,000 discrepancies between over 100 New Testament manuscripts. This was according to John Mill, the first person to print the Bible, John found so many discrepancies in the manuscripts he wasn’t sure which one to include and which one to leave out so he decided to write footnotes along with the scripture detailing all the discrepancies he found.

Even Christians today admit that mistakes cropped up in the bible because it was transmitted by humans. Add to that the list of all the manuscripts which didn’t even make it to the canonized bible at Nicea because they were destroyed. Many Christian scholars after having studied the bible at seminaries and having learned of all the many errors and discrepancies, end up leaving the church because they can not in good conscience preach the bible as the word of God. I heard this on an interview with an X-Christian minister that graduated from Harvard Seminary School.

 

[Sam_777]

Muhammed was illiterate per many Quranic verses including this one:

(Quran 29:48):
*YUSUFALI: And thou wast not (able) to recite a Book before this (Book came), nor art thou (able) to transcribe it with thy right hand: In that case, indeed, would the talkers of vanities have doubted.
PICKTHAL: And thou (O Muhammad) wast not a reader of any scripture before it, nor didst thou write it with thy right hand, for then might those have doubted, who follow falsehood.
SHAKIR: And you did not recite before it any book, nor did you transcribe one with your right hand, for then could those who say untrue things have doubted.

*

*وَمَا كُنْتَ تَتْلُو مِنْ قَبْلِهِ مِنْ كِتَابٍ وَلاَ تَخُطُّهُ بِيَمِينِكَ إِذاً لاَرْتَابَ الْمُبْطِلُونَ
*​

Now if you want to prove otherwise, then there is a higher chance that Muhammed himself invented Quran.

 

[koranist]

could be…

http://forums.catholic-questions.org/images/icons/icon13.gif I don’t think so, he was a normal man according to (Quran 17:93).

You are contradicting Quran …
(Quran 7:157):
“Those who follow the Messenger, the unlettered Prophet, whom they find mentioned in their own (Scriptures) - in the Law and the Gospel - for he commands them what is just and forbids them what is evil; he allows them as lawful what is good (and pure) and prohibits them from what is bad (and impure); he releases them from their heavy burdens and from the yokes that are upon them. So it is those who believe in him, honour him, help him, and follow the Light which is sent down with him, it is they who will prosper.”

الذِينَ يَتَّبِعُونَ الرَّسُولَ النَّبِيَّ الأمِّيَّ الذِي يَجِدُونَهُ مَكْتُوبًا عِنْدَهُمْ فِي التَّوْراةِ والإِنْجِيلِ
​

Unlettered is not necessarily correct as the term Ummi is used also to mean gentile in the Koran. Anotherwords Muhammad was not an Israelite and had not received knowledge about the previous books. Here is a Koranist viewpoint that I accept:

Does the word ‘UMMY’ mean illiterate?

The word ‘ummy’ has been used in the Quran in a number of verses. The following verse is one example:

“Those who follow the messenger, the prophet who is ‘ummy’ …” 7:157

Many translations of the Quran have wrongly translated the word ‘ummy’ to mean illiterate.

With a quick analysis of various Quranic verses that use the word ‘ummy’ it can be easily verified that this word does not mean illiterate, and that the correct meaning is gentile or someone who has not received a scripture.

Let us read the following verse:

“If they argue with you (O Muhammad) say, ‘I have simply submitted myself to God, I and those who follow me’. You shall proclaim to those who received a Scripture and the Ummy’s (those who did not receive a Scripture), ‘Would you submit?’ …” 3:20

In this verse God is commanding Muhammad to proclaim to those who have received a Scripture (e.g. the Jews and Christians) as well as the Ummys to submit.

If you use the wrong interpretation used by most Muslims today of the word ‘Ummy’ so as to mean he who cannot read or write, we would have the following translation:

“Proclaim to those who received a Scripture and those who cannot read or write to submit”

It is quite obvious that this is an inaccurate translation for the following reasons:

1- The opposite of ‘those who received a Scripture’ is ‘those who did not receive a Scripture’ and not those who cannot read or write!

2- If we assume that the word ‘ummy’ really means illiterate then God is commanding the prophet to call to submission those who received a Scripture and only the illiterate among the rest! Once again, this is very irrational and does not make any sense.

