Muslims, Jesus, and Alcohol

[FaithofAbraham]

*O you who believe! Strong drink, gambling, idolatry and (divination by) arrows are an abomination of Satan’s handiwork; shun such (things) so that you may prosper. *(5:90)

I don’t see how you honestly interpret that as being anything other but an absolute prohibition.

Like I said most people are going to get drunk if they mess with it long enough, so it is better not to. But if you must drink it and you don’t get drunk with it, like if wine is all there is to drink and you are dying of thirst, then it’s not prohibited

Same with pork, you can eat it if that’s all there is to eat and you might otherwise starve if you don’t.

 

[tawheedah]

I know that Islam bans alcohol, and I know that Muslims believe in Jesus. So what do Muslims think about Jesus drinking alcohol? Do Muslims acknowledge that Jesus does drink alcohol?

Alcohol was not always haram. In the beginning when Islam was revealed to Prophet Muhammad SAWD, alcohol was not haram, but then there were some of the arab Muslims coming to prayer drunk, and this was a problem… and then the verse was revealed prohibiting alcohol.

*Hadith - Abu Dawood, Narrated Umar ibn al-Khattab

When the prohibition of wine (was yet to be) declared, Umar said: O Allah, give us a satisfactory explanation about wine. So the following verse of Surat al-Baqarah revealed; “They ask thee concerning wine and gambling. Say: In them is great sin…” Umar was then called and it was recited to him. He said: O Allah, give us a satisfactory explanation about wine. Then the following verse of Surat an-Nisa’ was revealed: “O ye who believe! approach not prayers with a mind befogged…” Thereafter the herald of the Apostle of Allah would call when the (congregational) prayer was performed: Beware, one who is drunk should not come to prayer. Umar was again called and it was recited to him. He said: O Allah, give us a satisfactory explanation about wine. This verse was revealed: “Will ye not then abstain?” Umar said: We abstained. *

As far as Jesus (pbuh), there is no mention of him drinking wine in the Quran. Not much of Jesus’s life was discussed in the Quran. Since it is not mentioned in the Quran, we don’t know if what they say of Jesus (pbuh) in the Gospels is true or not as far as him drinking wine, since both the Bible and the Torah have been corrupted. If Jesus did however, do such things it was before the time that Allah SWT declared alcohol to be haram.

Jesus was a prophet of Allah SWT, therefore he was without sin.

Allahu Alim. (Allah knows best)

 

[Reuben_J]

Alcohol was not always haram. In the beginning when Islam was revealed to Prophet Muhammad SAWD, alcohol was not haram, but then there were some of the arab Muslims coming to prayer drunk, and this was a problem… and then the verse was revealed prohibiting alcohol.
*Hadith - Abu Dawood, Narrated Umar ibn al-Khattab

When the prohibition of wine (was yet to be) declared, Umar said: O Allah, give us a satisfactory explanation about wine. So the following verse of Surat al-Baqarah revealed; “They ask thee concerning wine and gambling. Say: In them is great sin…” Umar was then called and it was recited to him. He said: O Allah, give us a satisfactory explanation about wine. Then the following verse of Surat an-Nisa’ was revealed: “O ye who believe! approach not prayers with a mind befogged…” Thereafter the herald of the Apostle of Allah would call when the (congregational) prayer was performed: Beware, one who is drunk should not come to prayer. Umar was again called and it was recited to him. He said: O Allah, give us a satisfactory explanation about wine. This verse was revealed: “Will ye not then abstain?” Umar said: We abstained. *

Like, uh hmm, I allowed wine thinking that you guys were responsible enough. But now that you proved yourselves to be nimcompoops, I am therefore taking this privilege away from you. Now wine is haram!

Sorry just kidding.

 

[dolphinlove]

Like, uh hmm, I allowed wine thinking that you guys were responsible enough. But now that you proved yourselves to be nimcompoops, I am therefore taking this privilege away from you. Now wine is haram!

