My faith is better than your faith

[FCEGM]

I’ve hung out on enough Non-Catholic Christian boards to know what many believe. They certainly don’t believe Peter was the rock on which the church was built. To many the rock is the truth that Jesus was indeed the Messiah, the Son of God.

Ignorance of Scripture or a different interpretation?

It’s the inability to understand Scripture with the mind of the Church that alone has the authority to authentically interpret it because it alone was established by Christ.

The question to you, Mike, is whether or not you agree with the Church or with those who differ from Catholic teaching? Since you say you are a Catholic your answer should arise from knowledge that there IS truth to be known and that Christ through His Church gives us sure knowledge of His Truth.

 

[guanophore]

Ah, what is the faith of Christ? Many claim to have it and do have it. Who’s to say the CC hasn’t departed from what Christ taught? Now, I don’t believe that, but many non-Catholic Christians do. Maybe all Christians have the faith of Christ, there just is some difference in interpretation of some his messages.

Inded, you have claimed that. Just asking this question, you are saying that. If you are purporting that people who have abandoned the Apostolic Teaching arethe ones that have the faith of Christ, and those to whom it was promised that they should be guided into all truth have “departed from” it then you yourself have departed from Catholicism.

I agree that all Christians have some of the Truth of Christ. That is why they are called our brethren. Everyone who is validly baptised is joined to the One Church. Some more properly than others.

The interpretation of the message needs to be done in the light of the perspective of those to whom the message was entrusted. It only leads to more falsehood when the message is separated from those to whom it was committed. All kinds of heresies arise, including one frequented here, that being born again has nothing to do with water!

 

[mikew262]

A person is not a Catholic just because they call themselves one. A person is Catholic if one embraces the Teachings of Christ through the Apostles. This you have clearly not done.

First of all, I’m a Catholic because I was a baptized one. Second of all, I’m secure that I do (or try to) embrace the teachings of Christ. Am I perfect in that regard, certainly not, but I try. Thirdly, how dare you judge me on whether I’m a good Catholic or not?

All I’'ve tried to do is encourage my fellow Catholics and non-Catholics on this board to try get out of this “My faith is better than yours” mindset. It’s silly, petty, and accomplishes nothing. To Catholics, the truth has been revealed to them through the CC. To other Christians, the truth has been revealed to them in other ways. I for one, will not question God’s intentions on how he reveals himself to people. Some posters understand this, others, such as yourself do not.

 

[guanophore]

I find truth in the Catholic Church, as do you; this is why I’m still Catholic. I can’t speak for the Christian who finds truth in the Methodist Church down the street. I can’t speak for him, nor will I condemn his choice. I sometimes fail in that regard, but that is my own weakness.

I would not speak for him either. I spent 6 years in a fervent, faithful, and growthful Methodist community. I can attest that truth is found there. I do not condemn those that settle for part of the truth, either. Most of them don’t realize they are settling. I did not.

However, the truth that is found in the Methodist Church is found there because it came to them from the catholic church. The part that is missing is because they threw out part of the Apostolic Teaching.

 

[guanophore]

I’ve hung out on enough Non-Catholic Christian boards to know what many believe. They certainly don’t believe Peter was the rock on which the church was built. To many the rock is the truth that Jesus was indeed the Messiah, the Son of God.

Ignorance of Scripture or a different interpretation?

No, my point is that this was one of the things in your short list of what we all agree on. If you follow the blue arrows next to the name back, you can see where you posted that we should all focus on where we agree, and this was one of the points stated.

I think it is a different interpretation, I am not sure I would chalk it up to ignorance. I think this must be done deliberately in order to reject the Apostolic Succession.

It is a difference in the way the faith is received. Those in the Apostolic Faiths receive it from those to whom it was committed, and understand the scripture in the light of what they teach. Protestants reject this, and interpret scripture each according to what is right in his own eyes.

 

[guanophore]

I am a Christian and I practice my faith in the Catholic Church.

Well, only God is the judge of that. I can only note that your statements contradict Catholic Teaching,and leave it at that.

I find it hard to believe (no not really) the arrogance that some of my fellow Catholics have to actually believe the Catholic Church is the one best way to salvation and have almost no regard for the other Christian faiths (maybe overstating some, but you got my dandruff up). I believe my faith is very strong, in the Christian sense. Could it be stronger, sure it can and I try to work on that.

