My husband not interested in NFP

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RCCDefender:
My (former) priest said this to us, too. More than once. DH and I lived together before we were married; we were told that we had a conscience of morality and if we thought it was okay then it was. We lived together for almost four years before marriage and not once were we denied communion or told it was against Church teaching. Then we got married and had a baby (and, yes it was in that order 😛 ). After our baby we talked to the priest about contraception and he said we were not risking our souls if we did contracept. So, we did (barrier method).
We are both converts and just thought that our priest was right. We trusted him. I found out a couple of months ago how gravely wrong we (and he) were. I felt so betrayed. I cried.** I am still trying to “get right with God**.”
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Shame on that priest. Culpability for sin only begins with the enlightenment of the conscience or resistance to do so.

Once you get beyond the sadness and feelings of betrayal, you may very well feel an anger rising within you for those entrusted to the care of the Flock who have violated this sacred trust. Let this has become the Holy Spirit fuel for standing against the dissemnination of untruth under the misguided or otherwise pastoral guise of “compassion”, “loving thing to do”, “your unique and complex situation”, “surely God understands your heart”, “this is only between you, your spouse, and God”, …rationalizations for compromizing the true faith. Know that there are truly compassionate and Christ-like priest out there totally loyal to the Church who are willing to lay down their life for the Flock.
 
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SemperJase:
I’m biased. We use ABC for health reasons. It would be very dangerous for my wife and life threatening for any baby we have for us to get pregnant without thoroughly planning the conception.

I don’t believe God will send us to hell. Paul warned that one should get married rather than burn with lust. Birth Control was practiced in his day and his warnings about it are noticably absent.It seems contradictory to say get married, don’t burn with lust - but abstain and burn with lust if you need to avoid pregnancy.

But then again, I’m no theologian. This is actually the only issue I differ with the church. (OK the death penalty too, but that isn’t a sin.) There are too many contradictions for me to be comfortable with.
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The Church has been consistent for 2000 years on it’s prohibition against ABC in any form or method. Period. Granted, there have been representing the Church who have dissented or have failed to provide clear teaching for specific circumstances. This is no “health reason” medical exception for introducing contraceptive intercourse into the marital embrace. Period.

BTW – God does not send anyone to hell, a person sends themself to hell through the choices they make.

The reasons and arguments that you cite to engage in a grave sin are shallow and will not stand up against a serious investigation of what and why the Church teaches against ABC.
You would do your soul well to hang arounbd these CA forums and to get better informed. You can always start with a topic search of this and other threads for previous extensive discussions regarding this topic.
 
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SemperJase:
I’m biased. We use ABC for health reasons. It would be very dangerous for my wife and life threatening for any baby we have for us to get pregnant without thoroughly planning the conception.

I don’t believe God will send us to hell. Paul warned that one should get married rather than burn with lust. Birth Control was practiced in his day and his warnings about it are noticably absent.It seems contradictory to say get married, don’t burn with lust - but abstain and burn with lust if you need to avoid pregnancy.

But then again, I’m no theologian. This is actually the only issue I differ with the church. (OK the death penalty too, but that isn’t a sin.) There are too many contradictions for me to be comfortable with.
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I would never judge a couple using contraceptives nor say they are going to hell, but it is a serious sin that should not be taken lightly.

I think it is disingenuous to argue that NFP causes couples to “burn with lust.” If NFP is used to delay or, perhaps in the case of serious health risks, to avoid pregnancy, only a week of abstinance each month is necessary. There are plenty of other reasons someone may go a week or longer without making love with their spouse: illness, fatigue, the couple is separated by distance for some reason, pregnancy/birth/after birth, etc. I don’t see why family planning is not, in your view, an acceptable reason as well.

The Church has always understood it to be God’s will for couples to participate in both life-giving and love-giving while having sex. This means not artificially altering the marriage act. Why would the Church teach this if it isn’t true? If the Church teaches the Truth in all other areas of morality, why does the Church suddenly lose credibility when it comes to contraceptives? This is a contradiction.

