Music: "I, myself, am the bread of life"?

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VociMike said:
Here is one site which supposedly has a good translation: summorumpontificum.net/ Be sure and read both the MP and the pope’s accompanying letter.

The people on the Traditional Catholic forum can probably tell you everything you want to know about it.
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This thread is not even interesting to read anymore - is this what apologetics is like?
 
gwenred said:
This thread is not even interesting to read anymore - is this what apologetics is like?
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Oh, I don’t know. I find it strangely interesting to see Catholics wanting to adopt for themselves titles which God has taken for himself alone. Maybe I’m odd that way. 🙂
 
gwenred said:
This thread is not even interesting to read anymore - is this what apologetics is like?
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Yeah, pretty much. I asked for a link to a document and VociMike provided it. 🤷 :confused:

My understanding of apologetics is that it is the defense of the our faith = church teachings= doctrines that are not open to interpretation. You can’t defend something if you don’t understand the rationale behind it.

Probably what you’re tired of is not apologetics, but rather the interpretation of subjective guidelines from church documents that vary with the opinion of whoever is reading it.
 
VAC said:
Yeah, pretty much. I asked for a link to a document and VociMike provided it. 🤷 :confused:

My understanding of apologetics is that it is the defense of the our faith = church teachings= doctrines that are not open to interpretation. You can’t defend something if you don’t understand the rationale behind it.

Probably what you’re tired of is not apologetics, but rather the interpretation of subjective guidelines from church documents that vary with the opinion of whoever is reading it.
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👍 Exactly. However, I did open up the box one more time, now didn’t I? :o
 
VociMike said:
Here is one site which supposedly has a good translation: summorumpontificum.net/ Be sure and read both the MP and the pope’s accompanying letter.

The people on the Traditional Catholic forum can probably tell you everything you want to know about it.
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Well, that was facinating reading. Thanks for sharing the link.🙂

However, I’m not quite sure how permission *to *and guidelines *for *celebrating the mass in Latin relate to the discussion of the lyrics of “I myself am the bread of life”🤷 :confused:
 
VAC said:
Well, that was facinating reading. Thanks for sharing the link.🙂

However, I’m not quite sure how permission *to *and guidelines *for *celebrating the mass in Latin relate to the discussion of the lyrics of “I myself am the bread of life”🤷 :confused:
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Could be that heretical hymns will not be allowed in the Extraordinary Form.
 
30miller said:
I totally agree! This hymn is just the tip of the iceberg, of course. An example - just this week I sent an email to my own pastor asking him why it is that we chose to sing the famous Shaker hymn “The Dance” at last Sunday’s liturgy. Of course, it’s in our parish purchased GIA hymn book printed with the “…approval of the Committee on the Liturgy, USCCB…” - with whatever “authority” it is that that subgroup is supposed to wield. (Some of you know this tune with other similar lyrics as “The Lord of the Dance”).
I pointed out to my pastor that it was the Shakers who recognized that the second coming of “the Christ” has already happened - in the form of their “Mother Ann” 200 years ago. (Jesus had only been the “masculine” coming of “the Christ”, of course). So, of course, my question to him was exactly why St. Mary’s Catholic Church sang their song at last Sunday’s 9:00 liturgy. Awaiting his response.
September 14 can’t come soon enough! (Of course, we’ve yet to see what the American Bishops with that as well).
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Well hello from Ireland for starters, oh only 200 years, I must say youve lost me the rest…Oh ! the masculine coming of Christ ? so what was He before, a woman ? I know my question isnt directed at you .
 
bakhita said:
George Weigl wrote a column about “heretical hymns” that I found online—he says in part:

**Next to go should be those “We are Jesus” hymns in which the congregation (for the first time in two millennia of Christian hymnology) pretends that it’s Christ. “Love one another as I have loved you/Care for each other, I have cared for you/Bear each other’s burdens, bind each other’s wounds/and so you will know my return.” Who’s praying to whom here? And is the Lord’s “return” to be confined to our doing of his will? St. John didn’t think so. “Be Not Afraid” and “You Are Mine” fit this category, as does the ubiquitous “I Am the Bread of Life,” to which I was recently subjected on, of all days, Corpus Christi – the one day in the Church year completely devoted to the fact that we are not a self-feeding community giving each other “the bread of life” but a Eucharistic people nourished by the Lord’s free gift of himself. “I am the bread of life” inverts that entire imagery, indeed falsifies it. **
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I’m wondering if some of these songs (“I am the Bread of Life,” for instance) are actually guilty of the “We Are Jesus” charge? Certainly the congregation is singing the words, but they’re **quoting **(well, at least paraphrasing) Jesus. This song doesn’t seem to be proclaiming a “Christ in us” or “we are Christ” agenda, as “I, Myself, Am the Bread of Life” does. I always thought that in the former song, it was clear that we were giving voice to what CHRIST said. I agree that the latter song is heresy or at least seems to verge on heresy.
 