Sorry just kidding.

Sounds like its a make it up as i go along sort of thing…

 

[tawheedah]

Sounds like its a make it up as i go along sort of thing…

I don’t find it funny when people disrespect other’s religions. Laugh now. No one will be laughing on the Day of Judgement.

 

[tawheedah]

Like, uh hmm, I allowed wine thinking that you guys were responsible enough. But now that you proved yourselves to be nimcompoops, I am therefore taking this privilege away from you. Now wine is haram!

Sorry just kidding.

The command is delivered in stages, as if to allow its importance to sink into the lives of the early Muslims.

Drunkenness was a very common occurrence in the whole Arabian Peninsula during the time of Muhammad (peace be upon him).

At first, the Muslims were told in the Noble Qur’an that they should not turn up drunk for the prayers in the mosque:

{O ye who believe! approach not prayers with a mind befogged, until ye can understand all that ye say…} (An-Nisaa’ 4: 43)

At a later stage, another revelation was received which told them that there was some good to be found in alcohol, as people would tell us today, but that this was outweighed by the bad:

{They ask you concerning alcohol and gambling. Say: 'In them is a great sin, and some benefits for men, But the sin is far greater than the benefits.} (Al-Baqarah 2: 219)

Finally, a verse was revealed to the Muslims in Madinah which totally forbade alcohol:

{Ye who believe! Intoxicants and gambling, all are an abomination of Satan’s handiwork. Eschew such abomination, that ye may prosper. Satan’s plan is (but) to excite enmity and hatred between you, with intoxicants and gambling, and hinder you from the remembrance of Allah, and from prayer; will ye not then abstain?} (Al-Ma’idah 5: 90-91) *

 

[RomanCrusader]

Mohammed drank the blood of human children, at least figuratively.

 

[swariffin]

Like I said most people are going to get drunk if they mess with it long enough, so it is better not to. But if you must drink it and you don’t get drunk with it, like if wine is all there is to drink and you are dying of thirst, then it’s not prohibited

Same with pork, you can eat it if that’s all there is to eat and you might otherwise starve if you don’t.

Dear FoA,

That is why I think your interpretations is interesting. You are really introducing new things to me even for the religion of Islam in which I am not a muslim. The way I know about Islam is different that what you presented in this thread. Unlike other thread, I do not have much to share with you here in this thread. I am listening to you.

 

[Reuben_J]

The command is delivered in stages, as if to allow its importance to sink into the lives of the early Muslims.

Drunkenness was a very common occurrence in the whole Arabian Peninsula during the time of Muhammad (peace be upon him).

At first, the Muslims were told in the Noble Qur’an that they should not turn up drunk for the prayers in the mosque:

{O ye who believe! approach not prayers with a mind befogged, until ye can understand all that ye say…} (An-Nisaa’ 4: 43)

At a later stage, another revelation was received which told them that there was some good to be found in alcohol, as people would tell us today, but that this was outweighed by the bad:

{They ask you concerning alcohol and gambling. Say: 'In them is a great sin, and some benefits for men, But the sin is far greater than the benefits.} (Al-Baqarah 2: 219)

**Finally, a verse was revealed to the Muslims in Madinah which totally forbade alcohol: **

{Ye who believe! Intoxicants and gambling, all are an abomination of Satan’s handiwork. Eschew such abomination, that ye may prosper. Satan’s plan is (but) to excite enmity and hatred between you, with intoxicants and gambling, and hinder you from the remembrance of Allah, and from prayer; will ye not then abstain?} (Al-Ma’idah 5: 90-91) *

The idea that God makes mistake in such a straight forward doctrine is alien to us. I suppose this causes some Catholics to laugh.

Why throw out the baby out of the window just for the dirt in the bathtub? I mean the permission for wine was granted because there was some good in it, but was rescinded because of Arabs turning up drunk in the mosque.

By doing that the supposedly omnipotent Allah looks fickle-minded and incompetent, not unlike us human beings.

