Must you be a Christian to be holy?

[TheAdvocate197]

To be holy, one must be sanctified by God, which can only occur at Baptism; through the grace given to us at Baptism, we become holy, hence the name, sanctifying grace.

So what of pious souls like those of the Dalai Lama or Gandhi? These were never baptized. Are we prepared to say that they are not (or were not in Gandhi’s case) holy? If you say “yes”, that means that we can be sanctified by our works. If you say “no”, it just sounds so unreasonable, given that there are so many baptized Catholics that seem so much further away from God than many in other religions who are so virtuous and kind in their deeds, and who sincerely love God.

(By the way, the same question applies to non-Catholic Christians who don’t believe in the necessity of Baptism.)

Where am I going wrong?

 

[Reuben_J]

I think our Catechism can explain this in some ways. Where there is goodness and truth, God would honor it, even if they are not baptized, since God wants all men to be saved.

CCC 843 The Catholic Church recognizes in other religions that search, among shadows and images, for the God who is unknown yet near since he gives life and breath and all things and wants all men to be saved. Thus, the Church considers all goodness and truth found in these religions as “a preparation for the Gospel and given by him who enlightens all men that they may at length have life.”

 

[Tis_Bearself]

Must you be a Christian to be holy?
No. But it sure does help.

 

[Curious11]

So does that mean that pagan people born before Jesus and who never heard of the Old Covenant (the one binding at the time) but are good are saved? Like Plato (I don’t know if he was familiar with Judaism, let’s assume he wasn’t), who 3 centuries before Jesus already said that it is unjust to return evil with evil

 

[Shakuhachi]

How about sticking with the fruits of the Holy Spirit. Christians do not have the monopoly on them.

“But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, and self-control” Galatians 5:22-23

 

[Thom18]

I think in your earthly life, you would have to be Christian to be holy. However, if a pagan like Plato was forgiven of his ignorance of the Jewish faith and welcomed into the kingdom of Heaven, then he would be holy in his Heavenly life.

 

[ErraticFaith]

Not sure I’d call Ghandi or the DL ‘pious’ in the slightest.

But it’s interesting to ponder I suppose.

 

[nightshade]

https://www.independent.co.uk/arts-entertainment/books/features/thrill-chaste-truth-about-gandhi-s-sex-life-1937411.html

Please see link above. I have seen this mentioned in numerous sources. Ghandi wasn’t holy or pious in any sense of the word if what is mentioned was true.

 

[TK421]

To be holy, one must be sanctified by God, which can only occur at Baptism; through the grace given to us at Baptism, we become holy, hence the name, sanctifying grace.

So what of pious souls like those of the Dalai Lama or Gandhi? These were never baptized. Are we prepared to say that they are not (or were not in Gandhi’s case) holy? If you say “yes”, that means that we can be sanctified by our works. If you say “no”, it just sounds so unreasonable, given that there are so many baptized Catholics that seem so much further away from God than many in other religions who are so virtuous and kind in their deeds, and who sincerely love God.

(By the way, the same question applies to non-Catholic Christians who don’t believe in the necessity of Baptism.)

Where am I going wrong?

Yes, non-Christians can still obtain a high degree of holiness, especially pertaining to invincible ignorance.

http://www.vatican.va/archive/hist_...ts/vat-ii_decl_19651028_nostra-aetate_en.html

The holiness of each individual is something known infallibly only by God. There will be people in Heaven who suffered and struggled more than anybody on Earth ever gave credit to, because of the station in life that they found themselves in.

To go further on a point you mention:

If you say “yes”, that means that we can be sanctified by our works. If you say “no”, it just sounds so unreasonable

God is able to (and does) send his graces upon a non-baptized soul in order to strengthen her and further convert her in closer conformity to Truth, in so far as what the soul is capable based on her knowledge. If this weren’t the case, then an adult person could never be moved towards receiving sanctifying grace through the Sacrament of Christian Baptism in the first place.

It should also be noted that as Catholics, we can enjoy various privileges that others may not, such as the benefits of public revelation, the Magisterium, the writings of the saints, and of course the sacramental life itself. These benefits exist purely out of God’s mercy and not because of our own merit, and we receive them in order to help those who enjoy less graces than we do.

The eternal Father, by a free and hidden plan of His own wisdom and goodness, created the whole world. His plan was to raise men to a participation of the divine life. … All the Church’s children should remember that their exalted status is to be attributed not to their own merits but to the special grace of Christ
-Lumen Genium
http://www.vatican.va/archive/hist_...s/vat-ii_const_19641121_lumen-gentium_en.html

Peace.

 

[Peebo]

At the last judgement Christ is going to judge who is and who isn’t worthy of heaven…Christ himself said that not everyone who calls him Lord will be saved…but those who do the will of his father…so who is holy and who isn’t…who is worthy of heaven and who isn’t is not up to us to speculate…because some who think they are holy/worthy may find they are not according to Christ…in fact none of us are worthy save for by the grace of God

 

[Psychae]

To be holy, one must be sanctified by God, which can only occur at Baptism

There’s three different kinds of Baptism: by water, by desire, and by blood.

So what of pious souls like those of the Dalai Lama or Gandhi? These were never baptized.

Baptism of desire! Maybe, anyway although I think I’d call them blessed, not pious.

 

[PJM]

To be holy, one must be sanctified by God, which can only occur at Baptism; through the grace given to us at Baptism, we become holy, hence the name, sanctifying grace.

So what of pious souls like those of the Dalai Lama or Gandhi? These were never baptized. Are we prepared to say that they are not (or were not in Gandhi’s case) holy? If you say “yes”, that means that we can be sanctified by our works. If you say “no”, it just sounds so unreasonable, given that there are so many baptized Catholics that seem so much further away from God than many in other religions who are so virtuous and kind in their deeds, and who sincerely love God.

(By the way, the same question applies to non-Catholic Christians who don’t believe in the necessity of Baptism.)

Where am I going wrong?

The issue ten becomes one of culpability.

IF, if through NO fault of their own they do not KNow, God {**} His One True Faith and Church as being Necessary for salvation; NOR do they know the Bible’s TRUTHS {singular per defined issue}; then God will judge them on their charity.

(**) God has committed himself to make sufficient Grace available that everyone CAN, Could and Should Know Him; so while these people ARE HOLY; only God can judge their degree of culpability; ONLY God can Judge them Fairly and Justly. AMEN!

Partick.

 

[Reuben_J]

So does that mean that pagan people born before Jesus and who never heard of the Old Covenant (the one binding at the time) but are good are saved? Like Plato (I don’t know if he was familiar with Judaism, let’s assume he wasn’t), who 3 centuries before Jesus already said that it is unjust to return evil with evil

Yes, certainly. The criteria is still the same as today - that good people would be honored by God and therefore merits God mercy and justice. It is God’s prerogative. There were people in the OT who were not of the Chosen people who found favor with God.

God bless.