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cjforJesus
Guest
The Holy Spirit is not an “experience”. The Holy Spirit is the third Person of the TRinity,and He guides us to all truths.
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jlhargus
Guest
Verse26 I put in bold blue in your post. Those verses are addressed to the apostles to whom the Spirit of Truth (Holy Spirit) will guide into all truth. I have posted the entire chapter, except for the last 4 verses as post is to long, so you may read it in context for yourself.
[Jn14:1 Let not your heart be troubled: ye believe in God, believe also in me. 2 In my Father’s house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you.** I go to prepare a place for you. 3 And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also. 4 And whither I go ye know, and the way ye know. 5 **Thomas saith **unto him, Lord, we know not whither thou goest; and how can we know the way? 6 **Jesus saith **unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me. 7 If ye had known me, ye should have known my Father also: and from henceforth ye know him, and have seen him. 8 **Philip saith **unto him, Lord, show us the Father, and it sufficeth us. 9 **Jesus saith **unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? **he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Show us the Father? **10 Believest thou not that I am in the Father, and the Father in me? the words that I speak unto you I speak not of myself: but the Father that dwelleth in me, he doeth the works. 11 Believe me that I am in the Father, and the Father in me: or else believe me for the very works’ sake. 12 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father. 13 And whatsoever ye shall ask in my name, that will I do, that the Father may be glorified in the Son. 14 If ye shall ask any thing in my name, I will do it. 15 If ye love me, **keep my commandments. **16 And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever; 17 Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you. 18 I will not leave you comfortless: I will come to you. 19 Yet a little while, and the world seeth me no more; but ye see me: because I live, ye shall live also. 20 At that day ye shall know that I am in my Father, and ye in me, and I in you. 21 He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him. 22 Judas saith unto him, not Iscariot, Lord, how is it that thou wilt manifest thyself unto us, and not unto the world? 23 **Jesus answered **and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him. 24 He that loveth me not keepeth not my sayings: and the word which ye hear is not mine, but the Father’s which sent me. 25 These things have I spoken unto you, being yet present with you. 26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you. 27 Peace I leave with you, my peace I give unto you: not as the world giveth, give I unto you. Let not your heart be troubled, neither let it be afraid.]
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MartinJordan
Guest
. 3 And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also. 4 And whither I go ye know, and the way ye know. 5 **Thomas saith **unto him, Lord, we know not whither thou goest; and how can we know the way? 6 **Jesus saith **unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me. 7 If ye had known me, ye should have known my Father also: and from henceforth ye know him, and have seen him. 8 **Philip saith **unto him, Lord, show us the Father, and it sufficeth us. 9 **Jesus saith **unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? **he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Show us the Father? **10 Believest thou not that I am in the Father, and the Father in me? the words that I speak unto you I speak not of myself: but the Father that dwelleth in me, he doeth the works. 11 Believe me that I am in the Father, and the Father in me: or else believe me for the very works’ sake. 12 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father. 13 And whatsoever ye shall ask in my name, that will I do, that the Father may be glorified in the Son. 14 If ye shall ask any thing in my name, I will do it. 15 If ye love me, **keep my commandments. **16 And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever; 17 Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you. 18 I will not leave you comfortless: I will come to you. 19 Yet a little while, and the world seeth me no more; but ye see me: because I live, ye shall live also. 20 At that day ye shall know that I am in my Father, and ye in me, and I in you. 21 He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him. 22 Judas saith unto him, not Iscariot, Lord, how is it that thou wilt manifest thyself unto us, and not unto the world? 23 **Jesus answered **and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him. 24 He that loveth me not keepeth not my sayings: and the word which ye hear is not mine, but the Father’s which sent me. 25 These things have I spoken unto you, being yet present with you. 26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you. 27 Peace I leave with you, my peace I give unto you: not as the world giveth, give I unto you. Let not your heart be troubled, neither let it be afraid.]
And how Beautiful. Praise God!
