My daughters baptism

[Adamski]

My daughter is 5 my wife doesn’t believe in infant baptism and I thought I would be patient currently my daughter is asking to get baptized and said it is because she loves jesus. and my wife said she can’t get baptized in the Catholic Church only in my wife’s non denominational church I feel I have been been kind by waiting there is a baptism preparation class on Sunday. My wife said she will be very angry at me if I go. I feel that as a good leader I should attend

 

[Xantippe]

Unless there’s some kind of family responsibility you are shirking by going or she has a suggestion as to a more convenient time, you should go.

Tell your wife, "I’m going so that I know everything I need to know and so that if you change your mind, we’ll be able to have DD baptized immediately. What’s the harm in going to a class?

Also, ideally you’d get a sitter and both of you would attend the baptismal class together. You can also agree to meet with her pastor to hear what baptism means in her particular non-denomination. (And don’t argue with the pastor, but feel free to ask him a lot of questions about his theology of baptism, which I suspect is not very well-developed.) Tell your wife that both of you need to gather information and think, and that doing the class and meeting the pastor are part of that process. Also, perhaps the two of you should together attend both a baptism in a Catholic church as well as a baptism at her church?

It’s quite possible that even if she’s stubborn, she’ll realize, “Wow! Baptism is a much bigger deal in the Catholic Church” or (and admittedly this is a little shallow), “Wow! A Catholic baptism is much more festive and fun!”

If DD gets much bigger, she’ll need to do a class herself for baptism. Is she in CCD?

 

[Xantippe]

If your daughter winds up somehow being baptized in a Protestant church (it could easily happen), make sure that the formula used is correct and that you get a piece of paper with the appropriate information.

I was baptized in the Southern Baptist church as a teenager, and when I converted to Catholicism and married a Catholic, we had to hunt down my old Protestant pastor and get a piece of paper from him saying I had been baptized.

Remember, a valid Christian baptism is a valid Christian baptism.

If you can get your wife to look at the Catechism section on baptism, that would be great. You can volunteer to read any materials on baptism that her non-denomination produces. (Sorry, the term “non-denominational” cracks me up!)

 

[SuscipeMeDomine]

What did you and your wife decide about raising your child(ren) Catholic before you were married? Were you married in the Church and was she informed of your responsibility to bring up your children in the Catholic faith?

Or did you have some other kind of agreement?

Who is changing things, you or your wife?

 

[bitterhope]

I think you should go to the class and so should your wife, but if she still insists on your daughter being baptized in her church, ask your priest for advice on how it will affect her later sacraments. What will happen in two or three years and your daughter desires to make her First Communion? Will your wife not allow that either? If she is baptized in a non denominational church, will the Catholic Church allow her to make the other sacraments on time?

 

[jmr_1985]

My daughter is 5 my wife doesn’t believe in infant baptism and I thought I would be patient currently my daughter is asking to get baptized and said it is because she loves jesus. and my wife said she can’t get baptized in the Catholic Church only in my wife’s non denominational church I feel I have been been kind by waiting there is a baptism preparation class on Sunday. My wife said she will be very angry at me if I go. I feel that as a good leader I should attend

I think the best thing you can do is learn as much as possible about your faith. Dive in head first. Your wife’s problem is based upon misunderstandings she has about Catholicism. If you know your faith, you will be able to lovingly explain to her why she is incorrect.

I also highly suggest a Novena To The Virgin Mary Untier of Knots.
theholyrosary.org/maryundoerknots

 

[LongingSoul]

I think the best thing you can do is learn as much as possible about your faith. Dive in head first. Your wife’s problem is based upon misunderstandings she has about Catholicism. If you know your faith, you will be able to lovingly explain to her why she is incorrect.

This, I would suggest, is an excellent first place to start. Reading between the lines it sounds as though religion is a serious bone of contention between you and your wife that won’t be resolved through power playing. There is an old saying that ‘faith is caught not taught’ and as you develop more deeply in love of God, you will naturally develop the leadership qualities that good husbands and fathers need.

