I’m not trying to justify anything. I am explaining my experience and how it was positive. I was also honest in that I disagree with how they view the NO even though I particularly do not like the NO Mass when compared to the TLM.So many people justify going to SSPX liturgies because their teachings are “solid” and the priests are firmly based upon Catholic teaching.
One cannot be solidly or firmly based in Catholic teaching while being in schism and out of communion with the Pope of Rome.
I mean that’s just like saying it’s okay to go to a sedavacantist liturgy because they are solidly Catholic.
There is no solidity out of communion with Christ’s Vicar on Earth.
What you need to do is get a hold of a priest who knows the TLM…usually those ordained before 1970. I will warn you, it is VERY hard to get it started and going. I am still in the process in my community but it’s like pulling teeth. People are very hostile to the Mass including priests even with SP. Don’t talk to the Bishop as there is no need to under the SP. Find a priest who will back you and start from there. Many prayers.Im sorry, I didnt mean to imply that the bishop is hostile to the idea. In the interest of charity I cannot state that the Bishop is “hiding” the mass just that it is frustrating and can seem like that is the case. One could say that the Bishop would be no friend to the traditional movement. The EF is not available closer but it is in demand, several of us have tried. I was toying with the idea of writing the Bishop a letter seeking his guidance, but I’m not sure how that would go over.
As long as your letter is respectful, as befits all communication with a nobleman, what have you got to lose?I was toying with the idea of writing the Bishop a letter seeking his guidance, but I’m not sure how that would go over.
You mean like the hundreds of Orthodox bishops are today?Could you explain how four bishops can be in schism without being excommunicated ?
This is what Canon Law states:Interesting thread.
How does the whole licit/illicit/valid/invalid thing apply to those who have been called by the Holy Spirit to exceed the minimum weekly adult requirement for Mass attendance?
If one regularly fulfills his Sunday obligation by attending Mass in his diocesan parish, is that person allowed to attend daily Mass and receive Holy Communion [Mon-Sat] at an SSPX chapel that is located within the boundaries of his own parish?
To avoid jeopardy under Canon Law, is it necessary to devote more hours per week to one’s diocesan parish than to all others combined? Is it possible that a person may be forced to reduce his mass attendance under threat of legal action? How do the various parties assert and/or enforce their rights?
Can. 844 §2 Whenever necessity requires or a genuine spiritual advantage commends it, and provided the danger of error or indifferentism is avoided, Christ’s faithful for whom it is physically or morally impossible to approach a catholic minister, may lawfully receive the sacraments of penance, the Eucharist and anointing of the sick from non catholic ministers in whose Churches these sacraments are valid.
Can. 1248 §1 The obligation of assisting at Mass is satisfied wherever Mass is celebrated in a catholic rite either on a holyday itself or on the evening of the previous day.
§2 If it is impossible to assist at a eucharistic celebration, either because no sacred minister is available or for some other grave reason, the faithful are strongly recommended to take part in a liturgy of the Word, if there be such in the parish church or some other sacred place, which is celebrated in accordance with the provisions laid down by the diocesan Bishop; or to spend an appropriate time in prayer, whether personally or as a family or, as occasion presents, in a group of families.
The position of the SSPX is unique, and very unlike the position that we see in the Orthodox. To look at them as equals in their transgressions would be an error.You mean like the hundreds of Orthodox bishops are today?
Yup, you know the state. I suppose I could see if one of the other priests in the valley could do it but at my parish there is a new priest and another priest who does not know the extraoridnary form. Ultimately I just want to experience the Mass in the “old form” so what I would like is to go to one and then decide if I wish to pursue the ratsnest of trying to get one closer. A trip to IF is not in my immediate future as it is too far to leave my family for a while.Catholicpotatoe, have you tried asking the priest at your church directly? If he knows how to do a Latin Mass, he can preform one whenever he wants, as far as I know. A couple years back, if I remember correctly, the Pope said that priests could preform the Latin Mass without having to gain permission with their bishops. From what I had read about it, I’m pretty sure the reason the Pope did it was because bishops weren’t easily allowing priests to do it, so he went around them and just let the priests decide. And if you live where I think you live, I think I may live in the same place…Big western state, large population in one valley (at the bottom of the state, right?) one bishop over a bunch of us…I was thinking of asking the priest at my parish if he know anything about the Latin Mass, and I was going to ask around and see if anyone else wanted one, too. Good luck! If anyone knows I’m wrong about priests being allowed to do it, feel free to correct me!