MJ
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jlhargus
Guest
Thanks MJ
And how Beautiful. Praise God!
MJ
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arthra
Guest
I wonder if there is “room” in the concept of the “paraclete” to allow for a wider more inclusive concept?
There is an interesting paragraph in the wikipedia article on the “Paraclete” that goes like this:
"Philo speaks several times of “paraclete” advocates[6] primarily in the sense of human intercessors.
The word later went from Hellenistic Jewish writing into rabbinical Hebrew writing. For a summary of rabbinical usage see Jewish Encyclopedia 1914 “Paraclete”.
The word is not used in the Septuagint, the word “comforters” being different in Job. Other words are used to translate the Hebrew word מְנַחֵם (mənaḥḥēm “comforter”) and Melitz Yosher[7] (מליץ יושר).
…
“In modern Hebrew, the cognate ‘praklit’ (פרקליט) means ‘solicitor’ or ‘legal counsel’, ‘praklit ha-mechoz’ means district attorney, and ‘praklitut ha-medina’ the Israeli equivalent of the solicitor-general.”
The citation 6 above has
30 October 2009 (2009-10-30). “The six uses of paraclete by Philo tabulated (halfway down article)”. Bibleq.info. Retrieved 2014-03-11.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paraclete#cite_note-6
In the Jewish Encyclopedia is also an article on the paraclete…
The paraclete or intercessor created through each good deed is called “angel” (Ex. R. xxxii., with reference to Ps. xxxiv. 8; comp. Job xxxiii. 23—“an interceding angel,” A. V. incorrectly translating “a messenger,” “an interpreter”). In the sense of “Intercessor,” the name “Paraclete” is given also to the Holy Spirit in the New Testament (John xiv. 16, 26; xv. 26; xvi. 7 [A. V. incorrectly, “Comforter”]; I John ii. 1 [A. V. “advocate”]), just as the Midrash calls the Holy Spirit “Synegor,” which is the same as “Paraclete” (Lev. R. vi. 1; Deut. R. iii. 12). In the same sense Philo speaks of the “Logos” (“De Vita Mosis,” iii., § 14) as the “Paraclete” who is to procure for the high priest forgiveness of sins, just as he uses the term “paraclete” elsewhere in the sense of “advocate” and “intercessor” (“In Flaccum,” §§ 3, 4; “De Opificiis Mundi,” § 6: “God is in no need of an ‘intercessor,’” i.e., a helper).
jewishencyclopedia.com/articles/11899-paraclete
There is an interesting paragraph in the wikipedia article on the “Paraclete” that goes like this:
"Philo speaks several times of “paraclete” advocates[6] primarily in the sense of human intercessors.
The word later went from Hellenistic Jewish writing into rabbinical Hebrew writing. For a summary of rabbinical usage see Jewish Encyclopedia 1914 “Paraclete”.
The word is not used in the Septuagint, the word “comforters” being different in Job. Other words are used to translate the Hebrew word מְנַחֵם (mənaḥḥēm “comforter”) and Melitz Yosher[7] (מליץ יושר).
…
“In modern Hebrew, the cognate ‘praklit’ (פרקליט) means ‘solicitor’ or ‘legal counsel’, ‘praklit ha-mechoz’ means district attorney, and ‘praklitut ha-medina’ the Israeli equivalent of the solicitor-general.”
