Muslim allegiance to violence.. ?

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youtube.com/watch?v=MWzbWInnGx0&NR=1

This learned Muslim says he cannot condemn the violence and words of Al Qaeda because they are his muslim brothers.

He a Muslim living in Britain but he cannot condemn the terror attacks in London because the people killed and wounded were not Muslim, thus they were “not innocent” but deserve punishment.

I’d like to hear Muslims on these threads oppinion about this man. Do you agree or not agree?
 
Vickie, this one is for you…

The woman is a hero who is fighting for the rights of Muslim women … and with every thing she has seen, her anger is very understandable.

youtube.com/watch?v=VMS0YexWBTk&feature=related

Ps… I really like the Arab language… only it’s sad all the things that are being said…
 
GraceDK said:
youtube.com/watch?v=MWzbWInnGx0&NR=1

This learned Muslim says he cannot condemn the violence and words of Al Qaeda because they are his muslim brothers.

He a Muslim living in Britain but he cannot condemn the terror attacks in London because the people killed and wounded were not Muslim, thus they were “not innocent” but deserve punishment.

I’d like to hear Muslims on these threads oppinion about this man. Do you agree or not agree?
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i didn’t saw it yet
but i disagree with him

by the way , what do you mean by " learned muslim" ?
 
Anjem Choudary is not a learned Muslim. He is a spiteful little man with no Islamic qualifications who drank and smoked, abused drugs and women up until 9/11.
 
** In the name of Allah , the Most Gracious , Ever Merciful **

http://theislampath.com/smf/Smileys/default/salam.gif
GraceDK said:
youtube.com/watch?v=MWzbWInnGx0&NR=1

This learned Muslim says he cannot condemn the violence and words of Al Qaeda because they are his muslim brothers.
Click to expand...
O you who believe!

Stand out firmly for justice, as witnesses to Allah, even though it be against yourselves, or your parents, or your kin, be he rich or poor, Allah is a Better Protector to both (than you). So follow not the lusts (of your hearts), lest you may avoid justice, and if you distort your witness or refuse to give it, verily, Allah is Ever WellAcquainted with what you do.

( سورة النساء , An-Nisa, Chapter #4, Verse #135)
 
elwill said:
i didn’t saw it yet
but i disagree with him

by the way , what do you mean by " learned muslim" ?
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He appears as an imam, or at least a learned Muslim due to his outfit and the fact he is interviewed in British media. At any rate he appears as the leader of a islamic group.
I hope you disagree with him because what he is saying is so horrible and lacks all reason.

By the way Elwill. Is there are a reason why you did not look at the clips? I also urge you to see the one in my 2 post here on this thread. This is an Arab Muslim who is speaking… she is critizising the sharia law because it is inhuman. She is very frustrated… I understand her.

Again, I am glad you are here because you are willing to discuss these matters in a calm and rational way. Also I want to say I have not overlooked your post on the other thread… its important and I will get back to it. I will probably start a new thread with it though, because that thread is over 40 pages long already… 🙂

Lastly Elwill, I would like you to know something about my motives for these discussions with you. Jesus said: “But to you who hear me:
Love your enemies, be good to those who hate you, bless those who curse you, pray for those who maltreat you. If anyone hits you on one cheek, turn also the other, if someone takes your jacket, then let him also have your tunic. Treat people the way you would like them to treat you. If you only love those who love you, then you deserve no praise. Also the sinners only love those who love them… But LOVE your enemies. And do not jugde ,lest you be judged.
Happy are you who are not scandalised at Me.
Do not be afraid. Go in peace.” Luke 6-8.

My goal is for you to have the joy and freedom that I and my brothers have. To know God and see Him, touch Him. We trust Him because His goodness surpasses anything that humans could have imagined. We are free because He has forgiven us our sins and He has taught us love. Yes, Love… Love teaches us everything. Where there is no love… there is no truth.
Whom the Son sets free, is free indeed. I testify that this is true in my own life 🙂

Have you read the New Testament, Elwill?
Peace be on you and your house… and sorry it got a bit long… 👍
 
GraceDK said:
Lastly Elwill, I would like you to know something about my motives for these discussions with you. Jesus said: “But to you who hear me:
Love your enemies, be good to those who hate you, bless those who curse you, pray for those who maltreat you. If anyone hits you on one cheek, turn also the other, if someone takes your jacket, then let him also have your tunic. Treat people the way you would like them to treat you. If you only love those who love you, then you deserve no praise. Also the sinners only love those who love them… But LOVE your enemies. And do not jugde ,lest you be judged.
Happy are you who are not scandalised at Me.
Do not be afraid. Go in peace.” Luke 6-8.
Click to expand...
Grace, and here is why I said I enjoy your posts. I think I am one who was meant to read this. 😉
 
Muslim_Woman said:
** In the name of Allah , the Most Gracious , Ever Merciful **

http://theislampath.com/smf/Smileys/default/salam.gif

O you who believe!

