Muslims And Allah

[Benjamin8o8]

Of course not, he was reminding the Jews who crucified him about that prophecy in Psalm 22 and how its being fulfilled.

I don`t think HE uttered HIS cry just to remind them, but I do get your point. Thanks for answering

 

[Bill_Pick]

Mr. Bill Pick - I’m sorry if your thread has taken a different direction, and since you are the starter of this and I believe somehow we are getting “off track” here, I will back off and not post any further… I shall await for you reply, meanwhile I will continue…

Yes, Ishmael is the son of Abraham - agreed.

And I don’t believe the Hebrew Bible needs to solve any contradictions because there aren’t any…

Curiuos Meedo - do you ever question anything, research an assortment of sites outside of islamic sites, analyze and form a clear understanding of what you are questioning?

Anyway, since arabs are descendands of Ishmael what are your historical proof traces? Please provide a back up of your statement because this is what history was recorded from historical Hebrew and Biblical accounts.

According to alleged, UNSUBSTANTIATED and totally FABRICATED Arab ‘traditions’ and contrary to the original stories from the Biblical records, Ishmael is their ‘father’ just as Isaac was the ‘father’ of the Israelites.

From this very outset, the above so called ‘traditions’ did not exist in the mind of the Pagan Arabians prior to their ‘revelation’ in mohamads Quran.

There are two versions of the story of Ishmael, one - that of the ORIGINAL in the Bible and the other that of the Quran to compare and contrast.

According to the Bible, Abraham was of the Hebrew Ibri tribe. The Hebrews were one among hundreds of Semitic tribes that lived in the land of what is now called Iraq.

Abraham, was ordered by God to leave the land of his nativity and go to another and that God, would direct him to. This other land was the land of Canaan -

If you want refer to Genesis 12:1 through 5 - I’m trying not to clutter up the reply…

If historians are correct in surmising that the Semitic tribes of Iraq & Syria originated from Arabia, then the Hebrews were one of these tribes. If this were the case, then Abraham and Ishmael cannot ALSO be the progenitors of the Arabs from whom they originated.

According to the unsubstantiated Arab ‘traditions’, Abraham journied with the ‘baby’ Ishmael and his mother Hagar to the valley of Mecca and together later on raised the Foundations of the Ka’ba.

I will not quote the koran verses but I’m sure you know which ones they are… again… not to clutter the reply…

I’m sure you must know Abdullah Yusuf Ali - he is a famous islamic school and you can take your time and read his work.

The ‘facts’ reside within the Quran which asserts in several verses that neither Muhammad nor the Pagan Arabs had any KNOWLEDGE of the PREVIOUS REVELATIONS.

The Quranic word Ummi is deliberately mis-interpreted as “Illiterate” by the Sunni (Orthodox) Muhammadans. Critical scholars Tabari in his Tafsir point out that this curious adjective is invariably used in the Quran in contradistinction and/or in apposition to the People of the Book/ Ahl al Kitab as in
Suras 2:78; 3:20,75; 7:157; 62:2 and should therefore be taken to mean one IGNORANT of Holy Scriptures and/or the EARLIER REVEALED RELIGIONS; that is, unscriptured.

36: 6 In order that thou mayest admonish a people whose fathers had received no admonition and who therefore remain heedless (of the Signs of Allah).

The Quraish had received no prophet before, and therefore one of themselves was made the vehicle for the universal Message to the whole world.

You may also read : 42:52 and 62:2 stating the ignoranace of previous revelations.

For the above, 42:52 and 62.=:2the koran indicates that the pagan Arabs and mohamad were ignorant of previous revlations prior to itself.

I have more to add but I fear my reply will go on deaf ears and will only occupy space on CAF’s database…

Hi and please keep on posting BTW you are doing a good job keep it up and may Our Lord bless You

 

[jakasaki]

Hi and please keep on posting BTW you are doing a good job keep it up and may Our Lord bless You

Thank you kindly sir, but I doubt it’s been read at all with an open mind…

I have more to contribute, but it’s getting late here in New York and my eyes are “bug eyes” by now. plus I’ve been participating in other boards and as you can guess… It’s exhausting…!!!

Nice to see you back on the forum… You’ve been absent for a while…

Best regards,
Pam
New York

 

[Cluny]

We beleive Jesus (pbuh) did not die on the Cross . It does not matter if he uttered the word Allah in his lifetime in this world , he worshipped Allah , prayed to Allah …that’s for sure

That’s one proof that Moslems don’t believe in the real Jesus.

They believe in a demon the call “Jesus.”

And unless the repent and turn to the real Lord, God, and Saviour Jesus Christ, they will perish in eternal flames with their precious Mohammed.

 

[Sam_777]

I don`t think HE uttered HIS cry just to remind them, but I do get your point. Thanks for answering

Since I’m learning, what other possibility might be?

PS., sorry for the HE part.

 

[Muslim_Woman]

In the name of Allah , Most Gracious, Most Merciful

Salaam/peace

… unless the repent and turn to the real Lord, God, and Saviour Jesus Christ, they will perish in eternal flames with their precious Mohammed.

Jews don’t believe in Jesus (pbuh). So , Christians loving Prince will fry both the Jews & Muslims in the same hell or there is different different hell for us ?

 

[Sister_Amy]

Muslims believe the word Allah was used by Jesus when he hung on the cross. The Bible records that Jesus said “Eli Eli lama sabachthani”, but you say Jesus really cried out to Allah and said “Allah, Allah lama sabachthani” My question is: Would you please explain why you would use this argument when you don’t believe Jesus ever hung on the cross? And second, since Jesus was quoting Ps 22:1 on the cross, isn’t rather unlikely that both the Hebrew Old Testament and the Greek New Testament are wrong using Eli, a Hebrew word, rather than Allah, an arab word?

It is a very very very weak argument for a Muslim to use if he simultaneously says that Jesus wasn’t crucified but when he hung on the cross he called out to Allah.

That is precisely why I would never use that argument. (Those who do use it haven’t thought it through to conclusion or used it in debate against an informed Christian–by informed, I mean a Christian who knows what the Qur’an says about the crucifixion.)

However, what should also be understood is that the Gospel accounts are not necessarily eyewitness accounts–they all describe something different being said on the cross. Rather the point is that the writers of the Gospel understood the use of Aramaic language in calling out for God. And that’s where the words that Jesus allegedly said on the cross might be useful in argument, even for someone who didn’t believe Jesus was ever on the cross–just because it’s the words that someone attributed to him.