Also, let us read 62:2:

“He is the one who sent the ummys a messenger …”

Once again, if we assume that the word ‘ummy’ means illiterate then that would mean that God has in fact sent Muhammad only to those who cannot read or write!

It is quite obvious that God would send a messenger with a scripture to those who did not receive one, and not to those who cannot read and write!

Now let us read the following verses where we are given yet another conclusive evidence that the word ‘ummy’ does not mean illiterate:

"Among them are ‘ummuys’ who do not know the scripture, except through hearsay, then assume that they know it.

Therefore, woe to those who distort the scripture with their own hands, then say, “This is what God has revealed,” seeking a cheap material gain. Woe to them for such distortion, and woe to them for their illicit gains." 2:78-79

In verse 78, God speaks about the ‘ummys’ who do not know the scripture, then in verse 79 God warns them not to write distorted versions of the scripture ‘WITH THEIR OWN HANDS’. And since the words of the verse indicates that they can in fact read and write, then we have yet another conclusive evidence that the word ‘ummy’ does NOT mean illitertae.

The correct meaning of the word ‘ummy’ in the Quran is a gentile, or the ones who did not receive a scripture.

quran-islam.org/150.html

 

[jakasaki]

Unlettered is not necessarily correct as the term Ummi is used also to mean gentile in the Koran. Anotherwords Muhammad was not an Israelite and had not received knowledge about the previous books. Here is a Koranist viewpoint that I accept:

Does the word ‘UMMY’ mean illiterate?

The word ‘ummy’ has been used in the Quran in a number of verses. The following verse is one example:

“Those who follow the messenger, the prophet who is ‘ummy’ …” 7:157

Many translations of the Quran have wrongly translated the word ‘ummy’ to mean illiterate.

With a quick analysis of various Quranic verses that use the word ‘ummy’ it can be easily verified that this word does not mean illiterate, and that the correct meaning is gentile or someone who has not received a scripture.

Let us read the following verse:

“If they argue with you (O Muhammad) say, ‘I have simply submitted myself to God, I and those who follow me’. You shall proclaim to those who received a Scripture and the Ummy’s (those who did not receive a Scripture), ‘Would you submit?’ …” 3:20

In this verse God is commanding Muhammad to proclaim to those who have received a Scripture (e.g. the Jews and Christians) as well as the Ummys to submit.

If you use the wrong interpretation used by most Muslims today of the word ‘Ummy’ so as to mean he who cannot read or write, we would have the following translation:

“Proclaim to those who received a Scripture and those who cannot read or write to submit”

It is quite obvious that this is an inaccurate translation for the following reasons:

1- The opposite of ‘those who received a Scripture’ is ‘those who did not receive a Scripture’ and not those who cannot read or write!

2- If we assume that the word ‘ummy’ really means illiterate then God is commanding the prophet to call to submission those who received a Scripture and only the illiterate among the rest! Once again, this is very irrational and does not make any sense.

Also, let us read 62:2:

“He is the one who sent the ummys a messenger …”

Once again, if we assume that the word ‘ummy’ means illiterate then that would mean that God has in fact sent Muhammad only to those who cannot read or write!

It is quite obvious that God would send a messenger with a scripture to those who did not receive one, and not to those who cannot read and write!

Now let us read the following verses where we are given yet another conclusive evidence that the word ‘ummy’ does not mean illiterate:

"Among them are ‘ummuys’ who do not know the scripture, except through hearsay, then assume that they know it.

Therefore, woe to those who distort the scripture with their own hands, then say, “This is what God has revealed,” seeking a cheap material gain. Woe to them for such distortion, and woe to them for their illicit gains." 2:78-79

In verse 78, God speaks about the ‘ummys’ who do not know the scripture, then in verse 79 God warns them not to write distorted versions of the scripture ‘WITH THEIR OWN HANDS’. And since the words of the verse indicates that they can in fact read and write, then we have yet another conclusive evidence that the word ‘ummy’ does NOT mean illitertae.

The correct meaning of the word ‘ummy’ in the Quran is a gentile, or the ones who did not receive a scripture.

quran-islam.org/150.html

See my post #10

That’s exactly what I posted - ummi = gentile…