**Stand out firmly for justice …

( سورة النساء , An-Nisa, Chapter #4, Verse #135)**

The question is, Muslim Woman, what justice is it that your god promotes? In the eyes of Christianity your god judges himself by contradicting the Law of Love and Mercy that Christ sent to His People. Your god has made a new slavery and there is no justice in a lie because justice and truth goes together.

God cannot contradict himself. He sent us the Holy Books of the Old and New Testament and Jesus Christ. I urge you to investigate the claim that you have been fed, namely that these Scriptures were corrupted… this claim is absurd as any seriously seeking Muslim can testify to, if he dares to really look into the historical and scientific facts.

Do not live a lie, Muslim Woman…You are so precious to God… Think about how much effort you put into religion… how much you want to follow it. Then let it be the Truth you follow… do not waste your life following a false spirit.

Peace.
Click to expand...
 
GraceDK said:
He appears as an imam, or at least a learned Muslim due to his outfit and the fact he is interviewed in British media.
Click to expand...
I can assure you he is not an imam, nor a mainstream scholar. He was one of the men shouting for the Pope’s execution etc.

As far as I am aware he has no particular Qur’anic training.
 
GodIsGracious said:
Grace, and here is why I said I enjoy your posts. I think I am one who was meant to read this. 😉
Click to expand...
God bless you dear brother. I also have a Scripture for you:
( sorry but… **I am so in love with the Bible **! 🙂 )

And He who sits on the Throne said:

“See I make all things new!” And He said: “Write, because these words are True and worthy to be believed”. And He said to me: “It has happend. I am the Alfa and the Omega, the Beginning and the End. The one who thirsts I will give him to drink, for free, from the Well with the water of Life”
  • Jesus in Revelation to John.
That means brother… there is a refreshing drink for you from the Living Water:) And drink well, so you have the strength to love and serve like He has loved and served us.

He loves you SO much… He is the Lamb and the Shepherd, the Light who lifts up the brokenhearted and places him on his feet… He restores us.

Your name is engraved in the palm of His hand… there He has written it down because He loved you from all eternity. Don’t ever forget this.

Peace and thank you… :heaven::grouphug:
 
GraceDK said:
God bless you dear brother. I also have a Scripture for you:
( sorry but… **I am so in love with the Bible **! 🙂 )

And He who sits on the Throne said:

“See I make all things new!” And He said: “Write, because these words are True and worthy to be believed”. And He said to me: “It has happend. I am the Alfa and the Omega, the Beginning and the End. The one who thirsts I will give him to drink, for free, from the Well with the water of Life”
  • Jesus in Revelation to John.
That means brother… there is a refreshing drink for you from the Living Water:) And drink well, so you have the strength to love and serve like He has loved and served us.

He loves you SO much… He is the Lamb and the Shepherd, the Light who lifts up the brokenhearted and places him on his feet… He restores us.

Your name is engraved in the palm of His hand… there He has written it down because He loved you from all eternity. Don’t ever forget this.

Peace and thank you… :heaven::grouphug:
Click to expand...
Thank you!

Psst: I am a “sister.” 😉 I know I have not revealed my gender so I thought I’d do so now.
 
I can tell you the same , right ? Don’t worship creations of God & save yourself from fire
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And by saying “Allahhuakbar” while burning churches and killing the infidel, you’re save from the wrath of God?

:bigyikes:
 
** In the name of Allah , the Most Gracious , Ever Merciful **

http://theislampath.com/smf/Smileys/default/salam.gif
seraphime2008 said:
And by saying “Allahhuakbar” while burning churches and killing the infidel, you’re save from the wrath of God?

:bigyikes:
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nope. buring Churches is not allowed in Islam ; also kiling any inccocent person means inviting hellfire.