God bless.
 
to add on to my post above - my wife has respected my wishes not to contracept so right now we are abstaining. i pray for her every day. hopefully soon she will accept nfp. as far as telling a priest, i think it is a great idea. my priest told me we cant force her to believe in nfp. he said the more we force her the more she may turn away. so he said he will pray for her for 2 weeks in his prayer hour and have others to pray for her. i think that talking to the Lord, praying for your spouse is essential. May the Good Lord be with you and His will be done. God Bless You All
 
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ElizabethAnne:
I think it is disingenuous to argue that NFP causes couples to “burn with lust.” If NFP is used to delay or, perhaps in the case of serious health risks, to avoid pregnancy, only a week of abstinance each month is necessary.
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AMEN! Sometimes I shake my head when I read this type of thing - you’d think that a week without sex would kill a person - let me see, you are going to only have 21 days each month when you can have sex? By golly, that is just crazy talk (this is sarcasm, ya’ll…) :whacky:
 
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ElizabethAnne:
I think it is disingenuous to argue that NFP causes couples to “burn with lust.”
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Perhaps I wasn’t clear. Abstinence, not NFP leads to “burning with lust”. And I don’t mean the week or two of abstaining within NFP. We do not use NFP as an unplanned pregnancy would be dangerous to my wife and the baby. There are medical reasons in this regard that you will just have to take my word for.

NFP is just not reliable enough. In fact, I don’t know any couples that use NFP long term that did not have an unplanned pregnancy. I noticed that people who advocate it frequently mention that if they did not use NFP they wouldn’t be experiencing the joy of at least one of their children. While I’m sure that’s true, it also means that NFP is not a reliable means of consistent contraception.

That leads us to indefinite abstinence and burning with lust, or other means of contraception.
 
OH, PLEASE, PLEASE check the statistics. NFP, if used correctly, is 99% effective - the same as the Pill, or Norplant, and more effective than condoms or creams. check the CCL website (couple to couple league)

And please consider the possibility that lust might just be more of a problem with misunderstanding true, authentic love. It seems kind of selfish to use your spouse as a cure for lust.

Please consider reading Christopher West’s Theology of the Body for Beginners, or Good News about Sex & Marriage. Both are great books that help explain true authentic marital love in positive ways. This really is good news!

Peace!
 
my wife and I practice NFP, it is second nature - very easy to do once you’ve learned… One year of marriage and we’re still going strong. NFP has enhanced our marriage more than i could have imagined…

The one thing our NFP teachers said that i don’t forget, because it made perfect sense to me is this:
"everything in marriage should reflect your perfect love for each other - sex and the union it brings should be complete and absolute, like the love you share… BUT…
now add the word “protection” into the equation. the same word used for terrorists, disease and robbers.
How is it possible to be totally united when there is a level of “protection’ from your spouse.”

this made me think. I don’t want protection from my wife, that seems wrong.
 
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magdalisa:
OH, PLEASE, PLEASE check the statistics. NFP, if used correctly, is 99% effective - the same as the Pill, or Norplant, and more effective than condoms or creams. check the CCL website (couple to couple league)
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That appears to be a bit optimistc.

Here is what I’ve found in some not so biased sites:“2% to 30% failure rate during first year of use; depends on a woman’s ability to identify the fertile period of each menstrual cycle and couples’ motivation and discipline to practice abstinence when required”

The Mayo Clinic says with “perfect use” NFP is 95-98% effective. However “typical” use is much less so at 78-88% effective.

One big drawback according to the Mayo Clinic is that it “works best for women with predictable menstrual cycles”. It isn’t too uncommon for any woman to have an unexpected change in cycle.
 
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SemperJase:
Saying “no sex until we do it my way - end of discussion” is not the way to grow in a marriage.
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Which is exactly what the husband is saying to God by refusing to follow God’s laws. That’s no way for a man to behave.

A husband must love his wife in the same way Christ loves the Church, which means being willing to sacrifice everything for her own good. If he isn’t willing to do that, he has abrogated his rights as head of the household insofar as he insists on his wife participating in gravely sinful activity with him.

– Mark L. Chance.
 
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SemperJase:
Perhaps I wasn’t clear. Abstinence, not NFP leads to “burning with lust”.
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That must be news to both Mary and her Son.
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SemperJase:
NFP is just not reliable enough. In fact, I don’t know any couples that use NFP long term that did not have an unplanned pregnancy.
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My name is Mark. This is my wife Katrina. We’ve used NFP for the past 8 years with no unplanned pregnancies. I’ve just demolished that part of your argument.
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SemperJase:
That leads us to indefinite abstinence and burning with lust, or other means of contraception.
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No other means of contraception are acceptable. Period.