JKirkLVNV said:
I’m wondering if some of these songs (“I am the Bread of Life,” for instance) are actually guilty of the “We Are Jesus” charge? Certainly the congregation is singing the words, but they’re **quoting **(well, at least paraphrasing) Jesus. This song doesn’t seem to be proclaiming a “Christ in us” or “we are Christ” agenda, as “I, Myself, Am the Bread of Life” does. I always thought that in the former song, it was clear that we were giving voice to what CHRIST said. I agree that the latter song is heresy or at least seems to verge on heresy.
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Anyway, we aren’t the bread of life, my neighbour isn’t the bread of life, my granny isn’t the bread, my aunt, my uncle, my pet dog patch ???

So we don’t need no side roads, as satan thinks we do into thinking that “WE” are the bread of life, because we simply didn’t die at Calvary, Jesus did.

But I know where those people are coming from, " We are brothers and sisters in Jesus Christ, but that is where we draw the line,** we did not die for anyone,** but that doesn’t stop us from being the hands and feet of Jesus.
 
Mag_Uidhir said:
Anyway, we aren’t the bread of life, my neighbour isn’t the bread of life, my granny isn’t the bread, my aunt, my uncle, my pet dog patch ???

So we don’t need no side roads, as satan thinks we do into thinking that “WE” are the bread of life, because we simply didn’t die at Calvary, Jesus did.

But I know where those people are coming from, " We are brothers and sisters in Jesus Christ, but that is where we draw the line,** we did not die for anyone,** but that doesn’t stop us from being the hands and feet of Jesus.
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Yes, I understand that “we” aren’t the Bread of Life. My point is I don’t think that’s what “I Am the Bread of Life” is saying. I think it’s quoting Jesus, not alledging that “we” or “I” am the bread of life.
 
Another Clarification:

“I am the bread of life” is a different song than

“I myself am the bread of life”

I am the bread of life is pretty much direct scripture quotes,…mostly quoting CHrist’s words

I myself am the bread of life is the one referred to by the OP…
 
agapewolf said:
Another Clarification:

“I am the bread of life” is a different song than

“I myself am the bread of life”

I am the bread of life is pretty much direct scripture quotes,…mostly quoting CHrist’s words

I myself am the bread of life is the one referred to by the OP…
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Exactly. John Michael Talbot has a song of about the same title, but when he sings it, it’s clear that it’s in the voice of Christ, quoting Christ, not John Michael Talbot stating that HE is the Bread of Life. It’s almost a direct quotation of Scripture.
 
Um, there wouldn’t be a clarification about the songs written in 1970 or after in scripture.

I was clarifying that there are 2 different songs…

Read it again. I wasn’t saying that “I myself am the bread of life” is a good song.

why in the world are you responding to my post? this doesn’t make sense.

I was just clarifying that there are 2 different songs being confused here.

and “I am the bread of life” is IN scripture. Read John 6
 
agapewolf said:
Um, there wouldn’t be a clarification about the songs written in 1970 or after in scripture.

I was clarifying that there are 2 different songs…

Read it again. I wasn’t saying that “I myself am the bread of life” is a good song.

why in the world are you responding to my post? this doesn’t make sense.

I was just clarifying that there are 2 different songs being confused here.

and “I am the bread of life” is IN scripture. Read John 6
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To affirm your point:
“I Myself Am The Bread of Life” is the heretical song - it was written by Rory Cooney.
“I Am The Bread of Life” basically is direct words of Christ from John 6 - with us speaking (singing) the words - it was written by Suzzane Toolan. We sing the words in the 1st person just as we read them in John 6. It’s hard to nitpick about that, I think.
 
I didn’t say I thought it was heretical, nor did I say I think it is good.

but yes, 2 different songs.
 
I understand that, and I’m not arguing with you on that point.

You just said earlier that you were affirming my point with yours, and I didn’t want to be misquoted. That’s all.
 
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