My cousin is planning invitro fertilization within the next few weeks

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This same cousin requested just last week that I be her sponsor as she embarks on rcia classes, in order to be initiated into the catholic faith. Of course I will advise her about the immorality of ivf. Any advice how I should go about this? Should I threaten to withdraw as her sponsor if she goes through with the procedure?
 
This same cousin requested just last week that I be her sponsor as she embarks on rcia classes, in order to be initiated into the catholic faith. Of course I will advise her about the immorality of ivf. Any advice how I should go about this? Should I threaten to withdraw as her sponsor if she goes through with the procedure?
Pray–a lot. The woman is obviously desperately wanting a child of her own and suffering with some form of infertility. Imagine how your heart would bleed if you knew that there was only one even possible way that you could ever experience being pregnant and having a baby of your very own with the man you love–cause that’s where your friend is coming from right now. She also obviously isn’t poor and can afford the procedure cause it’s spendy–as I bet you know too. So, the bottom line is that this could well turn out to be the one insurmountable stumbling block with her and her conversion to Catholicism–at least at this time. I won’t go into how I know this–let’s just say that in my work environment I have ran into several women in this position who knew I am Catholic and showed interest in the Catholic faith. They have heard all their life, among whatever else they think they know or have heard about the Catholic church, that we support and promote having as many children as we are able–they haven’t heard the part about “according to what God gives us” though. When you tell her that it is against the teachings of the Catholic church to try to have even one baby by the only possible means that she can ever conceive–and remember, in vitro doesn’t work every time either–how do you think she’s going to feel? In my personal experience, this kind of scenario is one of the hardest you will ever face in bringing someone into the church. You can only do so much to help bring your friend into the church–and if she does decide not to continue with her classes and conversion at this time–don’t feel guilty. I can remember feeling a little bit like a failure when something like this happened to me and the woman decided she just wasn’t ready to accept Catholic teaching in this area. The thing is, even if she decides not to now–you’ve planted a seed–and sometimes that’s all you are expected by God to do.

My only point is that we all know the teaching of the church on in vitro. That is set in stone. But, just remember how strong the urge can be to have a baby of your own, and that this woman has a lot of emotional investment and her husband probably does too–and they may also have financial investment already in her plan to do in vitro as well–and she is probably NOT going to take your admonition easily and say “Oh well, just a thought–we’ll forget about it then.”. I’d even speak to the priest and see if he has helpful (name removed by moderator)ut before I approached her–you’re going to need all the help you can get. And again, PRAY!

God bless you and your friend. I’ll add you to our little on line prayer chain here on this forum–you’re going to need much prayer I suspect! Sometimes our advances in science present us with some unbelievably painful situations. Huh?:signofcross:
 
This same cousin requested just last week that I be her sponsor as she embarks on rcia classes, in order to be initiated into the catholic faith. Of course I will advise her about the immorality of ivf. Any advice how I should go about this? Should I threaten to withdraw as her sponsor if she goes through with the procedure?
My sister once went for one but I prayed so hard that it wont go through and I did sacrifices and offerings to the Lord and it did work.Try it, prayers are stronger with a good faith. Ask your friends to help you pray for this intention. Praying the rosary and the Memorare also help.
 
Find some good scientific explanations of the numbers of embryos destroyed in the IVF procedure and show it to her. Many are completely unaware of this.

Should you threaten to withdraw as her RCIA sponsor? Of course not, this shows how much she needs exposure to valid Christian teaching.

National Catholic Bioethics Center:
ncbcenter.org/
 
This same cousin requested just last week that I be her sponsor as she embarks on rcia classes, in order to be initiated into the catholic faith. Of course I will advise her about the immorality of ivf. Any advice how I should go about this? Should I threaten to withdraw as her sponsor if she goes through with the procedure?
I think part of the problem is the entitlement culture we live in. People believe they deserve a baby not that babies are blessings. I think you should sponsor her still. This is something that will be difficult to discuss. Maybe give her a copy of Humane Vitae. Pope John Paul II discussed extensively the dignity of the human person and that goes right from natural conception. It speaks for itself. Instead of you telling her, let a great Catholic thinker tell her.
Make yourself available to discuss it with her.
Pax Tecum!

