My impressions of the Evangelical Lutheran church I visited

[pianistclare]

A mortal sin in Roman speak, or a grave sin in Eastern speak, is failing to fulfill your first obligation due to loving God (1st Commandment) - that is worshipping God fully, truly, in Spirit and Truth. Of course there are many circumstances where attending Mass/Divine Liturgy is impossible, so in this instance, you pray how you can and go to the communal Sacred Liturgy at your next available opportunity.

A Catholic attending a Luther service is no sin in and of itself. However, skipping the worship of God in Spirit and Truth - knowing that Catholic worship is precisely this - because some other service feels good is, well… you know the rest. Of course, if you can’t attend the parish you mentioned due to moral reasons, please find another. There are friendly, welcoming Catholic parishes - believe me.

Thank you for this most charitably written post. I’m enjoying the discussion, but as for the OP, this is wonderfully stated.
Thank you, thank you!
God bless.

 

[pablope]

Hi Randy,
I don’t believe they had to search hard for a solution. The Catholic Church provided it when, in the 1400’s, they allowed for presbyter ordination. It is also rather apparent in the early Church.

Jon

And Jon…you keep on missing or omitting that the case you cite to justify Lutheran actions is they had permission from the Pope…which is missing in your case.

You keep saying you follow Church tradition…ditch Luther when he is wrong…in this case, is Luther right or wrong?

Or is this a case of picking and choosing so as to rationalize the Lutheran situation?

 

[Randy_Carson]

Sorry, Jon, but it’s hard not to believe that Luther simply “found” these new things hiding in plain sight whenever he wanted to do so.

Randy, we’ve seen these things time and again, haven’t we? Set up the theology later to justify the actions that have been taken.

And Jon…you keep on missing or omitting that the case you cite to justify Lutheran actions is they had permission from the Pope…which is missing in your case.

You keep saying you follow Church tradition…ditch Luther when he is wrong…in this case, is Luther right or wrong?

Or is this a case of picking and choosing so as to rationalize the Lutheran situation?

The chorus grows…

 

[benjohnson]

The chorus grows…

Ha!

Randy, you should defiantly know that this won’t work with us pesky/stubborn Lutherans - we’re quite comfortable with Mathew 7:13.

…

To the OP:

I’d caution on making too much of how loving a church is - we’re commanded to love each other as ourselves and it’s the Christian thing to do and we should all emulate the true concern and love this church has shown you.

But be aware that the Word is inherently offensive to us all - don’t expect too much comfort as your sitting in the pews. The Word pierces us first with the Law, then claims us with the Gospel. It tends to make us squirm.

 

[Jon_S_1]

County Gal,

You have received tons of great responses and I just thought I’d share something with you regarding my journey.

As a convert I’ve attended many churches and at different times felt welcome and excited about these various churches. But in time that faded, despite my involvement, and I was left longing for more in terms of theological substance and worship.

That’s what I love about Catholicism is that it is timeless and about God not us and not our fads and fashions.

I would really encourage you to invest in your own parish to make it more welcoming.

At one point I was in between Catholicism and Protestantism drifting in the wind. I became dissatisfied with my Protestant church, but couldn’t fully join the Catholic Church and I knew I needed to get plugged in somewhere.

So I got on my knees, asked God to put me where He wanted me. And to get me plugged in somewhere.

Then I called my mega church to try and get plugged in and they told me to come to a men’s group meeting that would start in about 3 months.

I then wandered to the nearest Catholic Church (first time there since I moved) and they were having a ministry expo that day, they greeted me ushered me to different tables and introduced me to the faith formation director. I even received a hug from someone! They were so warm and welcoming.

I truly believe God made it clear where I should go by placing me at that expo, the one weekend a year they have it.

I am confident that if you pray about your situation he will direct you too.

God Bless

 

[MaryT777]

County Gal,

You have received tons of great responses and I just thought I’d share something with you regarding my journey.

As a convert I’ve attended many churches and at different times felt welcome and excited about these various churches. But in time that faded, despite my involvement, and I was left longing for more in terms of theological substance and worship.

That’s what I love about Catholicism is that it is timeless and about God not us and not our fads and fashions.

I would really encourage you to invest in your own parish to make it more welcoming.

At one point I was in between Catholicism and Protestantism drifting in the wind. I became dissatisfied with my Protestant church, but couldn’t fully join the Catholic Church and I knew I needed to get plugged in somewhere.

So I got on my knees, asked God to put me where He wanted me. And to get me plugged in somewhere.

Then I called my mega church to try and get plugged in and they told me to come to a men’s group meeting that would start in about 3 months.

I then wandered to the nearest Catholic Church (first time there since I moved) and they were having a ministry expo that day, they greeted me ushered me to different tables and introduced me to the faith formation director. I even received a hug from someone! They were so warm and welcoming.

I truly believe God made it clear where I should go by placing me at that expo, the one weekend a year they have it.

I am confident that if you pray about your situation he will direct you too.

God Bless

Jon, God Bless you for sharing your experience. I have always felt converts are such wonderful witnesses to the Faith. Often they are more well versed in Catholicism that we ole cradle Catholics.
Mary.

 

[Rau]

As I said, this post is in the Non-Catholic section, and is about the Evangelical Lutheran Church. I won’t be discussing Catholic requirements or doctrine here. You most certainly can, but I’ll exercise my free will and not participate in that conversation.

That’s fine, but steido01 in Post #4 gave you excellent advice which I hope you adopt.