~Maria
To many people here the notion of a Mass being “illicit” means next to nothing.There is no question as to whether an SSPX liturgy is valid, but it is illicit, or unlawful.
I hate to say it but you must not know about the SSPX if you think they aren’t in schism. They are. THey are another one of those seperate groups that started out Catholic, however they showed disobedience to John Paul II and became schismatic.. Please do not babble when you don’t even know what words you are spewing. I do not wish to argue this anymore…see the tired thread.
=Catholicpotato;7589695]For the longest time I have been interested in going to a “latin Mass” I live in a big western state, most of the population is in one valley, the Bishop has seen fit to make a EF Mass available once a month in a little town, 5-6 hours away. That would be a 10-12 hour round trip on a Sunday, I have a wife and three small ones. My frustration is that in a state where there are many parishes in one area that could and would draw a favorable number of people to the EF why is it that the EF is offered out in the boonies. Almost as if it is a reluctant concession.
There is a SSPX Mass, 1 hour from my home. Would it be disobedient of me to go to the SSPX to educate myself and experience an EF Mass?
IN CHARITY, write a BRIEF letter [no more than 1 page] to your Bishop, asking for his assistane and guidence. Be sure to INCLUDE ALL of yor personal Contact info…PS
- I wish to be obedient to my Bishop and Rome.
- I have always had a sympathy to SSPX, not out of their disobedience, but out of their devotion to the Tradition. I dont condone their tactics, but I do respect their love. I want normalized relations with Rome. I side with Rome no matter what.
The Bishops were excommunicated, however the group as a whole is schismatic. Which means that they are bishops with valid sacraments, however they are not bishops in the true Church. The clergy of the SSPX are suspended (as Timothysis has already said) and each time they have a public liturgy they are committing an act of disobedience.Could you explain how four bishops can be in schism without being excommunicated ?
You are correct about the excommunication. Please read the following article to find your answer concerning your questions about “if” the SSPX are indeed schismatic or not.I must note that (I believe, I am not sure though) that Pope Benedict has lifted the excommunication of the four Bishops, but did not lift the schism of the group.
Priests being without canonical status aren’t necessarily being schismatic. Individually anyone can be, depending on his motives, SSPX or otherwise.The Bishops were excommunicated, however the group as a whole is schismatic.
Yay! Off topic for a second here, I’ve never heard of the ICYC. I am going on the Anaheim Youth Conference, though, in March. Well, I hope we can both be able to get a Latin Mass going closer to home! It would be much nicer. I didn’t even realize there was one in the diocese. I still have to ask my priest if he knows it, but I doubt it, seeing as how him and the other priest at my parish are both fairly new priests. I think both have been ordained for 5 years or less…but you never know!Yup, you know the state. I suppose I could see if one of the other priests in the valley could do it but at my parish there is a new priest and another priest who does not know the extraoridnary form. Ultimately I just want to experience the Mass in the “old form” so what I would like is to go to one and then decide if I wish to pursue the ratsnest of trying to get one closer. A trip to IF is not in my immediate future as it is too far to leave my family for a while.
PS. ICYC is this weekend are you familiar with it?
PPS. blue and orange forever!
This is a very important point that those who support the sspx breeze past.The clergy of the SSPX are suspended and each time they have a public liturgy they are committing an act of disobedience.
I’m not blind. You really don’t know what you are talking about. If the SSPX is schismatic please show me the documentation. It’s a big word to be throwing around as easily as you do. The SSPX are within the Church. Don’t talk about things that you have no clue about.I hate to say it but you must not know about the SSPX if you think they aren’t in schism. They are. THey are another one of those seperate groups that started out Catholic, however they showed disobedience to John Paul II and became schismatic.
Please do not blindly accuse me of not knowing what I am talking about.
I know they are suspended and have no ministry at this time. You stated they are in schism. That is false.The Bishops were excommunicated, however the group as a whole is schismatic. Which means that they are bishops with valid sacraments, however they are not bishops in the true Church. The clergy of the SSPX are suspended (as Timothysis has already said) and each time they have a public liturgy they are committing an act of disobedience.
I must note that (I believe, I am not sure though) that Pope Benedict has lifted the excommunication of the four Bishops, but did not lift the schism of the group.
I know they are suspended and have no ministry at this time. You stated they are in schism. That is false.
All followers of Lefebrve “Incur the very grave penalty of excommunication.”I’m not blind. You really don’t know what you are talking about. If the SSPX is schismatic please show me the documentation. It’s a big word to be throwing around as easily as you do. The SSPX are within the Church. Don’t talk about things that you have no clue about.