~Kathleen
 
This same cousin requested just last week that I be her sponsor as she embarks on rcia classes, in order to be initiated into the catholic faith. Of course I will advise her about the immorality of ivf. Any advice how I should go about this? Should I threaten to withdraw as her sponsor if she goes through with the procedure?
Yes, because such a step demonstrates that she is not sincere. To enter the Church sacramentally while rejecting the moral teaching of the Church would be a situation one does not even want to think about. Advise her to speak to a priest pronto.

Linus2nd
 
This same cousin requested just last week that I be her sponsor as she embarks on rcia classes, in order to be initiated into the catholic faith. Of course I will advise her about the immorality of ivf. Any advice how I should go about this? Should I threaten to withdraw as her sponsor if she goes through with the procedure?
I think part of the problem is the entitlement culture we live in. People believe they deserve a baby not that babies are blessings. I think you should sponsor her still. This is something that will be difficult to discuss. Maybe give her a copy of Humane Vitae. Pope John Paul II discussed extensively the dignity of the human person and that goes right from natural conception. It speaks for itself. Instead of you telling her, let a great Catholic thinker tell her.
Make yourself available to discuss it with her.
Pax Tecum!

~Kathleen
 
Minimally, you can ask her, “What are you planning to do with the extra embryos?” and look concerned.

Of course, if she’s very infertile, there may not be any extra embryos.
 
Although I feel IVF is perfectly fine if you join a Club you agree to play by its rules-

The RC Church opposes IVF even if a majority of the faithful do not

She shold not join if she can not play by the rules

:cool:
 
The reason that the Church has a problem with IVF is that it dissociates the procreative aspect of sex from the unitive aspect. The child no longer becomes a visible sign of the couple’s love for each other, conceived from a joining of two into one flesh. The mystery of marriage and the Trinity is lost through IVF. IVF also presupposes that a person has a “right” to have a child, which, as the Catechism, states, no one has, because children are not property.

From a more practical standpoint, I also have to question the ethics of performing a highly expensive procedure (I believe the average cost is around $10,000, which in my area is approximately twice the cost of a private adoption) which has a limited success rate (around 30-40%). It is more likely that she will spend a great deal of money and not conceive.

I can understand the desire of couples to have a child. I am a subfertile woman - I suffer from polycystic ovary syndrome (PCOS), and have a short luteal phase (the phase between ovulation and menstruation). Both of these increase my risk for infertility and pregnancy loss. So far, we (my husband and I) think I have already had one miscarriage at about 9 weeks. However, we would NEVER resort to IVF. We have already decided to opt for private adoption. My husband has one daughter from a previous marriage (declared null) and she lives with us half-time. She is like a daughter to me, but we would still like to have more children, so we’re going to go with private adoption.
 
Hopefully, one day, some method of assisting couples who have fertility issues to be able to conceive will be discovered that can be adapted to fit in with Catholic teaching. It’s an area where science, faith and compassion could come together to provide a true blessing in many people’s lives. As a mother myself, I can sincerely understand why a couple might want to conceive a baby desperately enough–even a Catholic couple-- to go against church teaching on the issue of in vitro. I’m NOT saying that I agree–or that it’s okay—only that I “get it”.

To me personally–and this is only personally–the greatest problem in using in vitro is the multiple embryos always created and the fact that many of these end up disposed of, used for experimentation or “fast-frozen” for decades. If they do replace all embryos conceived into a woman’s uterus, she usually ends up with a grand-multiple pregnancy–either resulting in her agreeing to selective reduction or if she refuses and is pregnant with say 6 or 7 babies–or like the “Octamom” with 8–there’s simply no way, even with the best medical care, that any woman can carry that many babies at one time to term. Thus they end up born severely prematurely–with all the serious health and developmental issues this entails. Is it really fair to knowingly set your babies up for such things by having a procedure like in vitro? Any woman–even a non-Catholic woman–who respects life and would think of any child that she helped conceive as her baby from that moment of conception–should really remember the above before she goes with in vitro. I accept that not everyone agrees with the teachings of the Catholic church, but still–we ARE talking about a woman’s baby/babies here–and one/ones she obviously wanted enough to be willing consider going to extraordinary lengths to conceive!!
 