 

[Rau]

So often I’ve seen the Catholic Church give us substandard pastors, then hold us hostage with a mandatory Mass requirement. Easily remedied by folks in more populous areas with lots of Catholic Churches of course.

Anyways, all of you arguing that I’ll go to Hell for missing Mass, save your breath. I don’t believe that and most people in the world don’t believe that. It’s a weak argument.

You don’t sound much like a hostage to me!

 

[Thorolfr]

Why would I go back again? The Lutherans were welcoming and personal, the Catholic Church has always been impersonal and rather cold. Why, years ago I used to attend daily Mass a couple of times a week. Never did I get more than a nod from the, mainly, ladies who attended there. The Priest would retreat immediately.

I came to this place, someone actually asked me my name. That means a lot to a shy person such as me. I went to a Catholic Church for almost 20 years and remained feeling invisible, unministered to. This church has many fellowship and volunteering opportunities.

It took me 1 1/2 years to finally check it out. I thank God I did! They don’t put the barriers that the Catholic Church does. God’s grace can be had more easily, I sense.

I’ll continue to post my observations and perceptions as they develop.

I’m not going to tell you where you should go to church, but I understand what you are talking about. I was raised Baptist but have been going to a congregation that belongs to the Evangelical Lutheran Church in America (ELCA) for the last three years now and the first day I went to this ELCA church, I was so impressed by how friendly the people were, way more friendly than any church I had ever been in before. People came up and talked to me after church and asked me my name. I’m also a little shy and this made me feel very welcome. I’m sorry your local Catholic church is leaving you feeling invisible, and although I’ve only been to a Catholic church service once in my life, I’m sure that some Catholic congregations are more welcoming than others.

 

[pianistclare]

You don’t sound much like a hostage to me!

Exactly. The fact the OP has such a visceral response to the idea that she has failed to fulfill her obligation only says to me that she is bothered by it, and is desiring to find “permission to miss” because of the nicety at the other church. All well and good, but still a mortal sin. Just because a person “doesn’t believe it”…well, that’s just handy.
It’s one thing to accidentally miss, or miss due to illness,
Many people struggle with various teachings. But it doesn’t mean they are not to be followed by people who are members of the Catholic Church. It doesn’t help that people like to pick and choose.
The problem is that none of us knows the depths of God’s mercy. But that’s the whole point. Why take that chance?
On the last day, I prefer to have lived according to what the Church has taught me. I prefer not to defend myself for failings that were such an easy fix.
I hope she returns to the Catholic Church, and continues to enjoy the occasional programs of the various denominations during the holidays, as such. Programs.
I myself thoroughly enjoy the Living Christmas Tree put on by the First Baptist Church here. It’s not Mass, and does not pretend to be. It’s just a good time, and lovely music and Scripture presentation. Something my Parish doesn’t do.
But my parish has Eucharist. That’s where I go for my Sunday.

 

[Jon_S_1]

Exactly. The fact the OP has such a visceral response to the idea that she has failed to fulfill her obligation only says to me that she is bothered by it, and is desiring to find “permission to miss” because of the nicety at the other church. All well and good, but still a mortal sin. Just because a person “doesn’t believe it”…well, that’s just handy.
It’s one thing to accidentally miss, or miss due to illness,
Many people struggle with various teachings. But it doesn’t mean they are not to be followed by people who are members of the Catholic Church. It doesn’t help that people like to pick and choose.
The problem is that none of us knows the depths of God’s mercy. But that’s the whole point. Why take that chance?
On the last day, I prefer to have lived according to what the Church has taught me. I prefer not to defend myself for failings that were such an easy fix.
I hope she returns to the Catholic Church, and continues to enjoy the occasional programs of the various denominations during the holidays, as such. Programs.
I myself thoroughly enjoy the Living Christmas Tree put on by the First Baptist Church here. It’s not Mass, and does not pretend to be. It’s just a good time, and lovely music and Scripture presentation. Something my Parish doesn’t do.
But my parish has Eucharist. That’s where I go for my Sunday.

As usual you nailed it Clare!

Have a Merry Christmas!

 

[Phil502]

I want to thank you for your kind words about the service you attended. As a more grumpy old Lutheran, the pastor might have heard from me a comment about the lack of sacraments and liturgy during the service.

As for your decision not to attend mass, from my own Lutheran perspective, needing nor desiring a response, forget the obligation. I’d encourage you to go because you need and want word and sacrament. That’s the reason to go. Don’t deny yourself these wonderful, miraculous gifts of grace because of a particular priest.

Jon

You were clear to me.
Whats not clear to me is why some people need to jump on Country Girl for writing a post about what she experienced at a Lutheran Church. This is the Non Catholic Religion section.
Who are we to judge so harshly, God will sort it out, just worry about your own sins. Thanks for the post Country Girl I enjoyed the description, would have liked to hear about the Service itself and someday I’ll go and see for myself as I have a few friends of that Faith.

 

[Rau]

…Whats not clear to me is why some people need to jump on Country Girl for writing a post about what she experienced at a Lutheran Church. This is the Non Catholic Religion section…

I don’t think it was the description of the events at the Lutheran Church that prompted the critical remarks.

 

[Phil502]

I don’t think it was the description of the events at the Lutheran Church that prompted the critical remarks.

I think it was the questioning and the judgements made on whether she attended Mass that day. A little tact was in order, instead of a hammer approach. We should all try to post as if the person we are addressing is present and we might find ourselves to be little less snarky.