Music: "I, myself, am the bread of life"?

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I just composed this heretical hymn entitled “Sojourn”. Look for it in the upcoming GIA music issue entitled “Eat your hearts out Marty Haugen, Owen Alstott and Sr. Suzanne Toolan”😃 :rolleyes:

Save us, O Lord
Send us your power
We are your body, we are your blood
Give us the word
Tell us the story
You are the angel God sent us in love

Tell us the mys’try
We are the light
Ours is the his’try
Sung in the ni-i-i-ight

Save us, O Lord
Send us your power
We are your body, we are your blood
Give us the word
Tell us the story
You are the angel God sent us in love

Bread for our journey
Gather us in
Take from our spirits
Known from with-i-i-i-n

Save us, O Lord
Send us your power
We are your body, we are your blood
Give us the word
Tell us the story
You are the angel God sent us in love

First born, created by God
Author of all that is seen
Force of light, force of the spirit
Sing out in wisdom to all who will hear it

Save us, O Lord
Send us your power
We are your body, we are your blood
Give us the word
Tell us the story
You are the angel God sent us in love
 
JimR-OCDS said:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Conciliar
Oh really? Enlighten us as to where in the gospels we might find these words.

Quote:
**Jesus said **to them, "I am the bread of life; whoever comes to me will never hunger, and whoever believes in me will never thirst. John 6:35

Hope this helps! 🙂

Jim
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Well — it helps in verifying our Lord was speaking of Himself— and NOT in you and/or I replacing Him.
 
Walking_Home said:
Well — it helps in verifying our Lord was speaking of Himself— and NOT in you and/or I replacing Him.
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There’s a bit of confusion here in that the OP was asking about the song which proclaims “You and I are the bread of life”, but later somebody started talking about another song which just quotes Christ in “I am the bread of life”. It’s the first song that many of us have problems with.

So the real question is, where in the bible does it say that you and I are the bread of life?
 
VociMike said:
So the real question is, where in the bible does it say that you and I are the bread of life?
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It says we are the body of Christ in multiple places.

Body of Christ = Bread of Life ???

That is probably the idea of the lyrics being composed.

A stretch? maybe. I honestly don’t think it does harm. I don’t care for the song though.
 
VociMike said:
There’s a bit of confusion here in that the OP was asking about the song which proclaims “You and I are the bread of life”, but later somebody started talking about another song which just quotes Christ in “I am the bread of life”. It’s the first song that many of us have problems with.

So the real question is, where in the bible does it say that you and I are the bread of life?
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Good question.
 
agapewolf said:
It says we are the body of Christ in multiple places.

Body of Christ = Bread of Life ???

That is probably the idea of the lyrics being composed.

A stretch? maybe. I honestly don’t think it does harm. I don’t care for the song though.
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Yes, it is a big stretch. The bible says we are the body of Christ, but it never says we are the bread of life. We are the body in that we act with and for Christ, but we are not the bread. We do not give ourselves as supernatural food bringing eternal life.
 
VociMike said:
There’s a bit of confusion here in that the OP was asking about the song which proclaims “You and I are the bread of life”, but later somebody started talking about another song which just quotes Christ in “I am the bread of life”. It’s the first song that many of us have problems with.

So the real question is, where in the bible does it say that you and I are the bread of life?
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The Church is the mystical body of Christ, and as members of the Church, we are members of the body of Christ.
Mystical Body of the Church
The analogy borne by any society of men to an organism is sufficiently manifest. In every society the constituent individuals are united, as are also the members of a body, to effect a common end; while the parts they severally play correspond to the functions of the bodily organs. They form a moral unity. This, of course, is true of the Church, but the Church has also a unity of a higher order; it is not merely a moral but a mystical body. This truth, that the Church is the mystical body of Christ, all its members being guided and directed by Christ the head, is set forth by St. Paul in various passages, more especially in Ephesians 4:4-13 (cf. John 15:5-8). The doctrine may be summarized as follows:
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The members of the Church are bound together by a supernatural life communicated to them by Christ through the sacraments (ibid., 5). Christ is the centre and source of life to Whom all are united, and Who endows each one with gifts fitting him for his position in the body (ibid., 7-12). These graces, through which each is equipped for his work, form it into an organized whole, whose parts are knit together as though by a system of ligaments and joints (ibid., 16; Colossians 2:19).
Through them, too, the Church has its growth and increase, growing in extension as it spreads through the world, and intensively as the individual Christian develops in himself the likeness of Christ (ibid., 13-15).
In virtue of this union the Church is the fulness or complement (pleroma) of Christ (Ephesians 1:23). It forms one whole with Him; and the Apostle even speaks of the Church as “Christ” (1 Cor. 12:12).
This union between head and members is conserved and nourished by the Holy Eucharist. Through this sacrament our incorporation into the Body of Christ is alike outwardly symbolized and inwardly actualized; “We being many are one bread, one body; for we all partake of the one bread” (1 Cor. 10:17).
newadvent.org/cathen/10663a.htm
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Jim
 