Personally I feel the prohibition of wine is unnecessary and frivolous. A God-fearing person would avoid drinking it in excess knowing that it leads to drunkenness and sins. Sure humans are weak but by the grace of God we can overcome petty bad habit. Also, I think, such law would interfere with the free will that God has given us. If we love God more, why then the need to be drunk?

Peace.

 

[tawheedah]

The idea that God makes mistake in such a straight forward doctrine is alien to us. I suppose this causes some Catholics to laugh.

Why throw out the baby out of the window just for the dirt in the bathtub? I mean the permission for wine was granted because there was some good in it, but was rescinded because of Arabs turning up drunk in the mosque.

By doing that the supposedly omnipotent Allah looks fickle-minded and incompetent, not unlike us human beings.

Personally I feel the prohibition of wine is unnecessary and frivolous. A God-fearing person would avoid drinking it in excess knowing that it leads to drunkenness and sins. Sure humans are weak but by the grace of God we can overcome petty bad habit. Also, I think, such law would interfere with the free will that God has given us. If we love God more, why then the need to be drunk?

Peace.

God doesn’t make mistakes. He nearly eased the first Muslims away from drinking. Alcohol is forbidden for a Muslim. You wouldn’t show up for a job interview drunk would you? Why would you show up for a meeting with your Lord drunk? We pray 5 times a day, how can we pray if we are intoxicated? We can’t. Our prayers will not be accepted if we are intoxicated. If we are praying 5 different times throughout the day, then drinking at any point during the day is going to affect our prayers.

I understand Catholics like to drink wine and most people feel that alcohol is fine in moderation. That’s fine for you, and I respect that. But in my religion, we are not allowed to drink, and it doesn’t bother me in the least. Like they say, there is some good in alcohol but it is outweighed by the bad. To each his own. For me, alcohol is something that Allah has forbidden. I hear and I obey. I want to please my Lord, not anyone else.

Peace.

 

[bpbasilphx]

I know that Islam bans alcohol, and I know that Muslims believe in Jesus.

This is incorect.

Muslims believe in an entity the call “Jesus–Isa”, but this is NOT the Jesus of the Bible or Jesus as He is.

The real Jesus is God and Man in one Person, Who died on the Cross and rose from the dead.

Muslims deny this.

 

[FaithofAbraham]

I know that Islam bans alcohol, and I know that Muslims believe in Jesus.

This is incorect.

Muslims believe in an entity the call “Jesus–Isa”, but this is NOT the Jesus of the Bible or Jesus as He is.

The real Jesus is God and Man in one Person, Who died on the Cross and rose from the dead.

Muslims deny this.

The Quran doesn’t deny that Jesus had the Spirit of God in him, only denies that he was born a God. There is no reason for God to be born as a man when His Spirit can dwell in man that is born entirely human.

 

[Reuben_J]

God doesn’t make mistakes.

The way you told us, it seem he did. At first wine was allowed, then later it was forbidden. It was a mistake to allow it at first, was it not?

He nearly eased the first Muslims away from drinking. Alcohol is forbidden for a Muslim. You wouldn’t show up for a job interview drunk would you? Why would you show up for a meeting with your Lord drunk? We pray 5 times a day, how can we pray if we are intoxicated? We can’t. Our prayers will not be accepted if we are intoxicated. If we are praying 5 different times throughout the day, then drinking at any point during the day is going to affect our prayers.

I said in my post that if we love God, we should not allow ourselves to get drunk. Did you notice I said this? Of course we should not get drunk while praying or meeting important people during important occasion. Oh dear!

You said there was some good in wine. I agree with this. There are many good uses of wine today - one of which is in cooking. Nobody get drunk by it. There is some medical evidence that show small amount of wine is good for your health.

Now, please do not get me wrong. I DO NOT advocate drinking wine in excess. I only thought that for God to prohibit such good thing in food is unneceassary and frivolous. Not to mention that your Allah allowed it at first. The change of mind subsequently does not fit with our idea what God is. Maybe for Allah but not God.

