Muhammed's theology FAILS.

[Charlotte408]

can i ask a somewhat wayward question here???

ok, from what I understand is that, the mueslims resent the western modern world because, its…i guess against what they believe. I’m assuming that they are- old fashioned, or think things should be more old fashioned…girls dressing a certain way…roles for women…that clashes with america and the western modernized world with MTV and etc etc… thats kinda the jist of what I figure is the problem…

If I’m wrong, please…please lol…a mueslim please tell me what the problem is…

But my question is, even with this anomosity…right…lets say they dont like us. They believe in Allah…who is thier God…who will judge them…and I have to think that their God doesnt want them killing people…right?? Thou shalt not kill??? It was Jesus that they thought was JUST a prophet right? So they must believe in the thou shalt not kill at least? So, why with the suicide bombing and all these shinianigans??? There isnt a passage in the Koran that suggests this type of stuff??? How/why do they do this, and feel validated for doing it? Not liking someone is one thing, but to go and kill hundreds of innocent people like 9/11 is another…dont they fear that God will judge them??

 

[staffsgt7]

can i ask a somewhat wayward question here???

ok, from what I understand is that, the mueslims resent the western modern world because, its…i guess against what they believe. I’m assuming that they are- old fashioned, or think things should be more old fashioned…girls dressing a certain way…roles for women…that clashes with america and the western modernized world with MTV and etc etc… thats kinda the jist of what I figure is the problem…

If I’m wrong, please…please lol…a mueslim please tell me what the problem is…

But my question is, even with this anomosity…right…lets say they dont like us. They believe in Allah…who is thier God…who will judge them…and I have to think that their God doesnt want them killing people…right?? Thou shalt not kill??? It was Jesus that they thought was JUST a prophet right? So they must believe in the thou shalt not kill at least? So, why with the suicide bombing and all these shinianigans??? There isnt a passage in the Koran that suggests this type of stuff??? How/why do they do this, and feel validated for doing it? Not liking someone is one thing, but to go and kill hundreds of innocent people like 9/11 is another…dont they fear that God will judge them??

That flashy thing in your signature really makes it hard to read your posts.

Anyway, you are putting your concepts of sin onto Islam. Mohammed defined sin differently. Anything that advances Islam is good and anything that inhibits it is bad. Sin is what Mohammed says is sin - haram, and good deeds or goodness is halal.

Killing is haram, but only if a Muslim kills another Muslim. (let us not get into the part where more Muslims kill Muslims because they explain that off as ‘collateral damage’ and sometimes they just figure ‘allah will take care of them since they died while in an attempt to kill unbelievers’) Killing is ok if a Muslim kills an unbeliever and if they didn’t accept subjugation, or conversion to Islam then it is even considered holy and righteous. If a Muslim happens to die while killing these unbelievers then they are considered martyrs and get on that fastpath to their heaven. No judgement, no time served in hell, they go straight to heaven. Walid Shoebat even says that they can name 70 others to be on that fast track to heaven and that is probably why the family and community celebrates their deaths as if it were a wedding ceremony.

My goodness, the number of surahs that say that they should kill is so very numerous that I will post a link to an article if you want to read it that outlines them. And when you read the peaceful passages then you should realize that all the surahs that say to get along with unbelievers, or treat them well were abrogated, or replaced by what we call the ‘sword surahs’. I gave you a link to a Muslim talking about abrogation which is a very real thing in Islam.

In fact in Sharia laws if a Muslim doesn’t know about abrogration or doesn’t have proper training in the Koran they are not supposed to talk about it to others.

There are so many restrictions on Muslims knowing their own ideology it is mind boggling, and dangerous. It is dangerous for unbelievers in Muslim lands to even discuss anything concerning Islam. This is why they are trying their darndest to shut us up via the UN. Other countries they just intimidate, slap lawsuits on them, threaten or just downright terrorize if non-Muslims talk about Islam.

 

[Charlotte408]

That flashy thing in your signature really makes it hard to read your posts.

ha haa…I’m a woman…its in my nature to make things difficult

 

[ZAKI]

Of course it fails.

Islam teaches that God can get it wrong and/or changes his mind.

It also teaches that he is not all powerful because of the belief in the Satanic verses, that Satan was able to insert these into the Qu’ran.

no it doesn’t actually-islam is very against that actually-teaching that God is all-power and all-perfect.
your second point is invalid as well…there ARE no satanic verses-if u interpret these verses as being satanic and evil then that is your choice but in reality they are from the one God who is all-knowing and the greatest.