The citation 6 above has
30 October 2009 (2009-10-30). “The six uses of paraclete by Philo tabulated (halfway down article)”. Bibleq.info. Retrieved 2014-03-11.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paraclete#cite_note-6
In the Jewish Encyclopedia is also an article on the paraclete…
The paraclete or intercessor created through each good deed is called “angel” (Ex. R. xxxii., with reference to Ps. xxxiv. 8; comp. Job xxxiii. 23—“an interceding angel,” A. V. incorrectly translating “a messenger,” “an interpreter”). In the sense of “Intercessor,” the name “Paraclete” is given also to the Holy Spirit in the New Testament (John xiv. 16, 26; xv. 26; xvi. 7 [A. V. incorrectly, “Comforter”]; I John ii. 1 [A. V. “advocate”]), just as the Midrash calls the Holy Spirit “Synegor,” which is the same as “Paraclete” (Lev. R. vi. 1; Deut. R. iii. 12). In the same sense Philo speaks of the “Logos” (“De Vita Mosis,” iii., § 14) as the “Paraclete” who is to procure for the high priest forgiveness of sins, just as he uses the term “paraclete” elsewhere in the sense of “advocate” and “intercessor” (“In Flaccum,” §§ 3, 4; “De Opificiis Mundi,” § 6: “God is in no need of an ‘intercessor,’” i.e., a helper).
jewishencyclopedia.com/articles/11899-paraclete
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MartinJordan
Guest
Arthra this is bordering on Anti-Christian polemic. There is sure an element of defence council elements but there is a purpose for it but NOT a worldly aspect which the above wants to state. When I have time will comment and clarify further.
MJ
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hasantas
Guest
26 And in the sixth month the angel Gabriel was sent from God unto a city of Galilee, named Nazareth,
27 To a virgin espoused to a man whose name was Joseph, of the house of David; and the virgin’s name was Mary.
28 And the angel came in unto her, and said, Hail, thou that art highly favoured, the Lord is with thee: blessed art thou among women.
29 And when she saw him, she was troubled at his saying, and cast in her mind what manner of salutation this should be.
30 And the angel said unto her, Fear not, Mary: for thou hast found favour with God.
31 And, behold, thou shalt conceive in thy womb, and bring forth a son, and shalt call his name JESUS.
32 He shall be great, and shall be called the Son of the Highest: and the Lord God shall give unto him the throne of his father David:
33 And he shall reign over the house of Jacob for ever; and of his kingdom there shall be no end.
34 Then said Mary unto the angel, How shall this be, seeing I know not a man?
35 And the angel answered and said unto her, The Holy Ghost shall come upon thee, and the power of the Highest shall overshadow thee: therefore also that holy thing which shall be born of thee shall be called the Son of God.
36 And, behold, thy cousin Elisabeth, she hath also conceived a son in her old age: and this is the sixth month with her, who was called barren.
37 For with God nothing shall be impossible.
38 And Mary said, Behold the handmaid of the Lord; be it unto me according to thy word. And the angel departed from her. Luke 1:26-38
Angel(Holy Spirit) told Mary that Holy Spirit would come unto Mary and Mary would get pregnant. That is clear.
And I noticed that why Jesus is called “Son of God”. And in the verse 35 and 32 it is explained clearly. Because the power of the Highest shall overshadow Mary. So Son of God is a figurative term. And Holy Spirit is angel Gabriel who is an intercessor between human and God’s act. That is clear in the verses.
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hasantas
Guest
Muslims accept Bible but Christians do not accept Qur’an. If you accept Qur’an I will bring much more from Qur’an.
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hasantas
Guest
Jesus will come back on the world and Jesus will die just like other humans. That will happen very close to end of the world.
Muhammed was ascended with His body through miracle of Mirach. Muhammed went beyond of Heavens until Sidrat-ul Muntaha and came back.
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hasantas
Guest
Qur’an was revealed to Muhammed. Muhammed had never read Bible ot Torah or any other Book. Muhammed could not read and write. So do you claim that Muhammed learn all these by hearing? Nobody was so aware of these knoledges around Him. Even a rabbi or a pastor could know what Muhammed knew. You must see that Qur’an is absolutely complete revelation. An uneducated human like Muhammed could not say such a book by himself. Qur’an challenge for about 1400 years to bring a book like Qur’an if some do not believe in Qur’an. Nobody could that until now. If that was possible anybody could refute Qur’an easily. And also you can never see a term in Qur’an which imply that the speechs are as if coming out through mouth of Muhammed.