You mean to say that man cannot think for themselves what is right and what is wrong that Allah must dictate his eating habit?

I understand Catholics like to drink wine and most people feel that alcohol is fine in moderation. That’s fine for you, and I respect that.

Very funny. Not all Catholics like to drink wine. Some do and some don’t. You are guilty of generalizing here. It’s people choice. Allah should not take away small freedom like this if free will is sincerely given.

But in my religion, we are not allowed to drink, and it doesn’t bother me in the least. Like they say, there is some good in alcohol but it is outweighed by the bad. To each his own.

You are talking as if I’m forcing my idea on you. Of course it is your privilege to believe what you like.

For me, alcohol is something that Allah has forbidden. I hear and I obey. I want to please my Lord, not anyone else.

Maybe this directive is not from God at all? Maybe man just made this up. I would not be obliged to follow the wisdom of man or any other beings other than God.

Peace.

Peace to you too.

 

[Hastrman]

Only images of Mohammed are forbidden? Why would they say that? And what do the other group mean by “all images”. All images of what: dead people?

All images, period. No representational art (I think floral patterns might be okay). Ever see the decorations in a mosque? All geometric and calligraphy.

Images of any prophet are usually forbidden, I think, as are images that purport to represent God (angels too, maybe?).

 

[Reuben_J]

We pray 5 times a day, how can we pray if we are intoxicated? We can’t. Our prayers will not be accepted if we are intoxicated. If we are praying 5 different times throughout the day, then drinking at any point during the day is going to affect our prayers.

This sounds ignorance to me. You are speaking on errorneous premise that one must get drunk when drinking wine. This is far from the truth. Like I said not everybody get drunk when drinking wine, especially in small amount.

BTW, when is your last prayer for the day? Say if it’s 8 to 9 o’clock at night and the next one is at dawn the next day, you would have plenty of free time in between in the evening. So your reason it will affect your prayers is rather exegerating.

 

[Reuben_J]

All images, period.

Ha! There goes Picasso.

 

[dolphinlove]

I don’t find it funny when people disrespect other’s religions. Laugh now. No one will be laughing on the Day of Judgement.

No, ill be dancing for joy when Jesus comes!

 

[tawheedah]

No, ill be dancing for joy when Jesus comes!

What makes you think that Muslims don’t believe that Jesus (pbuh) is coming back to this earth before the world ends?

No one will be dancing for joy on judgement day. That’s one thing I do know.

 

[Hastrman]

What makes you think that Muslims don’t believe that Jesus (pbuh) is coming back to this earth before the world ends?

No one will be dancing for joy on judgement day. That’s one thing I do know.

For any who don’t know, Muslims believe Jesus, not Muhammad, will judge on judgment day. As I understand it Islam teaches that Jesus is in some ways greater than Muhammad, but his teachings were corrupted because he relied on men to pass them down. Please correct me if I’m wrong.

I would however question whether the righteous, in the Muslim perception of the last judgment, might not be dancing for joy. Or might it be, well, bad manners to dance when the unrighteous are being damned?

 

[Reuben_J]

No one will be dancing for joy on judgement day. That’s one thing I do know.

I think you’re afraid of judgment day when you’ll have to account for yourself at the feet of Jesus, who will be Judge and King. Fear is when we are not sure of what we have done, whether it’s right or wrong.

Catholics look forward for the day of judgement. To see Jesus face to face is the ultimate joy. He has given us assurance that we will be saved if we believe that he died for us; and to live a life according to his teachings.

You better get used to it here. Dancing for joy very often is Catholics’ expression of thanksgiving and confidence in Jesus Christ as the Lord and Savior. For he has turned our mourning into dancing.

Psalm 30:11-22
You turned my wailing into dancing;
you removed my sackcloth and clothed me with joy,

that my heart may sing to you and not be silent.
O LORD my God, I will give you thanks forever.