 

[Adamski]

What did you and your wife decide about raising your child(ren) Catholic before you were married? Were you married in the Church and was she informed of your responsibility to bring up your children in the Catholic faith?

Or did you have some other kind of agreement?

Who is changing things, you or your wife?/

My parents left the Catholic Church right after I was confirmed at 15 and I new very little because we only went to mass less than 5-10 times a year and I joined a non denominational church when I was 28 were I met my wife. I came back to the Catholic Church when I was 33 sat not taking communion for two years until my wife and I had our marriage recognized two years ago.

 

[opusAquinas]

I have heard many stories like yours, thank you for sharing your story here, please be assured of my prayers.

I know the class is coming up, however rather than rush to this class, risking division in your family (since your wife already told you she would be angry) perhaps take a step back and see where you can build. I know that your daughter’s Baptism is heavy on your heart right now but please take a step back and think about your marriage first because that is what is the hot-topic right now:

I heard a priest on a radio talk show give what I thought was beautiful advice. He took a phone call from a devout Catholic man who was very frustrated with his non-Catholic wife. The priest suggested that the man take a step back. He said that the man and his wife really had a lot in common! He suggested that instead of focusing on their differences, that the husband look at what they had in common and try and BUILD upon that.

Does your wife love God? Does your wife love Jesus Christ? Does your wife believe in the resurrection? Does your wife believe that Holy Scripture was divinely inspired? You can think of other things too of course. I am sure that you can think of many things that you share with your wife, these are wonderful things! Please compliment your wife! Tell her that she is a wonderful mother and that you admire her. Tell her that you admire her faith life and ask her to pray with you. Tell her that you admire her love for God.

Your marriage will grow through building. It seems that your wife does have an open heart since your marriage was recognized by the church a few years ago, that is a wonderful thing. I hope your wife knows how much you appreciate that she was open to that and that you love and honor her. Your daughter should be Baptized of course, however that can be done in a few months really, you need to work on your marriage right now.

You could, of course go to the Baptism class anyway and your wife will be furious. I don’t see that as good leadership but that is just my opinion. You can take it or leave it, as I am just an anonymous person on the internet. What I do see as good leadership in a family is a husband who tries to be a spiritual leader by inspiring his family! Let your wife know she is a good and faithful woman that you admire, and encourage her to grow in her faith! Encourage her to join prayer groups and to spend time in prayer. This is how you can lead her, not by making her angry. Just my two cents. God bless you.

On the other hand, if your daughter dies between now and the age of reason she may not be in heaven. On the other hand, you can wait - and if it is God’s will she will be baptized in time. I pray for your daughter.

 

[EasterJoy]

My parents left the Catholic Church right after I was confirmed at 15 and I new very little because we only went to mass less than 5-10 times a year and I joined a non denominational church when I was 28 were I met my wife. I came back to the Catholic Church when I was 33 sat not taking communion for two years until my wife and I had our marriage recognized two years ago.

Talk to your pastor. As an earlier poster noted, it is important to have a record of the baptism. If I am not mistaken, your daughter’s baptism will be recorded in the register of your parish, provided you report to your pastor that it was carried out in the correct manner, by whom, and where. She will have no trouble demonstrating the fact of her baptism in the future, even if it was at your wife’s church. Talk to your pastor about it, but do make sure the event is recorded officially.

Certainly, your pastor will want you to allow your daughter to be baptized in the church where your wife will allow it, if your wife forbids a Catholic baptism. As the Catholic parent, you will have to instruct her in the faith as well as your circumstances allow. Don’t believe me, though: Ask your priest how to handle this, and follow his instructions.

Also, if your daughter wants baptism and is not allowed it through no fault of hers, you can assure* her* that she will be counted among the baptized for as long as she keeps her intention and gets baptized at her first opportunity. Jesus will not let allow disputes between grown ups stand between Himself and his little ones who love him!

 

[Xantippe]

monicad,

Very good points.

monicad said:

“I don’t see that as good leadership but that is just my opinion.”

As a rule of thumb, if nobody’s following, it’s not good leadership.

