Music As Apologetics

[Teflon93]

I’ll take a listen when I get home…(no speakers on the ol’ work computer )

It’s a fairly cheesy organ version, unfortunately, but one can wallpaper over a Michelangelo only so much.

 

[ecsouth]

Not out of order at all—that’s what we’re discussing.

I’d agree with you but for the Pentecostals, where the emphasis on strong music programs over the years has drawn a lot of people in. My wife was in a Pentecostal choir; there are a LOT of songs about Christ’s blood washing away our sins which despite the uniformity of theme are quite interesting and diverse musically. In that case, it essentially functioned as apologetics—both in the lyrical sense and in the musical sense, the latter of which stresses the importance of feeling joyful in church.

I think I need to change my focus to really get on track with the thread here. I tend to think of apologetics as being directed outward - toward others outside one’s own faith tradition. But I can certainly see from my own experience within the Catholic Church in recent years that the Faith (as in “Deposit of Faith”) could use some “defending” within our own ranks.

Now, what about the distinction between liturgical and non-liturgical music? Maybe there isn’t much of a distinction between the two in most people’s minds but I’m inclined to think that there is a lot of good (musically as well as lyrically) music (particularly more contemptorary stuff) that nevertheless just isn’t suitable in a liturgical setting. I’m all in favor of musical diversity in general but in the liturgy … not so much.

Ed

 

[rr1213]

Well, what do you mean by “liturgical” music? Just the Sanctus, Angus Dei, Gloria, etc. or are you including hymns with that as well?

 

[rr1213]

It’s a fairly cheesy organ version, unfortunately, but one can wallpaper over a Michelangelo only so much.

Yes, I recognize the music now. Very pretty.

 

[ecsouth]

Well, what do you mean by “liturgical” music? Just the Sanctus, Angus Dei, Gloria, etc. or are you including hymns with that as well?

I meant “liturgical” in the broadest sense - any music used at any time during the course of the Mass - yes, hymns as well.
Sorry to be a stick in the mud but music lacking in (… what’s the word I’m looking for?..solemnity?.. reverence?.. decorum?) just isn’t proper (no pun intended) for the Mass but may be great for devotional, meditative, praise purposes. Music is such a broad category, I was just trying to focus in a little bit. Thanks for asking.

Ed

 

[rr1213]

I meant “liturgical” in the broadest sense - any music used at any time during the course of the Mass - yes, hymns as well.
Sorry to be a stick in the mud but music lacking in (… what’s the word I’m looking for?..solemnity?.. reverence?.. decorum?) just isn’t proper (no pun intended) for the Mass but may be great for devotional, meditative, praise purposes. Music is such a broad category, I was just trying to focus in a little bit. Thanks for asking.

Ed

I would agree. Praise music has its purposes and its advocates, but I’m not one of them.

 

[Gottle_of_Geer]

Since the Great Contarini and I have been having a bit of a side discussion in another thread on musical apologetics, I thought perhaps there would be interest in a fuller thread on the subject.

Here’s the question:

Are the various types of music employed during religious worship significant vehicles for apologetics of the worship community?

As an example, the Catholic Church warns about using hymns such as “Amazing Grace” as they may lead to doctrinal confusion. This leads one to wonder as to the doctrinal content of hymns.

So dig out the hymnals, brothers and sisters, if you’d like a bit of a diversion from the more heady discussions in defense of the faith elsewhere.

1. Some Catholic hymns about the Eucharist are misleading - because some of them express the idea that Jesus Christ is “imprisoned” in the pyx - not a good idea, but a very bad one, because untrue.​

1. Can one use hymns apologetically ? I think that doing so eviscerates them - hymns are for praising God, not for swatting our fellow-men; least of all our fellow-Christians for whom Christ has died. The same thought applies with even more force to the Bible, come to think of it.
2. Hymns can show what the Church believes - & to quote them for that purpose, is IMO allowable: it’s not quite the same as using hymns as weapons. The tone is different.

 

[rr1213]

Except my guess is that the Lutherans have used *A Mighty Fortress *as a weapon…and they’re not likely to be the only Church that has done something like this.

 

[Teflon93]

1. Can one use hymns apologetically ? I think that doing so eviscerates them - hymns are for praising God, not for swatting our fellow-men; least of all our fellow-Christians for whom Christ has died. The same thought applies with even more force to the Bible, come to think of it.
2. Hymns can show what the Church believes - & to quote them for that purpose, is IMO allowable: it’s not quite the same as using hymns as weapons. The tone is different.

Well, definition 3 is more of an accurate definition of “apologetics” than “swatting” people!