Qur’an do not need the previous scriptures to prove itself. But God approve most part of previous scriptures and correct the corruption parts.
Qur’an do not need the previous scriptures to prove itself. But God approve most part of previous scriptures and correct the corruption parts.
meltzerboy
New member
However, verse 26 explicitly states that “…the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost…” How do you reconcile this with the Comforter’s being the Prophet Muhammad?
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Reuben_J
Guest
To Christians and even non-Christian like you, it is obvious. Only to Muslims, that they must do some lingual gymnastic to explain that the Comforter has now become Muhammad.
It is hard to take them seriously when they argue like that. In other verse thy say the Holy Spirit is an angel. So how an angel is Muhammad then?
Perhaps Muslims should just stick to the Quran to justify Muhammad to have some sense of credibility.
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adrift
Guest
Clear as mud. So you are saying that the Angel who is Gabriel tells Mary that Gabriel, himself, would cause the pregnancy
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fasolislithuan
Guest
So clear that the Islam’s claim is totally insane. God sent the Angel Gabriel with the object to say to Mary that the Holy Ghost shall come upon her. And Muslims think that Angel Gabriel=Holy Ghost. But…isn’t the Angel Gabriel already present before Mary? Why is he (Angel Gabriel) sent to tell Mary that he’ll come?
So the Angel Gabriel (already present before Mary) is speaking to Mary: “Hey, God’ve sent me to you to tell you that I’ll come upon you, but not now, I’ll come later. Hey, don’t get me wrong, when I tell you that the Holy Spirit will come upon you, actually I’m saying that this third person that I call Holy Spirit, actually, is me”. :doh2:
Absurd.
But we continue with the game. We hypothesize that nonsense claim that the Holy Spirit is the Angel Gabriel according to Islam’s interpretation of Luke 1 is possible.
Now we consider Islam’s claim that the Paraclete is Muhammed. If we read John 14,26, the text says: *“but the Paraclete, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, will teach you everything and remind you of all I have said to you.” *.
So the Paraclete that accord Islam is Muhammed, is accord the Bible the Holy Spirit.
Therefore we have:
Paraclete=Holy Spirit (according to the Bible John 14,26)
and,
Angel Gabriel= Holy Spirit (according to Islam)
Paraclete=Muhammed (according to Islam)
If Paraclete is Muhammed then Muhammed is the Holy Spirit according to the Bible (because Paraclete=Holy Spirit), and therefore according to Luke 1 Muhammed is sent by God five centuries before his real birth and in the shape of Angel Gabriel to tell Mary that he’ll come later but as Holy Spirit so that she can conceive Jesus. So Muhammed partakes in Jesus incarnation.
uch: Mother of God!
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Matthew_Light
Guest
That seems an uncharitable choice of words, in any case many Muslims do not make the claim that the Paraclete refers to Muhammad.
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MartinJordan
Guest
Hasantas hasn’t replied above and yet can come up with “Muslims accept Bible” which is inexplicable. So Hasantas how about it?
MJ
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MartinJordan
Guest
We are also concerned of our Salvation and we take Scripture VERY seriously and must be consistent for the sake of ourselves,for our children and for humanity sake.
MJ
MJ
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fasolislithuan
Guest
Better for them, because is absurd and untenable. The claim is insane and I don’t think to say that is uncharitable. It would be uncharitable if I’d said that Hasantas is insane for defend that claim, but I don’t think this. He is only wrong. The claim is nonsense.
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MartinJordan
Guest
To be fair to Hasantas he’s not claiming Mohammed is the Holy Spirit, but can say that it doesn’t add up when claiming the HS is Gabriel and at the same time differentiate the Advocate and the Holy Spirit. But the claims for his point of view is faulty especially when leaving out certain verses to start with.
MJ
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MartinJordan
Guest
So with the exception of Muslims like Hasantas, the rest of us are agreeable and for God’s Truth, the Paracelete IS the Holy Spirit.
:harp:MJ
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