My gifted daughter is getting very average grades

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Also want to mention that I did not show my negativity to my daughter. I focused on her good grades and didn’t make a big deal out of the lesser ones.

I tried very hard to be tactful.

I’ll do the same with the teacher tomorrow 😉
 
PaulinVA said:
I don’t think there is a positive correlation between IQ and school performance.

It’s that simple.
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THIS.
My daughter had the opposite problem. Straight A’s but tested poorly.
One has little to do with the other.
I’ve worked in a school. The parents that people dreaded were the ones that made it clear that their children can do no wrong, and are brilliant, unlike the other kids.
Perhaps she IS brilliant!
But don’t come down hard on the teacher. A child generally earns their grades.
 
It is possible that she doesn’t like to read at this stage in life, though she might be good at it. Or perhaps it is the reading material that does not interest her. People that are “gifted” in my opinion are “special needs” children. They are a challenge for teachers and require perhaps a more customized environment to thrive in. That is my view, anyways.

One definition I learned from sports psychology that also applies in academics is that performance = skill x motivation.

I think it is a decent little framework with which to view a situation from.

Perhaps she hasn’t yet found her “niche” or something that really touches her heart in a personal way regarding the world of reading. Help her explore that universe a bit.
 
I might add: When writing notes to the teacher(s)
it’s customary to call them by their formal titles: For example: Mrs. Robertson, and not by their first names. It’s just courtesy. and will make your working relationship better. If, while together she says “please, call me Olivia” then do! But in written correspondence, show respect for her profession.
Unless she’s your sister… 😃
 
Serap said:
No it’s related to the discrepancy in her report card from last night and her psych-ed test in December.

I don’t understand how a person who reads at a Grade 6 level gets a C in reading in Grade 2. It makes no logical sense to me.

I’m completely puzzled by it.
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Are those multiple-choice or open tests?
pianistclare said:
THIS.
My daughter had the opposite problem. Straight A’s but tested poorly.
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A lot depends on the type of tests. The Mensa crowd loves talking about culturally fair or neutral testing, which typically means some weird sort of geometry. Well, it may be culturally fair, but it isn’t fair in a number of other ways. For example, I can’t really get much more than 120 in those, but I can get lucky and approach 170 in a more old-fashioned test with words and normal numbers.
 
serap, how are you still puzzled by this? people have given you plenty of possible reasons for the discrepancy, none of which are uncommon or illogical at all. I’m worried much more about the fact that you are unable to separate intelligence from grades.

do a google search for “telling kids they’re smart” or something along those lines, and read some of the results - there have been tons of studies that show telling kids they’re smart leads to less creativity and effort and risk taking, because they’ve been conditioned to believe if they’re so smart they should know the answer right away with minimal effort.

you need to be praising or reprimanding your daughter on her EFFORT, and on her willingness to learn new things or get out of her comfort zone while solving problems, not on her grades.
 
When in 4th grade, my daughter read at a 12th grade level. She earned average grades. I later learned that, since she was so bored, she would sneak novels under her desk and read all day long. Since I was unwilling to put her in a higher classroom with more mature kids, I pulled her out and started homeschooling. It’s the best thing I ever did. You may want to consider it.
 
insideitall said:
serap, how are you still puzzled by this? people have given you plenty of possible reasons for the discrepancy, none of which are uncommon or illogical at all. I’m worried much more about the fact that you are unable to separate intelligence from grades.

do a google search for “telling kids they’re smart” or something along those lines, and read some of the results - there have been tons of studies that show telling kids they’re smart leads to less creativity and effort and risk taking, because they’ve been conditioned to believe if they’re so smart they should know the answer right away with minimal effort.

you need to be praising or reprimanding your daughter on her EFFORT, and on her willingness to learn new things or get out of her comfort zone while solving problems, not on her grades.
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Exactly. You seem to be very hung up on this testing and high IQ and not realizing that high level of intelligence does not necessarily mean good grades.

More importantly, high intelligence or good grades don’t necessarily mean success in life either.

When people get worked up about their elementary school aged child’s academic achievements (other than maybe addressing an actual learning disability) I often want to ask what sort of difference do they actually think this makes in the long run. It’s elementary school, not PhD comps.

I work at an ivy-league institution with many people who would have been considered average or below-average students when they were children (myself included). To my knowledge, nobody ever tested my IQ since it really didn’t make any difference.
 
pianistclare said:
I might add: When writing notes to the teacher(s)
it’s customary to call them by their formal titles: For example: Mrs. Robertson, and not by their first names. It’s just courtesy. and will make your working relationship better. If, while together she says “please, call me Olivia” then do! But in written correspondence, show respect for her profession.
Unless she’s your sister… 😃
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She told me to call her Olivia. We are on great terms.