 

[ZAKI]

That flashy thing in your signature really makes it hard to read your posts.

Anyway, you are putting your concepts of sin onto Islam. Mohammed defined sin differently. Anything that advances Islam is good and anything that inhibits it is bad. Sin is what Mohammed says is sin - haram, and good deeds or goodness is halal.

Killing is haram, but only if a Muslim kills another Muslim. (let us not get into the part where more Muslims kill Muslims because they explain that off as ‘collateral damage’ and sometimes they just figure ‘allah will take care of them since they died while in an attempt to kill unbelievers’) Killing is ok if a Muslim kills an unbeliever and if they didn’t accept subjugation, or conversion to Islam then it is even considered holy and righteous. If a Muslim happens to die while killing these unbelievers then they are considered martyrs and get on that fastpath to their heaven. No judgement, no time served in hell, they go straight to heaven. Walid Shoebat even says that they can name 70 others to be on that fast track to heaven and that is probably why the family and community celebrates their deaths as if it were a wedding ceremony.

My goodness, the number of surahs that say that they should kill is so very numerous that I will post a link to an article if you want to read it that outlines them. And when you read the peaceful passages then you should realize that all the surahs that say to get along with unbelievers, or treat them well were abrogated, or replaced by what we call the ‘sword surahs’. I gave you a link to a Muslim talking about abrogation which is a very real thing in Islam.

In fact in Sharia laws if a Muslim doesn’t know about abrogration or doesn’t have proper training in the Koran they are not supposed to talk about it to others.

There are so many restrictions on Muslims knowing their own ideology it is mind boggling, and dangerous. It is dangerous for unbelievers in Muslim lands to even discuss anything concerning Islam. This is why they are trying their darndest to shut us up via the UN. Other countries they just intimidate, slap lawsuits on them, threaten or just downright terrorize if non-Muslims talk about Islam.

in islam it is forbidden to kill an innocent muslim or a non-muslim, either will result in execution in shariah law. so no what you have said is a load of bull. Also suicide bombing is haram in islam charlotte-it is a minority of fanatics who carry out these disgusting acts.
I’m also dissapointed staff that you have given a link to islam review-a well know biased website against muslims.

All the verses displayed in that site have been misinterpreted and not only that-the author has cut and pasted bits from specific verses to show his view. yoel is too scared to put down the entire verse because it will go against the few words he has selected out of each verse. Charlotte, if u really want to learn what the Quran says then read it. it is a beautiful book.
not only has yoel not finished the verses he has also changed and cut out specific things out from verses such as this one:
*2.191] And kill them wherever you find them, and drive them out from whence they drove you out, and persecution is severer than slaughter, and do not fight with them at the Sacred Mosque until they fight with you in it, but if they do fight you, then slay them; such is the recompense of the unbelievers.

here the verse says before (but if they fight you…) that you should not fight them unless they attack you for verily Allah hates the ones who starts wars.

 

[Charlotte408]

*2.191] And kill them wherever you find them, and drive them out from whence they drove you out, and persecution is severer than slaughter, and do not fight with them at the Sacred Mosque until they fight with you in it, but if they do fight you, then slay them; such is the recompense of the unbelievers.

WAIT- I dont understand this…

**And kill them wherever you find them **- ok, whom? people that prosecute you?
and drive them out from whence they drove you out- ok…take back your land…
and persecution is severer than slaughter- persecution is worse than slaughter, is this saying to return the persecution? instead of slaughtering them?
and do not fight with them at the Sacred Mosque until they fight with you in it- and dont fight WITH them until they fight WITH you?? so, keep the divide with those who persecuted you until they change hearts?
but if they do fight you, then slay them- but if the persecutors fight YOU then SLAY them
such is the recompense of the unbelievers.-because thats what unbelievers GET?!!?

whooOOOAAAA - someone please tell me where I read that wrong???

 

[ralphinal]

So, if one was to say that “There is no God but the Father, and Muhammed is his prophet,” there would be no trouble?

If I went into a Mosque and said this, what would happen

 

[staffsgt7]

in islam it is forbidden to kill an innocent muslim or a non-muslim, either will result in execution in shariah law. so no what you have said is a load of bull. Also suicide bombing is haram in islam charlotte-it is a minority of fanatics who carry out these disgusting acts.
I’m also dissapointed staff that you have given a link to islam review-a well know biased website against muslims.