Also;
II. THE CHURCH - BODY OF CHRIST
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The Church is communion with Jesus
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787 From the beginning, Jesus associated his disciples with his own life, revealed the mystery of the Kingdom to them, and gave them a share in his mission, joy, and sufferings.215 Jesus spoke of a still more intimate communion between him and those who would follow him: "Abide in me, and I in you. . . . I am the vine, you are the branches."216 And he proclaimed a mysterious and real communion between his own body and ours: "He who eats my flesh and drinks my blood abides in me, and I in him."217
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788 When his visible presence was taken from them, Jesus did not leave his disciples orphans. He promised to remain with them until the end of time; he sent them his Spirit.218 As a result communion with Jesus has become, in a way, more intense: "By communicating his Spirit, Christ mystically constitutes as his body those brothers of his who are called together from every nation."219
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789 The comparison of the Church with the body casts light on the intimate bond between Christ and his Church. Not only is she gathered around him; she is united in him, in his body. Three aspects of the Church as the Body of Christ are to be more specifically noted: the unity of all her members with each other as a result of their union with Christ; Christ as head of the Body; and the Church as bride of Christ.
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“One Body”
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790 Believers who respond to God’s word and become members of Christ’s Body, become intimately united with him: "In that body the life of Christ is communicated to those who believe, and who, through the sacraments, are united in a hidden and real way to Christ in his Passion and glorification."220 This is especially true of Baptism, which unites us to Christ’s death and Resurrection, and the Eucharist, by which "really sharing in the body of the Lord, . . . we are taken up into communion with him and with one another."221
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vatican.va/archive/ccc_css/archive/catechism/p123a9p2.htm
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My emphasis in bold.
Jim
 
les said:
Anyway. If anyone knows this song perhaps you could explain it to me. Am I being hard headed or am I correct?

Louie
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Your correct, for me it’s heretical, this is the only version I know on HERE.
 
JimR-OCDS said:
The Church is the mystical body of Christ, and as members of the Church, we are members of the body of Christ.
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You’re not telling us anything we all don’t already know. We know we are members of the mystical body of Christ. That doesn’t mean we literally worship each other - that alone should tell you the obvious, that the term “member of the mystical body of Christ” only goes so far and no farther.

But anyway, that’s not what the composer wrote. He applied to us a different term, one that Christ applied only to himself. The reason you keep having to post “mystical body of Christ, mystical body of Christ” is that the bible nowhere says we are also the bread of life. To keep posting “mystical body of Christ” when the topic is “bread of life” is to engage in a shell game.

Why don’t we stop beating around the bush and just sing “You and I are God”? Surely somebody could stretch the “mystical body of Christ” thing far enough to justify that as well.
 
JimR-OCDS said:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Walking_Home
Well — it helps in verifying our Lord was speaking of Himself— and NOT in you and/or I replacing Him.

Niether does the hymn refer to the self, but Jesus’ words.

Jim
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One would need a lot of contortion to make “You and I” Not mean you and I. When one uses the terms " I myself" --we are speaking of self.

I myself am the bread of life
You and I are the bread of life
Taken and blessed, broken and shared by Christ,
that the world might live
 
Wow.

How many posts later and people still don’t get it.

I mean TRULY DON’T GET IT.

The lack of understanding on this thread as to what Eucharist is astounds me.

We have several people asking where in the bible it says that we are the bread of life. Well, it doesn’t - in those words.

We DO have, however, the entire tenor of the gospel - feed the hungry, clothe the naked, proclaim release to prisoners. Hmm. Sure sounds like a way that WE manifest Christ to others by doing these things. Hmmm. You might even say - yes - that when we do those things we even figuratively become the bread of life to people - in that we are doing for them in an earthly sense what Christ did for us, namely freeing us.

Nah. It can’t be that; the song must be saying that we are the real presence, so it’s heretical. :rolleyes:
 
PaixGioiaAmor said:
Wow.

How many posts later and people still don’t get it.

I mean TRULY DON’T GET IT.

The lack of understanding on this thread as to what Eucharist is astounds me.

We have several people asking where in the bible it says that we are the bread of life. Well, it doesn’t - in those words.

We DO have, however, the entire tenor of the gospel - feed the hungry, clothe the naked, proclaim release to prisoners. Hmm. Sure sounds like a way that WE manifest Christ to others by doing these things. Hmmm. You might even say - yes - that when we do those things we even figuratively become the bread of life to people - in that we are doing for them in an earthly sense what Christ did for us, namely freeing us.

Nah. It can’t be that; the song must be saying that we are the real presence, so it’s heretical. :rolleyes:
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Are you saying that it is our job to help save the world along with Christ? My understanding is that we point people to Christ and he is the one who gives them salvation through his death and resurrection. Certainly we can and should lead others to Christ through our actions, but never, never, never, will we become the bread of life. As I and others have said, Christ said HE is the Bread of Life. When the priest consecrates the host at Mass and holds it up for all to see, that is Jesus Christ, not you, not me.

Mary
 
PaixGioiaAmor said:
Wow.

How many posts later and people still don’t get it.

I mean TRULY DON’T GET IT.

