My Brother, The Pastor

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To make a very long story short. My brother, born and raised Catholic, meets my now sister in law, coverts to a “Bible Church”, gets re-baptized, the whole nine yards.
We’ve talked about it before, and butted heads a few times but anyway here’s my question. He is the Youth Pastor at his Church, and today I went to his church for my nephew’s “dedication.”

My brother was preaching, and by normal standards, he did a very good job. I went in ready to critique everything he said, but everything he said today I believe the Catholic Church would agree with. He definitely more faithful as an Evangelical then he ever was as a Catholic. Up until this point, I’ve defended my faith when i had to (which is rare) on things like praying to Mary, the Rosary, Saints etc. The only times I was at his Church was today and when my niece got dedicated, and when he got married (at a Baptist Church). Up until now, I pray for him and his family the same way I pray for all my fallen away Catholic family and friends. It seems to be different with him though, because I would consider him to be a very good Christian, in contrast to other’s I know who are just CINO’s.

My usual prayer for him is that he continue’s to grow in holiness and someday find his way home to the CC. I wonder though what will happen to his soul if he continue’s on his current path. Will God consider him to be invisibly ignorant? I mean we both have the same parent’s and Catholic education and I continue to practice, but I wonder what will happen to him if he never comes back. I guess my prayer for him should stll be that he grows in holiness and finds his way home but I’m wondering if some of you can Opine?
 
What does Scripture say about those who know the truth and choose to depart from it?
 
I believe in objective truth, that’s why I’m Catholic. However, if he left the Church through his own ignorance, and believe’s what he’s preaching now is “Gospel Truth,” I just don’t how to go about praying for him. I mean my Grandparents are born and raised Lutherans, and I don’t really feel a desperate need to pray for their conversion. I believe that if they sincerly tried to do the will of God in their life then they will go to Heaven, same applies to my sister-in-law. However, since my brother left the Catholic Church, that’s where it get sticky. I will always pray for him, I just don’t know if i should pray differently for him then I would for my other brothers who are lapsed Catholics and not really practicing anything.
 
From what I understand about your situation, there must have been a reason for your brother’s departure from the faith. My brother also left the church and now practises some new kind of new age spirituality. He is outwardly very happy and has some very strong feelings about why he is not a Catholic.

Only God knows why he has stopped fully embracing the truth, but I pray that he returns with his whole heart. It is only through the Catholic Church that we get to Heaven.
 
Booter said:
I will always pray for him, I just don’t know if i should pray differently for him then I would for my other brothers who are lapsed Catholics and not really practicing anything.
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We can never go wrong when we pray the prayer that Jesus prayed in John Chapter 17, that we all will be one:

**"I pray not only for them, but also for those who will believe in me through their word, ****21 ****so that they may all be one, as you, Father, are in me and I in you, that they also may be in us, that the world may believe that you sent me. ****22 ****And I have given them the glory you gave me, so that they may be one, as we are one, ****23 ****I in them and you in me, that they may be brought to perfection as one, that the world may know that you sent me, and that you loved them even as you loved me. **
 
shaun23 said:
It is only through the Catholic Church that we get to Heaven.
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Hmmmm… I always thought it was only through Jesus Christ’s death and resurrection that we get to heaven…

Pretty sure God is not bound by human labels…
 
shaun23 said:
From what I understand about your situation, there must have been a reason for your brother’s departure from the faith. My brother also left the church and now practises some new kind of new age spirituality. He is outwardly very happy and has some very strong feelings about why he is not a Catholic.

Only God knows why he has stopped fully embracing the truth, but I pray that he returns with his whole heart. It is only through the Catholic Church that we get to Heaven.
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My bro is more evangelical. They sing upbeat songs, then preach about the Bible. I guess I’ll just continue to pray that he grows spiritually and finds his way back to the CC. From what i understand of the Church’s teaching, if someone is invisibly ignorant of the truth (i.e. prostestants for the most part) but sincerly try to follow God’s will, then they could go to heaven. This probably doesn’t apply for Catholics who rejected the faith unless they were poorly catechized or something like that. I really don’t know why my brother left the church, but i hope and pray he finds his way back someday along with all who have left.
 
Booter said:
I wouldn’t call what he practices “new age.” It’s more evangelical. They sing upbeat songs, then preach about the Bible. I guess I’ll just continue to pray that he grows spiritually and finds his way back to the CC
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You absolutely should pray for his conversion and God willing he will return to the Church some day. I imagine there are probably some Catholic prayers for the conversion of all mankind.