How is it arrogant to believe that what Christ revealed is the one best way to salvation? It seems to me that it is a great act of humility…

I am a Catholic Christian and that’s how I practice my faith, but I’m also not blind to the real possibility that the Catholic faith is not necessarily the only positive way to salvation and Christ.

I think you are confusing fullness of faith with “only”. The Catholic Church teaches that truth is found in other faith communiites, and that the HS uses these communities to draw people to God. If you would refer to your Catechism, you will see this clearly. Once you do that, perhaps you will not be upset by bigoted people who say things that are contrary to Church teaching, or at least you will not confuse their bigotry with what the Church teaches?

May God enlighten you and the ones that think like you. All of you are in my prayers.

And you also! I hope that reading what the Church really teaches will enlighten you.

 

[guanophore]

Do tell me which other churches the Catholic church has acknowledged as having Apostolic succession? Certainly not the Lutherans or Episcopalian/Anglicans.

Orthodox, primarily, and oriental churches who may not currently be in union with the orthordox or Catholic, due primarily to political and geographical issues.

 

[mikew262]

It’s the inability to understand Scripture with the mind of the Church that alone has the authority to authentically interpret it because it alone was established by Christ.

The question to you, Mike, is whether or not you agree with the Church or with those who differ from Catholic teaching? Since you say you are a Catholic your answer should arise from knowledge that there IS truth to be known and that Christ through His Church gives us sure knowledge of His Truth.

I feel the Catholic Church comes the closest to what God had in mind and its how I choose to worship God. I also realize not everybody shares that opinion and thus they worship differently than me. Does the Church have a lock on the truth or has it possibly somehow misinterpreted any of Christ’s teachings somewhere down the road (like it accuses other Christian institutions)? I don’t really know that for sure and neither does anybody else. We’ll find out in the afterlife.

I’m a generic Christian first and Catholicism is how I choose practice my Christianity. As I said above, I’m a believer in Christ and I believe the CC comes the closest to what Jesus had in mind. However, I respect other Christian’s choices in finding their relationship with Christ, and as I mentioned before I will not second guess how God reveals himself to other people.

 

[jay29]

I mentioned before I will not second guess how God reveals himself to other people.

But you sure as heck second guess how He reveals His truth! The CC does have a lock on the fullness of the truth.

 

[mikew262]

Well, only God is the judge of that.

Yes, that’s entirely true, so why don’t we leave the judging to him. Now my annoyance and frustration is growing, so I’m going to disengage for the time being. God Bless.

 

[jay29]

Yes, that’s entirely true, so why don’t we leave the judging to him. Now my annoyance and frustration is growing, so I’m going to disengage for the time being. God Bless.

How are we supposed to teach right from wrong???

 

[mikew262]

But you sure as heck second guess how He reveals His truth! The CC does have a lock on the fullness of the truth.

Nope, not at all. As I said, I will not second guess how God reveals his truth to anybody. If God has revealed to you that the CC has the fullness of truth and if that’s what you believe, then so be it and happy for you.

 

[mikew262]

How are we supposed to teach right from wrong???

Ok, I’ll answer you and then I’ll stop. You go with what you believe to be true according to your conscious and faith. This is what we all do believe it or not. Your conscious and faith has led you to the CC. Somebody else’s has led them to be a Methodist. There is nothing wrong with pointing out the differences to somebody of a different faith; if it’s mean’t to be then that person may convert. However crossing the line by stating what they believe is wrong and a heresy and causing conflict accomplishes nothing positive.

 

[guanophore]

Ah, what is the faith of Christ?

That which was handed down to us from the Apostles.

Many claim to have it and do have it.

In various degrees, of course.

Who’s to say the CC hasn’t departed from what Christ taught?

All anti-Catholics must say this, in order to justify the departure from Apostolic Teaching.

Now, I don’t believe that, but many non-Catholic Christians do.

Your posts indicate otherwise. Your presistent assertion that “we have no way of knowing” is in itself a departure from Apostolic Teaching.

Maybe all Christians have the faith of Christ, there just is some difference in interpretation of some his messages.