Thanks though, you’re right about that.
 
insideitall said:
serap, how are you still puzzled by this? people have given you plenty of possible reasons for the discrepancy, none of which are uncommon or illogical at all. I’m worried much more about the fact that you are unable to separate intelligence from grades.

do a google search for “telling kids they’re smart” or something along those lines, and read some of the results - there have been tons of studies that show telling kids they’re smart leads to less creativity and effort and risk taking, because they’ve been conditioned to believe if they’re so smart they should know the answer right away with minimal effort.

you need to be praising or reprimanding your daughter on her EFFORT, and on her willingness to learn new things or get out of her comfort zone while solving problems, not on her grades.
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:rolleyes:

I’m doing all of that, but thank you
 
PhiloMed said:
Exactly. You seem to be very hung up on this testing and high IQ and not realizing that high level of intelligence does not necessarily mean good grades.

More importantly, high intelligence or good grades don’t necessarily mean success in life either.

When people get worked up about their elementary school aged child’s academic achievements (other than maybe addressing an actual learning disability) I often want to ask what sort of difference do they actually think this makes in the long run. It’s elementary school, not PhD comps.

I work at an ivy-league institution with many people who would have been considered average or below-average students when they were children (myself included). To my knowledge, nobody ever tested my IQ since it really didn’t make any difference.
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thanks.

we got her tested b/c we thought she had a learning disability.
 
I have stayed away from the two threads about this subject for the whole time.😉 Because threads where parents are talking about their kids academic or mental performance rarely are logical or end well.😉

OP
  1. An IQ that high is on the extreme end of the spectrum. And in medicine or any science really, when you have a result that is extreme, you retest from a different source.
  2. Many parents who have been told at such a young age that their children are phenomenal and then the child does not perform experience a damaging effect with relationships with their children. I think you should step back and decide if this is affecting how you relate with your child.
  3. 2nd grade is hardly a time to focus on Cs or any grade really. Many schools do not assign letter grades at this time.
  4. With a 6th grade comprehension of reading and logic the child would, even if bored, be able to get the work done to get the positive attention and just be done with it.
  5. I would encourage you to rethink your focus on numbers and scales of achievement for a second grader.
  6. No matter how you say you package it for your kid, they know. If we can see your anguish and confusion and fretting on a computer screen, your child can feel it thick in the air of the home.
 
Serap said:
No it’s related to the discrepancy in her report card from last night and her psych-ed test in December.

I don’t understand how a person who reads at a Grade 6 level gets a C in reading in Grade 2. It makes no logical sense to me.

I’m completely puzzled by it.
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Because she doesn’t cough up the answers they ask/want in their grading system.

Really, it’s that simple.

Could be that no matter what her reading level is, her comprehension is different. Or that the things she notices are different than what they are testing on.

Some people who are gifted in recognizing patterns, tones etc in music…geniuses in that area don’t like or listen to certain music, have no interest in it, or only experience it in a mathematical sense.

I am gifted, hated school and refused to go to college, then ended up as a teacher (go figure).

My gifted son would only apply himself when he felt like it, in the subjects he cared to, and for the teachers he respected. IQ refers to one’s ability to learn, but has nothing to do with one’s motivation, personal quirks, and preferences.

I suspect that if YOU applied yourself in every area you showed any apptitude in, you might excel in them, but perhaps you aren’t interested in them etc.
 
Hoosier_Daddy said:
I have stayed away from the two threads about this subject for the whole time.😉 Because threads where parents are talking about their kids academic or mental performance rarely are logical or end well.😉

OP
  1. An IQ that high is on the extreme end of the spectrum. And in medicine or any science really, when you have a result that is extreme, you retest from a different source.
  2. Many parents who have been told at such a young age that their children are phenomenal and then the child does not perform experience a damaging effect with relationships with their children. I think you should step back and decide if this is affecting how you relate with your child.
  3. 2nd grade is hardly a time to focus on Cs or any grade really. Many schools do not assign letter grades at this time.
  4. With a 6th grade comprehension of reading and logic the child would, even if bored, be able to get the work done to get the positive attention and just be done with it.
  5. I would encourage you to rethink your focus on numbers and scales of achievement for a second grader.
  6. No matter how you say you package it for your kid, they know. If we can see your anguish and confusion and fretting on a computer screen, your child can feel it thick in the air of the home.
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Thanks for contributing 😉
 
schaeffer said:
Because she doesn’t cough up the answers they ask/want in their grading system.