 

[Phemie]

Talk to your pastor. As an earlier poster noted, it is important to have a record of the baptism. If I am not mistaken, your daughter’s baptism will be recorded in the register of your parish, provided you report to your pastor that it was carried out in the correct manner, by whom, and where. She will have no trouble demonstrating the fact of her baptism in the future, even if it was at your wife’s church. Talk to your pastor about it, but do make sure the event is recorded officially.

Such a baptism would not be recorded in the Catholic parish unless the person subsequently converted. It’s my understanding that most non-denominational churches don’t record baptism because it’s not viewed as a gateway to other sacraments as it is in the Catholic Church and a few non-Catholic denominations (Anglican, Lutheran, etc.)

 

[Bookcat]

One does *not *want to seek have the baptism done outside full communion with the Catholic Church -the child has the right to be Baptized into full communion -to be a Catholic.

---

When another Christian who is not Catholic Marries a Catholic Christian - they are informed of the Catholics Obligation in this matter.

Here from Canon Law:

1/ the Catholic party is to declare that he or she is prepared to remove dangers of defecting from the faith and is to make a sincere promise to do all in his or her power so that all offspring are baptized and brought up in the Catholic Church;

2/ the other party is to be informed at an appropriate time about the promises which the Catholic party is to make, in such a way that it is certain that he or she is truly aware of the promise and obligation of the Catholic party

vatican.va/archive/ENG1104/_INDEX.HTM

It is in “legal language there” cause it is well Canon Law. But it relates the reality involved.

Certainly things need to be treated with great love and gentleness and work for a peaceful solution. But I note the above for they may have forgotten that when they married such is part of the obligation of our Christian life.

Ones Pastor can be a good assistance here (and to help avoid marital strife etc)

Catechism of the Catholic Church:

1634 Difference of confession between the spouses does not constitute an insurmountable obstacle for marriage, when they succeed in placing in common what they have received from their respective communities, and learn from each other the way in which each lives in fidelity to Christ. But the difficulties of mixed marriages must not be underestimated. They arise from the fact that the separation of Christians has not yet been overcome. The spouses risk experiencing the tragedy of Christian disunity even in the heart of their own home. Disparity of cult can further aggravate these difficulties. Differences about faith and the very notion of marriage, but also different religious mentalities, can become sources of tension in marriage, especially as regards the education of children. The temptation to religious indifference can then arise.

1635 … the Catholic party confirms the obligations, which have been made known to the non-Catholic party, of preserving his or her own faith and ensuring the baptism and education of the children in the Catholic Church.

1636 Through ecumenical dialogue Christian communities in many regions have been able to put into effect a common pastoral practice for mixed marriages. Its task is to help such couples live out their particular situation in the light of faith, overcome the tensions between the couple’s obligations to each other and towards their ecclesial communities, and encourage the flowering of what is common to them in faith and respect for what separates them.

scborromeo.org/ccc/p2s2c3a7.htm#1633

 

[Xantippe]

Bookcat said:

“One does not want to seek have the baptism done outside full communion with the Catholic Church -the child has the right to be Baptized into full communion -to be a Catholic.”

One doesn’t want it, but given the wife’s affiliations, it may happen whether or not the OP wants it to.

I think the advice given concerns what to do if the wife goes ahead and has the child baptized at her non-denominational church, not encouragement to let her do so.

 

[Xantippe]

Bookcat said:

“When another Christian who is not Catholic Marries a Catholic Christian - they are informed of the Catholics Obligation in this matter.”

I believe that the OP and his wife did not initially have a Catholic marriage, so none of that would have happened–I believe he got a convalidation at a later point.

There’s also the consideration that if the wife adamantly refuses Catholic baptism for the child, and proceeding with the baptism against her wishes would quite likely jeopardize the marriage, what is the OP to do? Should he just let his child remain unbaptized until she is a legal adult? That also seems less than ideal.

 

[Bookcat]

Bookcat said:

“When another Christian who is not Catholic Marries a Catholic Christian - they are informed of the Catholics Obligation in this matter.”