All the verses displayed in that site have been misinterpreted and not only that-the author has cut and pasted bits from specific verses to show his view. yoel is too scared to put down the entire verse because it will go against the few words he has selected out of each verse. Charlotte, if u really want to learn what the Quran says then read it. it is a beautiful book.
not only has yoel not finished the verses he has also changed and cut out specific things out from verses such as this one:
*2.191] And kill them wherever you find them, and drive them out from whence they drove you out, and persecution is severer than slaughter, and do not fight with them at the Sacred Mosque until they fight with you in it, but if they do fight you, then slay them; such is the recompense of the unbelievers.

here the verse says before (but if they fight you…) that you should not fight them unless they attack you for verily Allah hates the ones who starts wars.

Sorry, but I have your Sharia laws right next to me. Violence can be used at any time against unbelievers (non-Muslims). The ‘call to Islam’ doesn’t even have to be done before that violence erupts and that violence can indeed include killing. There is a whole chapter on Jihad (o.9). It is even ok to kill apostates from islam (o5.4)

Please don’t start writing stuff if you are just doing taqiyya to me because I got your laws in my hot little hands. o.9 talks about who is obligated to fight, it defines making war on the Jews, Christians and others even if they chose not to accept subjugation or conversion. The arrogance of Islam to even think they should force people to accept their ideology is beyond the pale. I suppose that it is a matter of labels on what murder is in Islam just like it is with the label of pediphile. (putting the label of a wife as young as 1 year old makes it not pediphilia anymore )

As for misinterpreted, I chose not to interpret them with the definitions for words that Muslims use. I prefer the calling a ‘spade a spade’ interpretation and not some taqiyya driven definitions or redefinitions that Muslims use to justify the violence in Islam.

Your Jihadists are not misinterpreting Islam at all. They follow the Koran and Sharia laws right down to a tee. The only problem is that some of us know this and that is not a good thing so you have to start muddying the waters and making it sound like Islam doesn’t ok killing the non-Muslim.

 

[Charlotte408]

I’m still waiting for him to explain his little scripture!! the mueslim posters on this thread keep doing these little flyby drop in tidbits of info and then theyre OFF-

 

[Friar_David_O.Carm]

no it doesn’t actually-islam is very against that actually-teaching that God is all-power and all-perfect.

You are incorrect. Look at the 99 names of Allah.

These are just a few from a quick go though of the names.

• Al-Quddūs - The Most Holy, The Most Pure, The Most Perfect (Qu’ran 59:23, 62:1)
• Al-Azīz - The Almighty, The Self Sufficient, The Most Honorable (Qu’ran 3:6, 4:158, 9:40, 48:7, 59:23)
• Al-Jabbār - The Powerful, The Irresistible, The Compeller, The Most Lofty, The Restorer/Improver of Affairs (Qu’ran 59:23)
• Al-'Alīm - The All Knowing, The Omniscient (Qu’ran 2:158, 3:92, 4:35, 24:41, 33:40)

your second point is invalid as well…there ARE no satanic verses-if u interpret these verses as being satanic and evil then that is your choice but in reality they are from the one God who is all-knowing and the greatest.

Islam teaches that Satan distracted Muhammed and insterted lines into the Qu’ran.

I have studied a bit about Islam.

 

[staffsgt7]

I couldn’t say this any better than an anonymous comment on a news story.

People who say that Islam is no more of a threat than other religions are either ignorant or liars. Muslim scholars themselves say the Islam is NOT like other religions. And the reason is that Islam is a complete way of life. Islam, through Shariah law, organizes all aspects of life: personal, familial, social, civic, economic, government, judicial, military, etc – all in addition to religious life.

No other religion has anything approaching this. Furthermore, the imperialist drive to impose Islam on the entire world (Jihad!) is fundamental to Islam.