Allah forbids you not, with regard to those who fight you not for (your) Faith nor drive you out of your homes, from dealing kindly and justly with them: for Allah loveth those who are just. Allah only forbids you, with regard to those who fight you for (your) Faith, and drive you out of your homes, and support (others) in driving you out, from turning to them (for friendship and protection). It is such as turn to them (in these circumstances), that do wrong.] (Al-Mumtahinah 60: 8- 9)
 
Muslim_Woman said:
nope. buring Churches is not allowed in Islam ; also kiling any inccocent person means inviting hellfire.
Click to expand...
Muslim Woman, this is not an attempt to start an argument (rather, I am on your side here, strange as that may seem :)) but can you clarify exactly who Islam calls innocent? Is it just Muslims as Choudary states in the video?
 
nope. buring Churches is not allowed in Islam ; also kiling any inccocent person means inviting hellfire.
Click to expand...
Allah forbids you not, with regard to those who fight you not for (your) Faith nor drive you out of your homes, from dealing kindly and justly with them: for Allah loveth those who are just. Allah only forbids you, with regard to those who fight you for (your) Faith, and drive you out of your homes, and support (others) in driving you out, from turning to them (for friendship and protection). It is such as turn to them (in these circumstances), that do wrong.] (Al-Mumtahinah 60: 8- 9)
Click to expand...
Dear Muslim woman,
I can see that your conscience will lead you to this too, without considering what Koran tells you. Society in general in order to survive will tell you this too no matter what their background. I can see that Muslims when they are only performing their five pillars, will not harm other people. Most Muslim friends I have will of course operate mostly on their own inherited undeniably some moral compass too within their own hearts. But if they become more involved with Koran, and take them as the definite truth, they will think that any other people are “the infidel”, “the other”, “the kuffar”, “the one that God will punish in hell”, and they could initiate acts as if they were the “security” guy on behalf of Allah and punish them.

There are other quotes from Koran that tells you exactly the opposite of what you put here.
 
Muslim_Woman said:
** In the name of Allah , the Most Gracious , Ever Merciful **

http://theislampath.com/smf/Smileys/default/salam.gif

O you who believe!

Stand out firmly for justice, as witnesses to Allah, even though it be against yourselves, or your parents, or your kin, be he rich or poor, Allah is a Better Protector to both (than you). So follow not the lusts (of your hearts), lest you may avoid justice, and if you distort your witness or refuse to give it, verily, Allah is Ever WellAcquainted with what you do.

( سورة النساء , An-Nisa, Chapter #4, Verse #135)
Click to expand...
Do you condemn the violence against non-Muslims?
 
Muslim_Woman said:
** In the name of Allah , the Most Gracious , Ever Merciful **

http://theislampath.com/smf/Smileys/default/salam.gif

I can tell you the same , right ? 🙂 Don’t worship creations of God & save yourself from fire 😃
Click to expand...
Two fallacies here:

I don’t worship a creature of God. Neither do I attribute such honour to any created being as you do to the sinner Muhammad.
The God I believe in is One and Uncreated.

Secondly. I cannot save my self from the fire. But God through the atoning sacrifice of Jesus Christ has already saved me and will save me. Only through Him can anyone be saved. He has payed for your sins too because He loved you from the beginning and did not want you to die in your sins - its namely written that all sin leads to death… Yet if you accept the Saviour you will have salvation. You cannot save your self.

In Christ we have peace, because He has overcome the world. Unless you turn to Him you will perish in your sins, because you cannot make your self just in the eyes of God.

Peace. And by the way. The fire I suffer is the fire of Love, urging me to tell you about how all of Scripture was fulfilled in Christ and how He wants you to be with Him in eternity… not in a haram of raisins or virgins, but in the True Heaven in His Near Presense.
 
GraceDK said:
Vickie, this one is for you…

The woman is a hero who is fighting for the rights of Muslim women … and with every thing she has seen, her anger is very understandable.

youtube.com/watch?v=VMS0YexWBTk&feature=related

Ps… I really like the Arab language… only it’s sad all the things that are being said…
Click to expand...
Thanks, Grace! A very telling and interesting video.This is indeed a very courageous woman who is not afraid to speak her mind even though branded as a heretic. May God help her!

But where are the Muslim replies to both these videos? Why is it than whenever confronted by undesirable things connected to Islam, they never have anything to say and just continue to look the other way?

Vickie
 
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