Murdering Women For “Honor”

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TarAshly:
God Bless you Deen, because he loves you more than you will ever know.

Tara
True! That’s why like thousands of people who embraced ISLAM, I am so thankful to HIM for delivering me from darkness to the LIGHT of ISLAM.

Thanks again for your sincerity. Btw, my relatives and many of my close friends are Catholics. We are all doing well! 😃

peace,

deen
 
i just had my husband skim through this forum, and after a few good chuckles and a few “thats my girl”'s he asked me to share something with you. both our faiths teach that The best of you is the one who treats your wife the best. but as a faith, Islam has lost hold of this teaching. Islam gives a mixed message. “hit your wives (even as a last resort), but treat them well.” he says that he knows he is doing Gods work whenever he makes me smile or makes me laugh, or sees the love i have for him in my eyes. he says he knows he has let God down if he ever makes me cry. he stated that he can not understand what a man gets out of seeing fear in his wifes eyes. He was not called to be a priest but to be a husband. and that is what God has asked him to do. and as a husband it is his job to “Love Honor and Cherish me” as we said in our vows 6 months ago. and that no matter who you call God, no man has the right as a human being to ever place his hands on his wife in anger or frustration no matter what, it may not be a sin against allah, but it is a sin against humanity. he just wanted me to share that with you. God Bless you, Christ be near you,

Tara and Erich
 
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deen:
Until you give us some authentic evidence from the Qur’an and Hadith that HK is allowed in Islam, all these fantastic stories mean nothing to discredit our religion. In other words, they have NO CREDIBILITY WHATSOEVER.

CNN, BBC, etc are not Islamic sources ok? 😃

peace,

deen
So now CNN, BBC etc are not sources huh? You sure were using them yourself earlier to support your claims!
 
Here is another one…Look, I live in a Catholic Christian country and I can enumerate the heinous crimes of many Christians - from killing, domestic violence, rapes, corruption and even PRIESTS SEXUALLY MOLESTING WOMEN !
Now did they get that from the Bible ? Get real people!

peace,

deen

Deen,

You also need to get real. Did the church ever commended such crimes? To the contrary, the church reaffirms its teachings that those who do such things cannot inherit the kingdom of God. If you find just even one teaching of the Catholic Church that supports those crimes that you mentioned, you are free to post them here.

On the other hand, did we ever see or hear the Islamic leaders unanimously condemn the killings of their fellows and the infidels? The other problem of Islam is they don’t have that single voice. All those muslim fanatics kill in the name of Islam, but did you hear of a true Christian believer ever say I can do evil in the name of Christ?

Pio
 
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hlgomez:
All those muslim fanatics kill in the name of Islam, but did you hear of a true Christian believer ever say I can do evil in the name of Christ?

Pio
BRAVO!!:clapping:
 
Many of my Christian brother and sisters seem to be missing Deen’s point and are not exhibiting Christian charity. I apologize on their behalf to all Muslims.

Deen has been saying that individual Muslims committ crimes and oppress women, but by doing so they are violating their own religion…she was making a point by saying that this also happens in Catholic countries.
 
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twf:
Many of my Christian brother and sisters seem to be missing Deen’s point and are not exhibiting Christian charity. I apologize on their behalf to all Muslims.

Deen has been saying that individual Muslims committ crimes and oppress women, but by doing so they are violating their own religion…she was making a point by saying that this also happens in Catholic countries.
I agree with you. We should be careful in our dialogue because sometimes we are the cause why other people get upset. I noticed that from this thread and other threads. I think this guy/gal deen is just normally reacting to what he/she feels is unacceptable behaviour.

manx
 
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hlgomez:
On the other hand, did we ever see or hear the Islamic leaders unanimously condemn the killings of their fellows and the infidels?
Hi HlGomez,

Silence does not indicate an absense of sound. Rather, that your auditory system is not picking it up.

Muslims having been speaking out against the killing of innocents for a long time now. THe media doesn’t like to publicize these things though.

islamdenouncesterrorism.com/
muhajabah.com/otherscondemn.php
islamonline.net/English/News/2004-09/26/article06.shtml
islamicity.com/articles/Articles.asp?ref=AM0109-335

For some reason, it seems to me that most Catholics rub their hands in glee if they can somehow prove that all Muslims are animals. Is this the end goal?

Munawar
 
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Munawar:
Muslims having been speaking out against the killing of innocents for a long time now.
I have several problems with this and similar claims.

1 - Various apologists for Islam say that Islam is “against the killing of innocents” but they fail to mention that Islam holds many of the victims of “honor killings” to be guilty of sins that invoke the death penalty. So it would seem that such a claim falls into the “true lie” category. They tell non-Muslims that Islam is against “killing innocents” but to fellow Muslims they nod their heads when hearing of the “sins” of the dead woman.