Umdat al Salik, the manual of Shariah law, says: “Jihad means to war on non-Muslims.” The Koran says: – Make war on them until idolatry shall cease and God’s religion shall reign supreme. (8:40) Muhammad said: “Fight in the name of Allah and in the way of Allah. Fight against those who disbelieve in Allah. Make a holy war, …”

No other religion promotes such violent religious bigotry or has this imperialist drive

 

[schaick]

All the things that the quran says about Jesus:
Kalimatuhu: God’s Word 3:45
Light of the World 4:174
Al-Masih: The Messiah 4.157, 171
Rahma: Mercy from God to mankind 19:21
Zakiyyan: Gift of a holy or sinless son 19:19
Salam: Peace on him 19:33
Mina al-Saliheen: Upright or righteous shall he be
Nabiyy: Prophet
Rasul: Envoy, messenger 4:157, 5:75
Ibn Maryam : son of Mary , Jesus son of Mary 3:45
Min al-muqareeab: Those who are close to God 3:45
Wadjih: worthy of esteem in this world and the next 3:45
Mubarak: Blessed, a source of benefit for others 19:31
Qawl al-haqq: Sure word 19:34
Abd Allah: Servant of God 19.30
Aya: A sign unto mankind 19:21; 3:50; 43:61
Shahid: A witness on Judgement day 4:159
Mathal: A Parable or example 43:57
IIm: Knowledge of the hour 43:61
Hikmah: Bearer of wisdom 43:63
Supported with the Holy/Sanctimonious Soul/Spirit 2:87, 2:253

BUT of course Muslims define Messiah differently then Christians do and the word is BE!

 

[staffsgt7]

You are incorrect. Look at the 99 names of Allah.

These are just a few from a quick go though of the names.

• Al-Quddūs - The Most Holy, The Most Pure, The Most Perfect (Qu’ran 59:23, 62:1)
• Al-Azīz - The Almighty, The Self Sufficient, The Most Honorable (Qu’ran 3:6, 4:158, 9:40, 48:7, 59:23)
• Al-Jabbār - The Powerful, The Irresistible, The Compeller, The Most Lofty, The Restorer/Improver of Affairs (Qu’ran 59:23)
• Al-'Alīm - The All Knowing, The Omniscient (Qu’ran 2:158, 3:92, 4:35, 24:41, 33:40)

Islam teaches that Satan distracted Muhammed and insterted lines into the Qu’ran.

I have studied a bit about Islam.

Yeah, or else Allah’s three daughters are valid and that would mean they are… what do you call a people who believe in 4 Gods? A ‘polytheist plus 1’ ideology? I don’t know what the term is.

Anyway, from faithfreedom.org I have been reading some articles about how one former Muslima said that they worship the black rock, and as we all know Mohammed and the Koran are worshipped except that they don’t like to admit to it. It is really a ‘polytheist times 2 plus 1’ ideology (7 Gods - Allah, Mohammed, the Koran, Allah’s three daughters and the black rock).

If I had to put it in the order that they revere their Gods I would put it in this order:
**1. Mohammed
2. Koran
3. Allah
4. black rock
5-6-7 Allah’s three daughters **(which are not really worshipped because these are considered the part of the Satanic verses, but if this Muslim is denying the Satanic verses - well, that puts those daughters right back in the list)

 

[staffsgt7]

All the things that the quran says about Jesus:
Kalimatuhu: God’s Word 3:45
Light of the World 4:174
Al-Masih: The Messiah 4.157, 171
Rahma: Mercy from God to mankind 19:21
Zakiyyan: Gift of a holy or sinless son 19:19
Salam: Peace on him 19:33
Mina al-Saliheen: Upright or righteous shall he be
Nabiyy: Prophet
Rasul: Envoy, messenger 4:157, 5:75
Ibn Maryam : son of Mary , Jesus son of Mary 3:45
Min al-muqareeab: Those who are close to God 3:45
Wadjih: worthy of esteem in this world and the next 3:45
Mubarak: Blessed, a source of benefit for others 19:31
Qawl al-haqq: Sure word 19:34
Abd Allah: Servant of God 19.30
Aya: A sign unto mankind 19:21; 3:50; 43:61
Shahid: A witness on Judgement day 4:159
Mathal: A Parable or example 43:57
IIm: Knowledge of the hour 43:61
Hikmah: Bearer of wisdom 43:63
Supported with the Holy/Sanctimonious Soul/Spirit 2:87, 2:253

BUT of course Muslims define Messiah differently then Christians do and the word is BE!

What are you trying to say?

The Muslims define a LOT of words differently than anyone else does, eg: innocent, war, peace, etc. there is a whole list of words they redefine.