Hopefully, one day, some method of assisting couples who have fertility issues to be able to conceive will be discovered that can be adapted to fit in with Catholic teaching. It’s an area where science, faith and compassion could come together to provide a true blessing in many people’s lives.
They already have. The Pope Paul VI Institute works with techniques known collectively as “NaPro (Natural Procreative) Technology”. I am most familiar with their innovative surgical techniques, which use minimally invasive surgery that is more effective at treating endometriosis and PCOS than previous surgical technique.
 
Yes, because such a step demonstrates that she is not sincere. To enter the Church sacramentally while rejecting the moral teaching of the Church would be a situation one does not even want to think about. Advise her to speak to a priest pronto.
Linus2nd
Don’t assume that she is necessarily rejecting the moral teaching of the Church. Chances are, she is completely unaware that the Church has any teaching at all against IVF. But yes, she should talk to a priest; and it sounds as though the OP (her sponsor) is also going to advise her about the Church teachings.
 
Don’t assume that she is necessarily rejecting the moral teaching of the Church. Chances are, she is completely unaware that the Church has any teaching at all against IVF. But yes, she should talk to a priest; and it sounds as though the OP (her sponsor) is also going to advise her about the Church teachings.
And some can even talk to a Priest and be told it’s okay as long
as there are no embryos created that won’t be used. A friend
of mine got her Priest’s okay and so she went to a fertility clinic that does
fresh cycles, no frozen embryos and only created the one embryo they would implant.
She’s had 3 children this way. She lucked out and only had to do one
round of ivf with each child. It was quite the success story. She and
her husband are very active in their Parish and adore their Priest.
When I’ve shared this story here before I’ve been told her Priest
should be reported to the Bishop…
 
Yes, because such a step demonstrates that she is not sincere. To enter the Church sacramentally while rejecting the moral teaching of the Church would be a situation one does not even want to think about. Advise her to speak to a priest pronto.

Linus2nd
How do you know that she is even aware of the Churches teachings on life and IVF? RCIA just started for most parishes for the year.
 
Even if 1 embryo is implanted successfully and none discarded, the procedure is still immoral.

My cousin has two children already through ivf. I only learned about this after the fact and I didn’t bring up Church teaching to her and her spouse since they were non-catholics. I will definitely bring this up to her by tomorrow
 
I texted my cousin repeatedly to contact me. She has not contacted me in the past few weeks. I even texted her links to articles about the immorality involved with in vitro fertilization. I can’t in good conscience continue to be her rcia sponsor if she spurns Church teachings. I am assuming that she held her appointing with the fertility clinic a few weeks ago
 
I texted my cousin repeatedly to contact me. She has not contacted me in the past few weeks. I even texted her links to articles about the immorality involved with in vitro fertilization. I can’t in good conscience continue to be her rcia sponsor if she spurns Church teachings. I am assuming that she held her appointing with the fertility clinic a few weeks ago
This is precisely the sort of the worst case scenario that I was afraid would happen and alluded to in my earlier post, having seen it happen before myself. Your cousin–if at the point of actually scheduling the procedure, had already invested a lot of money and time in all the precursors such as the hormonal therapy that is required to help her achieve a lasting pregnancy with in vitro. I’m sure that she and her husband had also spent a lot of time emotionally investing in the potential of her becoming pregnant and them at last having the family that they both probably desperately want. She may just not be ready to accept Catholic teaching on this specific area at this time in her life–even if she could accept every other teaching without problem. Truthfully, if she achieves a pregnancy through in vitro–she may always be a bit glad that she opted to do in vitro–it’s hard for someone to be truly repentant for doing something that ends in them having a child that they very much desire. That’s just human nature, y’know… But pray for her and perhaps at some later point if she is truly called to convert, she will then decide to go ahead and do so. Sometimes it’s these teachings surrounding birth control or fertility issues that are the biggest stumbling blocks for non-Catholics who show interest in the Catholic faith–about all you can do is pray for them and show them love and compassion. Good luck…🤷
 
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