No, it is more than a difference of opinion. some outright reject Apostolic Teaching, or at least sufficient degrees of it to justify departure from it. this is the whole basis from Protestantism, upon which all the current denominations are based.

 

[guanophore]

Indeed, you have claimed that other Christian communities have an equally authentic expression of God’s truth, and should be respected as such. This kind of relativism is what makes Catholics leave the Church.

Just asking this question, you are saying that the Catholic Church has departed. If you are purporting that people who have abandoned the Apostolic Teaching arethe ones that have the faith of Christ, and those to whom it was promised that they should be guided into all truth have “departed from” it then you yourself have departed from Catholicism.

I agree that all Christians have some of the Truth of Christ. That is why they are called our brethren. Everyone who is validly baptised is joined to the One Church. Some more properly than others.

The interpretation of the message needs to be done in the light of the perspective of those to whom the message was entrusted. It only leads to more falsehood when the message is separated from those to whom it was committed. All kinds of heresies arise, including one frequented here, that being born again has nothing to do with water!

 

[jay29]

However crossing the line by stating what they believe is wrong and a heresy and causing conflict accomplishes nothing positive.

So was the Council of Trent wrong in BLASTING the heresies of the ‘reformation’?

 

[guanophore]

First of all, I’m a Catholic because I was a baptized one.

Not necessarily. A person who is baptized Catholic can apostasize (fall away from their faith), or reject their faith. Does it do any good to claim one is a “Catholic” in such a state?

Second of all, I’m secure that I do (or try to) embrace the teachings of Christ. Am I perfect in that regard, certainly not, but I try. Thirdly, how dare you judge me on whether I’m a good Catholic or not?

I cannot, and if my post seemed to do so, I apologize. All I can say is that the content of your posts does not reflect Catholic Teaching.

All I’'ve tried to do is encourage my fellow Catholics and non-Catholics on this board to try get out of this “My faith is better than yours” mindset.

With all due respect, this is your perception, and not our mindset! You are the only one who can get yourself out of it. That will not happen as long as you are trapped in relativism.

It's silly, petty, and accomplishes nothing.

Well, what are you going to do about it? Are you willing to start posting what Catholics believe? Are you willing to take your faith seriously, and not water it down in order to feel warm and fuzzy with those who reject it?

To Catholics, the truth has been revealed to them through the CC.  To other Christians, the truth has been revealed to them in other ways.  I for one, will not question God's intentions on how he reveals himself to people.  Some posters understand this, others, such as yourself do not.

I will not question God’s methods either. He brought me through a 20 year sojourn in Protestant (some rabidly anti-catholic) communities back the His Holy Bride. Throughout all that, He revealed Himself to me, and I am very grateful to have returned. Does that mean I am arrogant? No, on the contrary, I am only grateful to the mercy of God.

I don’t know where you get the idea from anything I wrote that I think Truth comes anywhere but from God.

 

[pigtown]

I have to toss in my 2 cents worth. A person who was baptized in a Catholic Church by a Catholic priest is a Catholic even if they never set foot in a Catholic church after the baptism, unless this has changed in the past several years. My first husband was baptized in a Catholic Church because it was the closest church to where his parents lived. He never stepped foot inside a Catholic Church until the day of our wedding rehearsal. When I talked to my priest about it he said that since he was baptized Catholic, he is Catholic no matter what.

 

[guanophore]

I have to toss in my 2 cents worth. A person who was baptized in a Catholic Church by a Catholic priest is a Catholic even if they never set foot in a Catholic church after the baptism, unless this has changed in the past several years. My first husband was baptized in a Catholic Church because it was the closest church to where his parents lived. He never stepped foot inside a Catholic Church until the day of our wedding rehearsal. When I talked to my priest about it he said that since he was baptized Catholic, he is Catholic no matter what.

Yes, I understand and accept this. HOwever, mikew is talking about rejecting Catholic faith, and is producing commentary that is “protesting” what the Church teaches. If he chooses to embrace beliefs that are not Catholic then his beliefs no longer (if ever they did) reflect Catholic Teaching. What benefit is there to claiming one is Catholic when one openly denies the Church teachings?

 

[Veritas248]

Wow, this place has become a battlefield!
I’ve nothing else to say that I’ve not already said before.