Music in the new translation of the Mass

[YoungTradCath]

As hinted above, I think that this new generation of very zealous and fervent seminarians will change the outlook on the mass. At a first glance, I am opposed to making a mortal sin any meddling with the rubrics. That sort of reverence and longing to example a good and wholesome priest or bishop for the sake of the congregation(s) needs to rest on the shoulders of the priest or bishop himself-- not on liturgical disciplines. If a priest won’t follow the rubric now, why would he follow it when there is a penalty of mortal sin? You can only guess that his mentality would be constant, “I’ll do what I please,” and the Church would be more prone to scandal and quarrel between priests and bishops. On the other hand, upholding priests and bishops to that sort of discipline is very much within the job description. I’m torn on the subject, really.

Why are you opposed to that? I really don’t understand. It is a sacred sacrifice, and I really cannot comprehend a world where not following rubrics and not saying the right words isn’t a mortal sin, even though that is our world right now. Yes, it’s wonderful to think that we’re going to have good and wholesome priests and bishops just because they are priests and bishops, but we’re not a utopian world. We’re a sinning, imperfect world that needs rules that see into that and into the future.

He would follow rubrics and the words if it was a mortal sin to otherwise. I can’t imagine a priest or bishop who would want to sin mortally. A little cheesy, but, I mean, I bet there are plenty of priests (just going out on a limb) who would sometimes like to have sex with a woman, but they don’t anyways because it’s a mortal sin for them to do so.

 

[Anthony_V]

Why are you opposed to that? I really don’t understand. It is a sacred sacrifice, and I really cannot comprehend a world where not following rubrics and not saying the right words isn’t a mortal sin, even though that is our world right now. Yes, it’s wonderful to think that we’re going to have good and wholesome priests and bishops just because they are priests and bishops, but we’re not a utopian world. We’re a sinning, imperfect world that needs rules that see into that and into the future.

He would follow rubrics and the words if it was a mortal sin to otherwise. I can’t imagine a priest or bishop who would want to sin mortally. A little cheesy, but, I mean, I bet there are plenty of priests (just going out on a limb) who would sometimes like to have sex with a woman, but they don’t anyways because it’s a mortal sin for them to do so.

I suppose you’re right in that regards (pretending that the world of the ordained is a utopia). But what of the priests who do not recognize the penalty of mortal sin in liturgical discipline as much as they didn’t recognize the importance of the GIRM in the first place? It seems we’d end up with a handful who claim to be in communion with Rome, but don’t follow her disciplines. Now, I’m not saying that we* shouldn’t* deal with these priests or bishops, I’m saying that we should find a more thorough way of dealing with them. Slapping a penalty on the table would only be effective to those who treated the mass with integrity in the first place.

 

[YoungTradCath]

I suppose you’re right in that regards (pretending that the world of the ordained is a utopia). But what of the priests who do not recognize the penalty of mortal sin in liturgical discipline as much as they didn’t recognize the importance of the GIRM in the first place? It seems we’d end up with a handful who claim to be in communion with Rome, but don’t follow her disciplines. Now, I’m not saying that we* shouldn’t* deal with these priests or bishops, I’m saying that we should find a more thorough way of dealing with them. Slapping a penalty on the table would only be effective to those who treated the mass with integrity in the first place.

I dunno. I believe even the most liturgically wishy-washy priests are generally good men who want what they perceive is best for the Church. If the Church sincerely applied the penalty of mortal sin to perverting the integrity of mass, I would hope that most priests would comply. It might take a bit of “generational grandfathering,” so to speak, but I think it would work. That seems morbid, but, meh. I mean, honestly, how was it done for 400 years?

The GIRM is at least very ambiguous. I think it was intended to be written that way. Well no, it was. Everyone knows that. “General” Instruction of the Roman Missal leads some people to believe, I guess, that even when they have all the liturgical implements necessary to have a rubrically perfect mass, they get to treat it like an art project. I believe many people use that word as an excuse. The GIRM isn’t so much an instruction manual as it is a “We hope you do this, pretty please, even though we know you won’t anyways [fingers crossed]” get out of jail free card. That’s my opinion. I fully believe that if things were really cut and dry, nobody would be able to find a way through it and would just follow it. Giving in to it inflames the matter.

Replacing cut and dry, exacting rubrics and De defectibus with something like the GIRM is more than a little questionable, in my opinion. But, no more derailing.

 

[pnewton]

Well, mostly. In one of the OCP glorias, there’s an added phrase. Well, it’s actually a tricky repition with “and on earth peace to people of good will” and they end up inserting “peace on earth” by cleverly combining repeated words with the musical phrases…while it may be technically licit, if you hear it, you’d swear they just added the phrase.

I dropped the MOC about ten years ago, when I realized what was going on. I had only been doing the music for a little while and didn’t know better. Still, others sing it at my parish, it is well-known, and the other parishes around are using MOC. That is why I thought it would be easier to go back to that. When listening, I discarded all settings that added anything (precious few, this time), or repeated any phrases. I need to do something easy to get the new words down pat. Next year we will add a new setting, I think. Our other setting, which I hope to expand in Lent, is Jubilate Dei. We just learned that last year.

PS - We already have one Mass in Latin every week. Sometime the priest expands this in Lent. We also have started a small chant group. I just say that because while I always give the needs of my parish highest priority, I do like all music and believe am trying to restore an appreciation of Gregorian Chant. It is a work of years. Until then, old hymns remain my favorite music for Mass.

 

[TheMc]

I dropped the MOC about ten years ago, when I realized what was going on. I had only been doing the music for a little while and didn’t know better. Still, others sing it at my parish, it is well-known, and the other parishes around are using MOC. That is why I thought it would be easier to go back to that. When listening, I discarded all settings that added anything (precious few, this time), or repeated any phrases. I need to do something easy to get the new words down pat. Next year we will add a new setting, I think. Our other setting, which I hope to expand in Lent, is Jubilate Dei. We just learned that last year.

PS - We already have one Mass in Latin every week. Sometime the priest expands this in Lent. We also have started a small chant group. I just say that because while I always give the needs of my parish highest priority, I do like all music and believe am trying to restore an appreciation of Gregorian Chant. It is a work of years. Until then, old hymns remain my favorite music for Mass.

Congrats on the music at your parish!