 

[ralphinal]

All the things that the quran says about Jesus:
Kalimatuhu: God’s Word 3:45
Light of the World 4:174
Al-Masih: The Messiah 4.157, 171
Rahma: Mercy from God to mankind 19:21
Zakiyyan: Gift of a holy or sinless son 19:19
Salam: Peace on him 19:33
Mina al-Saliheen: Upright or righteous shall he be
Nabiyy: Prophet
Rasul: Envoy, messenger 4:157, 5:75
Ibn Maryam : son of Mary , Jesus son of Mary 3:45
Min al-muqareeab: Those who are close to God 3:45
Wadjih: worthy of esteem in this world and the next 3:45
Mubarak: Blessed, a source of benefit for others 19:31
Qawl al-haqq: Sure word 19:34
Abd Allah: Servant of God 19.30
Aya: A sign unto mankind 19:21; 3:50; 43:61
Shahid: A witness on Judgement day 4:159
Mathal: A Parable or example 43:57
IIm: Knowledge of the hour 43:61
Hikmah: Bearer of wisdom 43:63
Supported with the Holy/Sanctimonious Soul/Spirit 2:87, 2:253

BUT of course Muslims define Messiah differently then Christians do and the word is BE!

You left out did not die on the Cross, making everyone in the NT LIERS including Jesus and his Mother

 

[staffsgt7]

You left out did not die on the Cross, making everyone in the NT LIERS including Jesus and his Mother

OOhh, I see. :doh2:

 

[jakasaki]

All the things that the quran says about Jesus:
Kalimatuhu: God’s Word 3:45
Light of the World 4:174
Al-Masih: The Messiah 4.157, 171
Rahma: Mercy from God to mankind 19:21
Zakiyyan: Gift of a holy or sinless son 19:19
Salam: Peace on him 19:33
Mina al-Saliheen: Upright or righteous shall he be
Nabiyy: Prophet
Rasul: Envoy, messenger 4:157, 5:75
Ibn Maryam : son of Mary , Jesus son of Mary 3:45
Min al-muqareeab: Those who are close to God 3:45
Wadjih: worthy of esteem in this world and the next 3:45
Mubarak: Blessed, a source of benefit for others 19:31
Qawl al-haqq: Sure word 19:34
Abd Allah: Servant of God 19.30
Aya: A sign unto mankind 19:21; 3:50; 43:61
Shahid: A witness on Judgement day 4:159
Mathal: A Parable or example 43:57
IIm: Knowledge of the hour 43:61
Hikmah: Bearer of wisdom 43:63
Supported with the Holy/Sanctimonious Soul/Spirit 2:87, 2:253

BUT of course Muslims define Messiah differently then Christians do and the word is BE!

The koran messiah/Isa is **NOT **our Lord Jesus Christ.

You don’t list/state your religion on your profile so perhaps you can change it and let us know what you follow.

I found your post interesting. Wow… all of those names for Isa in the koran ~

Yes, I’m being sarc… And I already knew them.

He must be one special person within the koran. Amazing, Our Dear Lord, Jesus Christ.

Can you list for me the same for mohamad only based on the koran?

 

[jakasaki]

OOhh, I see. :doh2:

OK StaffSgt - the more you bang your head the more brain cells you damage…

But Ralph was replying to poster “schaick”

BTW StaffSgt, I’m just going to occupy this one moment on this thread to say thank you and to the rest of our military family for all you do!

Even though you are an Atheist, which I don’t mind and have many Atheist frinds in my life, I wish you well, and a happy holiday season.

Best regards
Pam

 

[staffsgt7]

OK StaffSgt - the more you bang your head the more brain cells you damage…

But Ralph was replying to poster “schaick”

BTW StaffSgt, I’m just going to occupy this one moment on this thread to say thank you and to the rest of our military family for all you do!

Even though you are an Atheist, which I don’t mind and have many Atheist frinds in my life, I wish you well, and a happy holiday season.

Best regards
Pam

Thank you! And to you too!!



Now, try this… say ‘shaik’ out loud to yourself. What does it sound like?

Sheik, Sheikh, or shaik!!! I would say we have a… well, you guess. no matter how one spells it - it is still the same. Maybe he is embarressed to be one.

 

[jakasaki]

Thank you! And to you too!!



Now, try this… say ‘shaik’ out loud to yourself. What does it sound like?

Sheik, Sheikh, or shaik!!! I would say we have a… well, you guess. no matter how one spells it - it is still the same.

Yes, and that is why I asked the poster to “perhaps state” his religion.