The lack of understanding on this thread as to what Eucharist is astounds me.

We have several people asking where in the bible it says that we are the bread of life. Well, it doesn’t - in those words.

We DO have, however, the entire tenor of the gospel - feed the hungry, clothe the naked, proclaim release to prisoners. Hmm. Sure sounds like a way that WE manifest Christ to others by doing these things. Hmmm. You might even say - yes - that when we do those things we even figuratively become the bread of life to people - in that we are doing for them in an earthly sense what Christ did for us, namely freeing us.

Nah. It can’t be that; the song must be saying that we are the real presence, so it’s heretical. :rolleyes:
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Ahh! What wonderful logic! A way to excuse any heresy! Let’s change the lyrics up, for a clearer illustration:

“We are of one substance with the Father. You and I are eternally begotten from Him! The Holy Spirit proceeds from Us!”

O wow! This just means that we’re supposed to act like Christ! We’re supposed to “be Him” for others. As such, this is a great way to put yourself in “His shoes”. To call ourselves Christ just makes us Christlike! 👍

I think I’ll put it in my signature: “I, DAUPHIN, AM OF ONE SUBSTANCE WITH THE FATHER”. Why would anyone have a problem with that?
 
PaixGioiaAmor said:
Wow.

How many posts later and people still don’t get it.

I mean TRULY DON’T GET IT.

The lack of understanding on this thread as to what Eucharist is astounds me.

We have several people asking where in the bible it says that we are the bread of life. Well, it doesn’t - in those words.

We DO have, however, the entire tenor of the gospel - feed the hungry, clothe the naked, proclaim release to prisoners. Hmm. Sure sounds like a way that WE manifest Christ to others by doing these things. Hmmm. You might even say - yes - that when we do those things we even figuratively become the bread of life to people - in that we are doing for them in an earthly sense what Christ did for us, namely freeing us.
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No PGA, we do get it. We’re what you might look down upon as theological elementary shoolers. 😉

You’re a music director. My hope is that you understand that the songs we sing at Mass are prayer, and that the law of prayer is the law of belief. (Lex orandi, lex credendi) The words matter. The time and place matters.

The lyrics to this song don’t present Eucharistic theology in a way that is anything close to complete enough to make it appropriate to sing, read pray, this is our body, this is our blood, as we appraoch the Blessed Sacrament. In fact, if one was to write a theological work on the Eucharist, a good deal of development would have to preceed such an allusion.
Nah. It can’t be that; the song must be saying that we are the real presence, so it’s heretical. :rolleyes:
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Not only are you a music director, you’re also one who does liturgy. You’ve already shared your opinion concerning the level of theological knowledge posessed by the people in the pews as “preschool and pedestiran.” At what point do you feel obligated to exercise your responsibility to be “bread of life” for these people? i.e. feeding them a well rounded serving of truth that might deepen their understanding. You seem to be pretty cavalier about the fate of the poor uneducated fools, PGA.

If indeed the masses are theological idiots, can you honestly say that the “prayer” in this song is an appropriate presentation of what the Church believes? Forget injecting your own superior insights into the text - we’re talking about presenting theology to “pre-schoolers.” Remember?
 
Walking_Home said:
One would need a lot of contortion to make “You and I” Not mean you and I. When one uses the terms " I myself" --we are speaking of self.

I myself am the bread of life
You and I are the bread of life
Taken and blessed, broken and shared by Christ,
that the world might live
Click to expand...
It helps if you stay with the hymn I was refering to, “I Am The Bread of Life,” not I Myself Am The Bread of Life.

Jim
 
PaixGioiaAmor said:
Wow.

How many posts later and people still don’t get it.

I mean TRULY DON’T GET IT.

The lack of understanding on this thread as to what Eucharist is astounds me.

We have several people asking where in the bible it says that we are the bread of life. Well, it doesn’t - in those words.

We DO have, however, the entire tenor of the gospel - feed the hungry, clothe the naked, proclaim release to prisoners. Hmm. Sure sounds like a way that WE manifest Christ to others by doing these things. Hmmm. You might even say - yes - that when we do those things we even figuratively become the bread of life to people - in that we are doing for them in an earthly sense what Christ did for us, namely freeing us.

Nah. It can’t be that; the song must be saying that we are the real presence, so it’s heretical. :rolleyes:
Click to expand...
We get it fine, and I couldn’t sing those words, I’d probably have to do what I never did before, get up and leave Mass.

Peter is traditionally supposed to have been crucified upside down because he considered himself unworthy to have crucified like His Saviour, then this abomination of a song were supposed to accept ?

Because that is what it is to me an abomination.
 
Mag_Uidhir said:
We get it fine, and I couldn’t sing those words, I’d probably have to do what I never did before, get up and leave Mass.

Peter is traditionally supposed to have been crucified upside down because he considered himself unworthy to have crucified like His Saviour, then this abomination of a song were supposed to accept ?

Because that is what it is to me an abomination.
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It’s an abomination to sing that as Christ transforms us through Eucharist, we transform the world doing his work as a consequence?

I sure hope not - because that’s actually what the song is saying.
 
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