– Mark L. Chance.
 
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Jocelyn:
Semper, my dh would be 100% with you no matter how much I would want to practice NFP. He would never put my life at risk. He is so unselfish that he would put his soul at risk before my life and he would go for the big V.
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My husband is a good, unselfish, wonderful man as well. After my last birth, when we were told the risk to my life with a future pregnancy, he scheduled an appointment with a urologist. He didn’t want to hear a thing about NFP (nevermind the simple fact that a vasectomy is no more “effective” than NFP ;)), he was going to do what was best for his wife. He knew it went against Church teaching, but was sure God would understand his doing this for my life.

Through the grace of God his eyes were opened before he went through with it, as what I want more than my life is to be with him and our children in Heaven someday. I am so thankful that he was able to see this being about our SOULS and that being more important than our lives. I know that may sound crazy (esp. when you consider that we have 3 kids to care for) but it IS what God expects of us, he expects us to trust in HIM and do what is right for our souls, over our bodies.

So- what made him see? Well, I prayed on it, our priest did too. I told him that I would not sign the papers (the wife must meet with any reputable urologist before he would do it), and he read up on the increased risk of prostate cancer in men who have vasectomies, esp. before the age of 30.

This was not the end of the road, he was all about all kinds of artificial BC after that (barrier methods, withdrawl and NFP combined was his plan) but in God’s time, he agreed to strict NFP, which gives us one week per month.

We make the most of it ;).

We are now almost 2 years out from all of this and both very happy with the fact that we chose the “right” path over the easy path.

My husband choosing to abstain for 3 weeks out of each month shows his love for me and care about my life/health, much better than getting a vasectomy would have, after all, neither one is a guarantee, and one requires a far greater sacrifice for him to make. I think this way shows a far more “loving, unselfish” husband than if he had gone through with the “v”.
 
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jess7396:
My husband is a good, unselfish, wonderful man as well. After my last birth, when we were told the risk to my life with a future pregnancy, he scheduled an appointment with a urologist. He didn’t want to hear a thing about NFP (nevermind the simple fact that a vasectomy is no more “effective” than NFP ;)), he was going to do what was best for his wife. He knew it went against Church teaching, but was sure God would understand his doing this for my life.

Through the grace of God his eyes were opened before he went through with it, as what I want more than my life is to be with him and our children in Heaven someday. I am so thankful that he was able to see this being about our SOULS and that being more important than our lives. I know that may sound crazy (esp. when you consider that we have 3 kids to care for) but it IS what God expects of us, he expects us to trust in HIM and do what is right for our souls, over our bodies.

So- what made him see? Well, I prayed on it, our priest did too. I told him that I would not sign the papers (the wife must meet with any reputable urologist before he would do it), and he read up on the increased risk of prostate cancer in men who have vasectomies, esp. before the age of 30.

This was not the end of the road, he was all about all kinds of artificial BC after that (barrier methods, withdrawl and NFP combined was his plan) but in God’s time, he agreed to strict NFP, which gives us one week per month.

We make the most of it ;).

We are now almost 2 years out from all of this and both very happy with the fact that we chose the “right” path over the easy path.

My husband choosing to abstain for 3 weeks out of each month shows his love for me and care about my life/health, much better than getting a vasectomy would have, after all, neither one is a guarantee, and one requires a far greater sacrifice for him to make. I think this way shows a far more “loving, unselfish” husband than if he had gone through with the “v”.
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This is a great testimony of how God hears and honors the prayers of a faithful wife in the face of adversity. Wouldn’t this be fantastic if a priest used this testimony in a Sunday sermon to show how God hears the prayer of the faithful --“the holy one’s”–, as today’s daily mass reading promises:

“In the same way, the Spirit too comes to the aid of our weakness; for we do not know how to pray as we ought, but the Spirit itself intercedes with inexpressible groanings. And the one who searches hearts knows what is the intention of the Spirit, because it intercedes for the holy ones according to God’s will. We know that all things work for good for those who love God, who are called according to his purpose.” Romans 8: 26-28
 
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SemperJase:
That appears to be a bit optimistc.