Really, it’s that simple.

Could be that no matter what her reading level is, her comprehension is different. Or that the things she notices are different than what they are testing on.

Some people who are gifted in recognizing patterns, tones etc in music…geniuses in that area don’t like or listen to certain music, have no interest in it, or only experience it in a mathematical sense.

I am gifted, hated school and refused to go to college, then ended up as a teacher (go figure).

My gifted son would only apply himself when he felt like it, in the subjects he cared to, and for the teachers he respected. IQ refers to one’s ability to learn, but has nothing to do with one’s motivation, personal quirks, and preferences.

I suspect that if YOU applied yourself in every area you showed any apptitude in, you might excel in them, but perhaps you aren’t interested in them etc.
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This was extremely helpful. Thanks!
 
I just had a great conversation with a mental health nurse that works in my organization. She had the same issue with her kid (long ago) and it was all about engagement and understanding in the classroom.

My daughter hears and understands what the teacher says, but she is a little bored and therefore is not engaged…she goes to do the work and it seems like she wasn’t listening, b/c my daughter has so many ideas in her head, she forgets what the original instructions were. She tries to write it down, but she can no longer remember.

Or she reads the page and understands the bigger picture like what the moral of the story was or the theme…etc…but when asked specific things about what she read, it’s already out of her memory.

or she’s asked to write a story about her vacation with a beginning, middle and end and then she starts remembering all the details, her souvenirs, the food she ate and every idea leads to another idea. Then she forgets the focus of her paper; realizes it’s due in 10 minutes, and begins writing quickly about her vacation that vaguely resembles what the teacher had asked her to do.

Now I get it and it makes perfect sense.

I need to ask the teacher tonight…

How engaged does she appear during lessons?

Does she often seem distracted?

Does it appear that she’s not listening?

Then I need to explain to my daughter’s teacher that DD’s mind is extremely active and due to this, she has a hard time putting specific things into long term memory.

She’s not ADHD, but she’s definitely a dreamer and a thinker.
 
Serap said:
Then I need to explain to my daughter’s teacher that DD’s mind is extremely active and due to this, she has a hard time putting specific things into long term memory.

She’s not ADHD, but she’s definitely a dreamer and a thinker.
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Speaking as a gifted student, now raising 5 of them … you probably need to also explain to your DD that as wonderful as her imagination is, she needs to make sure she does/finishes what the teacher needs her to complete. One of mine had a great deal of success once it was established that when he had completed his assignment and met all the criteria ( “A” level work) then he could write a second story (or whatever) to HIS own standards (focusing on what he wanted to say rather than what they assignment required him to spit out).

It’s a challenge - good luck!
 
Serap said:
I just had a great conversation with a mental health nurse that works in my organization. She had the same issue with her kid (long ago) and it was all about engagement and understanding in the classroom.

My daughter hears and understands what the teacher says, but she is a little bored and therefore is not engaged…she goes to do the work and it seems like she wasn’t listening, b/c my daughter has so many ideas in her head, she forgets what the original instructions were. She tries to write it down, but she can no longer remember.

Or she reads the page and understands the bigger picture like what the moral of the story was or the theme…etc…but when asked specific things about what she read, it’s already out of her memory.
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Unfortunately, school grades sometimes have too much to do with showing obedience, interest etc. to the teacher as opposed to displaying knowledge. This includes knee-jerk Fs for failure to recall some trivia from compulsory material, down to the colour of a female heroine’s gloves in some kind of memorable scene, the crime here being that you didn’t read the thing or — and now that’s like contempt of court or something — you read but didn’t really care. Again, that’s knee-jerk grading.

People who invent and assign grades and tasks can sometimes fall victim of simple xenophobia, fear of otherness, and just grade students down for having a different type of brain, for thinking in different ways, different patterns (male vs female thinking being the most classic example).

They’re also human and liable to the whole range of human weaknesses. For example grading down the talented students who don’t care — because of, for example the grader’s own personal experience of having been a very diligent student who worked hard but wished he’d had more talent. Geniuses aren’t always well liked.

(For example, even though I no longer stand out like I used to (started declining around age 12 and continued ever since), I still get flak from people who just don’t like the breadth or depth of the subjects I talk about, especially in professional circles.)

I’m not saying this to accuse the teacher, but I’d still investigate what exactly the grades are based on and what they are supposed to represent. This can be hard to do without sounding like you’re interrogating the teacher.
 
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