Just remember, you can’t control how another person thinks or what they believe. Also, he doesn’t need to know that you are praying for him to return to the Church. That could be construed as condescending.

Jesus desires the salvation of all mankind. Even if he never comes back to the Church he is still in good hands. 👍

Yours in Christ
Joe
 
kage_ar said:
What does Scripture say about those who know the truth and choose to depart from it?
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Even if the Church is truth, he obviously doesn’t see it that way…so in fact he doesn’t know the truth.
 
Booter said:
I really don’t know why my brother left the church, but i hope and pray he finds his way back someday along with all who have left.
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I think that is all we can do sometimes, and I guess never give up hope.
 
Catholic90 said:
Hmmmm… I always thought it was only through Jesus Christ’s death and resurrection that we get to heaven…

Pretty sure God is not bound by human labels…
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You are right Catholic 90. I agree totally that we are only saved through Jesus.

I guess what I meant to say is that Jesus wants for all of us to get to Heaven and he instituted the Catholic Church to do all that he could to get us to heaven without affecting our free will. We are best to abide by the instruction of His Church in order to achieve salvation.
 
ForwardProgress said:
What does the Bible say about those who preach for us are not against us?
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Protestantism DOES preach against us, if they did not preach against us, they’d be Catholic.

Luke 11:23

Whoever is not with me is against me, and whoever does not gather with me scatters.

Matt 12:30

Whoever is not with me is against me, and whoever does not gather with me scatters.
 
Mark Chapter 9.

38 John said to Him, “Teacher, we saw someone casting out demons in Your name (insert Protestant pastor here), and we tried to prevent him because he was not following us (Insert ‘Not Catholic’).” 39 But Jesus said, “Do not hinder him (protestant), for there is no one who will perform a miracle in My name, and be able soon afterward to speak evil of Me. 40 “For he who is not against us is for us. 41 “For whoever gives you a cup of water to drink because of your name as followers of Christ(Christian, not necessarily Catholic), truly I say to you, he (protestant) will not lose his reward.

At least that’s how I read this passage if I take my Catholic goggles off. This guy did not join the Church of Satan.
 
kage_ar said:
Protestantism DOES preach against us, if they did not preach against us, they’d be Catholic.

Luke 11:23

Whoever is not with me is against me, and whoever does not gather with me scatters.

Matt 12:30

Whoever is not with me is against me, and whoever does not gather with me scatters.
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In fairness, your average Protestant doesn’t think any less of us. Perhaps we think less of them, though. I’ve noticed many more Catholics looking down on Protestants than vice versa.

What is much, much more troubling is the secular and athiest speaking of ill of the faithful. Until we walk with our Jewish, Protestant, etc brothers we will continue to lose the battle with the secular.
 
Rascalking said:
In fairness, your average Protestant doesn’t think any less of us. Perhaps we think less of them, though. I’ve noticed many more Catholics looking down on Protestants than vice versa.

What is much, much more troubling is the secular and athiest speaking of ill of the faithful. Until we walk with our Jewish, Protestant, etc brothers we will continue to lose the battle with the secular.
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ETA - remember, Jesus prayed that we would all be ONE. Jesus say the coming time when Christians would split off from the Church and He prayed that they would come back. How arrogant for us not to want what Jesus wants, One Church?

Hebrews chapter 6 is pretty clear about those who leave the Church:

**For it is impossible in the case of those who have once been enlightened and tasted the heavenly gift and shared in the holy Spirit ****and tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come, **and then have fallen away, to bring them to repentance again, since they are recrucifying the Son of God for themselves and holding him up to contempt.
 
kage_ar said:
ETA - remember, Jesus prayed that we would all be ONE. Jesus say the coming time when Christians would split off from the Church and He prayed that they would come back. How arrogant for us not to want what Jesus wants, One Church?

Hebrews chapter 6 is pretty clear about those who leave the Church:

**For it is impossible in the case of those who have once been enlightened and tasted the heavenly gift and shared in the holy Spirit ****and tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come, **and then have fallen away, to bring them to repentance again, since they are recrucifying the Son of God for themselves and holding him up to contempt.
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What does ETA mean? Estimated time of arrival is all I get! LOL 😉

The two horrific splits (Orthodox and the Protestant Reformation) are truly awful. I think He does want us to be one. However, I also think only He can judge us. If someone wants to genuinely move closer to him, and thinks that there is a more clear cut way, I disagree, but if there heart is in the right place, and they truly think they are moving closer to him, I simply cannot look down upon them-I wish they’d come back, but I can’t say they are lost.
 
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