Here is what I’ve found in some not so biased sites:“2% to 30% failure rate during first year of use; depends on a woman’s ability to identify the fertile period of each menstrual cycle and couples’ motivation and discipline to practice abstinence when required”

The Mayo Clinic says with “perfect use” NFP is 95-98% effective. However “typical” use is much less so at 78-88% effective.

One big drawback according to the Mayo Clinic is that it “works best for women with predictable menstrual cycles”. It isn’t too uncommon for any woman to have an unexpected change in cycle.
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Um, I hate to say it but those sites are biased.
  1. They usually include all natural methods in their stats, which includes the “rhythm method,” which is not scientific and much less effective.
  2. They discount the fact that a couple can at any point decide to change their minds about their family plan. In my husband’s and my case, we are “delaying” pregnancy, not avoiding it. This means that we opt to use days that we know have a greater chance of being fertile. A couple with serious reasons could just as easily opt not to use those days.
  3. It makes me want to laugh when the site says, “depends on a woman’s ability to identify the fertile period of each menstrual cycle.” NFP can be done with only taking temperature in the morning. When the temperature rises, ovulation has occurred. What part of that is difficult?
  4. The couple facing a high risk pregnancy should certainly have enough motivation. There are days with a 0% chance of pregnancy. Once the woman’s egg is gone, she can’t get pregnant. It’s not possible.
  5. NFP is ideal for people with irregular cycles! Rather than using the pill to cover up the irregularity, they can track the cycle and figure out what is causing it. The couple is still looking for a temperature rise. This is not any more difficult because it comes at a different point in the cycle each month. In my case, I’m “irregular,” which basically just means that I’m not monthly. NFP works great for me.
God bless.
 
I use a “mucous only” method, so I don’t even need the thermometer, I just need to pay attention and wait until after all signs of fertile mucous have been gone for a few days. 🙂 NFP, even with the “most strict rules” has been very easy for us, even when I was breastfeeding and my cycle was not at all regular.

Felra- thank you for your kind words on my story :).
 
While my life is not in danger, because of severe orthopedic issues - should I carry another child, I would lose the ability to walk (pretty serious reason). We have used NFP since '97 - it is just a natural part of our lives - we are happier each year 🙂
 
Oh, and to be fair, I should give my side of things too. After hearing from my Dr. the shape my body was in, I planned to have my tubes tied (thinking that the Church must make exceptions for cases like this). Then, after talking to a good priest, I realized we could do nothing, and I was very angry with the Church for a time, but still determined to follow her teachings.

I still can’t say I completely “get it” but I know that the Church leaders know more than I, and so- I follow. Until we understand completely, we are still required to follow the Church’s teachings, for the Church is wiser than we are.
 
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mlchance:
That must be news to both Mary and her Son.
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My name is Mark. This is my wife Katrina. We’ve used NFP for the past 8 years with no unplanned pregnancies. I’ve just demolished that part of your argument.

I’m glad it has worked for you so far. However your one case does not prove that it is reliable for everyone. You fall into the 80 to 87% where it is successful (so far). And that statistic only coverr a 12 month period. In other words, if you keep rolling the dice…

As far as “demolishing” my argument, this isn’t a contest. It is a very personal issue for all involved. In this matter, or any other I don’ make decisions based on anecdotal evidence. Not everyone has the same success you do. NFP is not the sure thing as it is portrayed here.

Then I find out NFP can be abused. That infers that if NFP is successful for a couple over a long period of time, the couple is still wrong. A couple is only being Godly when it fails.

How often must you have children in order not to abuse NFP?
 
SemperJase, I understand where you’re coming from (to a point). But, I think it’s kind of silly for you to suggest that other methods of contraception are 100% effective when they are not. Vasectomies have been proven to fail… Women’s tubes have grown back together after tubaligations… We hear all the time about people using birth control pills who get pregnant. The point is, abstinence is STILL the ONLY 100% method.

This is sarcasm (somewhat) but, by your logic, the only way to TRULY prove you love your wife whose life is at risk should she get prgnant is to abstain throughout your marriage. AFter all, it’s the ONLY 100% effective way not to get pregnant.
 
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SemperJase:
In fact, I don’t know any couples that use NFP long term that did not have an unplanned pregnancy.
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My parents have serious reason to avoid pregnancy. They have been practicing NFP for 25 years without a single unplanned pregnancy. With proper instruction and adequate motivation, NFP can be much more successful as well as much more fulfilling than any form of birth control.
 
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