I believe that the OP and his wife did not initially have a Catholic marriage, so none of that would have happened–I believe he got a convalidation at a later point.

There’s also the consideration that if the wife adamantly refuses Catholic baptism for the child, and proceeding with the baptism against her wishes would quite likely jeopardize the marriage, what is the OP to do? Should he just let his child remain unbaptized until she is a legal adult? That also seems less than ideal.

They still would have been ordinarily informed I would think of the obligation when the marriage was convalidated.

Yes it is a very *difficult *situation. Hence the pointing to the Pastor. All needs to be handled with truth, great care, love and gentleness. The Pastor can be of great help (they have likely too -lots of experience etc in these things…)

 

[Phemie]

Bookcat said:

“When another Christian who is not Catholic Marries a Catholic Christian - they are informed of the Catholics Obligation in this matter.”

I believe that the OP and his wife did not initially have a Catholic marriage, so none of that would have happened–I believe he got a convalidation at a later point.

There’s also the consideration that if the wife adamantly refuses Catholic baptism for the child, and proceeding with the baptism against her wishes would quite likely jeopardize the marriage, what is the OP to do? Should he just let his child remain unbaptized until she is a legal adult? That also seems less than ideal.

The answer is found in 1993’s "DIRECTORY FOR THE APPLICATION OF PRINCIPLES AND NORMS ON ECUMENISM"

1. In carrying out this duty of transmitting the Catholic faith to the children, the Catholic parent will do so with respect for the religious freedom and conscience of the other parent and with due regard for the unity and permanence of the marriage and for the maintenance of the communion of the family. If, notwithstanding the Catholic’s best efforts, the children are not baptized and brought up in the Catholic Church, the Catholic parent does not fall subject to the censure of Canon Law. At the same time, his/her obligation to share the Catholic faith with the children does not cease. It continues to make its demands, which could be met, for example, by playing an active part in contributing to the Christian atmosphere of the home; doing all that is possible by word and example to enable the other members of the family to appreciate the specific values of the Catholic tradition; taking whatever steps are necessary to be well informed about his/her own faith so as to be able to explain and discuss it with them; praying with the family for the grace of Christian unity as the Lord wills it.

 

[EnglishTeacher]

I think you should go to the class and so should your wife, but if she still insists on your daughter being baptized in her church, ask your priest for advice on how it will affect her later sacraments. What will happen in two or three years and your daughter desires to make her First Communion? Will your wife not allow that either? If she is baptized in a non denominational church, will the Catholic Church allow her to make the other sacraments on time?

Bookcat said:

“One does not want to seek have the baptism done outside full communion with the Catholic Church -the child has the right to be Baptized into full communion -to be a Catholic.”

One doesn’t want it, but given the wife’s affiliations, it may happen whether or not the OP wants it to.

I think the advice given concerns what to do if the wife goes ahead and has the child baptized at her non-denominational church, not encouragement to let her do so.

Given that the wife attends a non-denominational church, it is very unlikely that she is planning to have the child baptized. Most non-denominational churches don’t believe in infant baptism, and people in these churches aren’t normally baptized until they are at least an older child or a teenager, after they have been “saved” or “made a decision for Christ.”

 

[rinnie]

My daughter is 5 my wife doesn’t believe in infant baptism and I thought I would be patient currently my daughter is asking to get baptized and said it is because she loves jesus. and my wife said she can’t get baptized in the Catholic Church only in my wife’s non denominational church I feel I have been been kind by waiting there is a baptism preparation class on Sunday. My wife said she will be very angry at me if I go. I feel that as a good leader I should attend

I never understood why people would not want this grace of God given to a child, only an adult.

 

[Xantippe]

EnglishTeacher said:

“Given that the wife attends a non-denominational church, it is very unlikely that she is planning to have the child baptized.”

It is a 5-year-old, the child has been expressing a desire to be baptized, and the wife wants the child to be baptized at her church when/if the child is baptized, so it’s not all that unreasonable to think it might happen within the next several years. I suppose a lot depends on how early these particular non-denoms are willing to do baptism.