2 - That some apologists make this claim ignores the fact that others of the Islamic faith hold the opposite view. In fact, some Islamic clerics have issued fatwas in favor of such practices. Who is right?

3 - It seems to me that the whole issue of “honor killings” is generally perceived by Muslims as an attack on Islam. Furthermore, the issue has been largely raised by non-Muslims in Dar Al-Harb. As such, hasn’t the practice of taqiyya (sanctioned lying) been invoked? So how can I believe anything an Islamic apologist says on the matter?

4 - After 1,400 years of Islamic rule, the practice of “honor killings” not only continues in Islamic societies, it has been coded into Islamic jurisprudence. If Islam can’t abolish this horrendous practice when it has controlled the reigns for so many centuries, why should anyone expect Islam to fix it after another 1,400 years?

5 - Claims that the Qur’an “forbids the practice” have not been the reason that “honor killings” have been demonized. Rather, it has been Western horror and outside pressure that has nudged Islamic societies to begin to crack down on the practice.

6 - What constitutes “a long time now”? The links you provided don’t talk about “honor killings” per se. And the general sites have little or nothing to say on the matter. Haven’t such practices been a significant issue inside Islam only recently?
 
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fatuma:
Here is a website you might be interested in
Again, lots of nice words but no real content.

1 - They claim that HK is a distortion of Islam, but since there is no ultimate (worldly) authority in Islam, how can I know that they are right?

2 - Moreover, since the problem of HK occurs in many (indeed most) Islamic cultures, not just Arabic, doesn’t it seem more likely to be endemic to Islam and not the culture, per se?

3 - They claim that the Qur’an is explicit about the equality of men and women, but please, where is the verse that allows women to beat men (like men are allowed to beat women (Q 4:34))?

4 - The Q verse offered to support their equality of the sexes contention doesn’t actually support it, near as I can tell.

4 - After 1,400 years of Islamic rule, the practice of “honor killings” not only continues in Islamic societies, it has been coded into Islamic jurisprudence. If Islam can’t abolish this horrendous practice when it has controlled the reins for so many centuries, why should anyone expect Islam to fix it after another 1,400 years?
 
I am Somali, Somalia is 100% Muslim, we do not have honor killing as a problem, we have FMG but this is an African problem. China, has a huge *** Muslim population, they do not have honor killing they have female infanticide, which in the Quran states the men who do this will have a very special trail on the day of judgment so that they can explain their actions, they can’t so they go to Hell. The Middle East makes about 12% of the Muslim population worldwide. Trying to stick Islam in one geographical area is not going to work.

wa salam
 
HK occurs in communities that are Arabic, and Persian, and Kurd, and Turk, and Afghan, etc.

If Islam can’t or won’t outlaw “honor killings” in wholly Islamic countries, what good is it?
 
read my post, 12% sweetheart. Oh, wait that’s wrong, less than 12%

wa salam
 
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fatuma:
read my post, 12% sweetheart. Oh, wait that’s wrong, less than 12%

wa salam
Right now British authorities are investigating 117 honor killings involving Muslims.
 
Whatever, I am not going to get into a debate with you or anybody else. I simple came here to convey a message, I did that. Pick somebody else to get into a fight with, I’m not interested.

wa salam
 
Posted by gilliam:

Multan - A Pakistani poured kerosene over his sleeping wife and daughter and burned them to death in the country’s latest example of “honour killings”, said police on Monday.

Police said the 45-year-old man, named as Jalil Ahmed, snapped after his brother caught his daughter having sex with a neighbour in the remote town of Samasatta, about 105km south of the central city of Multan.

Police officer Arif Nawaz said that he rushed back from his workplace in Karachi and with the help of his brother tied the 20-year-old girl, named as Shomaila, and her mother to wooden beds as they slept.

Police said they set light to the two women - the girl for having an affair and the 40-year-old, mother Azeem Mai for “not discouraging her daughter”.

Two people confess

Police had arrested the girl’s father and uncle and efforts were under way to arrest their neighbour, who fled the town after the killing.

Police said: "We have registered a case against three persons and arrested two of them, who have confessed to the crime.

“They said they had killed them for honour.”

Officials said about 4 000 people, mostly women, had died as a result of brutal “honour punishments” in rural areas of Pakistan for the past four years.
 
Maybe I should go to CNN.com and find how many non-muslims have murdered people, for whatever reason.

Do not associate the religion of the country that a murderer lives in along with the religion of the murderer.

It is very clear that you do not have the right to kill people, and if someone is claiming that his daughter is not a virgin, then in Islam the only way to prove that is to have seen the penetration. Not a man and a woman under the sheets humping, but the penetration.

Therefore he is a murderer and insha-allah (god willing) will be sentenced to death
 
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