My sister and her DIL--my sis do the right thing?

[whatevergirl]

My sister has a 30 yr old son…he married a few years ago. His wife is 30 yo, also. My nephew’s wife is…hmmm…a little cold. Sometimes, you feel like you are walking on eggshells around her, but I have always gotten along with her. I do see a change in her from when she and my nephew were engaged, to when they married (for the worse)

That being said…my sister went there for Thanksgiving. She showed up the night before, and the three of them went out for dinner…whereby her DIL ‘texted’ my other nephew (her husband’s brother who is 25 yo) non stop, the entire dinner. My sister thought it was very rude…she was sad that her DIL didn’t want to have a conversation with her. And also, it sounds to be immature to me. 30 year old woman sitting there texting the entire dinner to her other son?

Thanksgiving came around…my sister called me in the evening, crying–to let me know that she was heading home, that the way her DIL talks to her son (very berating, I have witnessed it myself) she just couldn’t take it. Her DIL was also rude to her, too…I felt sad for my sister. She has always been nice to this girl. My sister has a very strong personality but she has a soft, kind heart–and probably was bending over backwards to help her DIL get dinner ready…but her DIL wouldn’t even speak to her very much.

So, the meal was put on the table, and my nephew whispered to his wife…“don’t invite her ever again back here.” My sister overheard, and so she packed her suitcase and left. My nephew yelled out…‘thanks for coming, byyyyye!’

We talked today again, and he never ever called to apologize or see if she even made it home okay! I feel like calling him myself…my sister raised me, and so my nephews are like brothers to me.

She told me today, that she is going to send my nephew something in writing–either an email or letter–to explain why she left, and to comment on his relationship. Not his wife, but his relationship. She was saddened to see that the woman her son married, talks so horribly to him…like he is dung under her shoe or something.

My dh thinks that because her boys witnessed their mom talk horribly to her own husband for years (she is now divorced, many of you know)–that it’s natural for a boy to use that as a reference point for what he finds in a wife. Could be that my nephew thinks this is ‘normal.’

What do you make of this? Should she send a letter, or should she not initiate contact with them? I think a letter would be good, I told her. I think that her son and his wife owe her an apology…I am leaving out a few details for the sake of time here, but suffice to say, at least from my sis’ vantage point–it sounds like her son’s wife doesn’t like her, and he is siding with her.

I pray my kids never treat me like this when they are married. Look forward to your advice.

PS: I’m really just asking if my sis leaving was right…what could she have done differently, if you disagree? Should she have intervened when her DIL was berating her son? I don’t really want to get into a profile about my nephew’s wife…I just gave some background to paint a picture of what happened.

 

[Feanaro_s_Wife]

PS: I’m really just asking if my sis leaving was right…what could she have done differently, if you disagree? Should she have intervened when her DIL was berating her son? I don’t really want to get into a profile about my nephew’s wife…I just gave some background to paint a picture of what happened.

**If she was being treated poorly (with or without her doing anything wrong as well) and she made the decision to leave then it was the right one for her.

As for intervening? NO WAY! If a son is forced to choose between his mom (as sweet as she may be) and his wife (even if she treats him terribly) he will choose his wife! Unless he wants to be divorced and not get to see his kids.

As terrible as his wife MAY be, it is HIS wife, HIS relationship, and HIS choice. She can’t treat him poorly if if HE doesn’t let her. This is as much his fault as hers.
**

 

[whatevergirl]

Okay–then she did the right thing…that’s good. She said she’d rather have left, than had intervened. She realizes this is his wife, and if he accepts this treatment, doesn’t mean she should.

I am not sure I would have left, unless there were personal insults flung my way. I think the comment whispered to his wife, really has more to do with his sarcasm…as though to say…‘don’t invite her anymore, ok? are you happy??’ kind of comment, than he truly not wanting his mother to come around.

I think I might have just stuck it out, and poured myself a LARGE glass of wine or something.

 

[Magicsilence]

So, the meal was put on the table, and my nephew whispered to his wife…“don’t invite her ever again back here.” My sister overheard, and so she packed her suitcase and left. My nephew yelled out…‘thanks for coming, byyyyye!’

We talked today again, and he never ever called to apologize or see if she even made it home okay! I feel like calling him myself…my sister raised me, and so my nephews are like brothers to me.

I don’t understand something. Her SON said this to his wife? Why? Did SHE invite your sister?

Even so, it sounds like immature, rude, childish behaviour to me.

Your nephew is 30 years old, I can’t see him changing much (save the grace of God).
Feanaro's Wife:

She can’t treat him poorly if if HE doesn’t let her.

Hmm, what if he puts his foot down and she just ups and leaves? I suppose it might be for the best.

 

[noclevername]

First of all, there has to be more to this story. Something had to have happened to make your nephew feel this way whether it was an actual event or just a perceived event, there is something more there.

In my family, my stepmother hates my BIL. For the first few years of my sister’s marriage, I bought into eveything bad my stepmother said about my BIL. I was right there iwth her not liking my BIL. Then I stepped back and looked at the bigger picture and it turns out that my BIL isn’t that bad of a guy, he’s actually a pretty cool guy. But my stepmother still does not like him because she thinks he does stuff to her that he doesn’t do. She thinks he intentially does things to make her mad but he doesn’t. She just doesn’t like him so every move he makes is interpreted the wrong way. It’s hard to explain what I am talking about but I am wondering if your sister already doesn’t like her DIL so whenver she is around her there are perceived problems that aren’t really there.

But here is the kind of destructive part. My sister loves her husband and is fiercly protective of him. My stepmother is driving a huge wedge between herself and my sister’s family. If my stepmother isn’t careful, she is going to miss out on seeing her grandchildren because my sister is clinging to her husband as she should be. If my stepmother continues to think badly about my BIL, my sister is going to cut off contact because her two kids don’t need to be around someone who is constantly talking about bad about their dad. So my point is your sister needs to be very very careful about what she is going to do in this situation. This is her son’s life now and if he feels like his mother is a threat to his wife or kids your sister is going to be the one to be asked to leave.

Does any of this make any sense?

 

[whatevergirl]

Magic, I know, the comment makes no sense, I told my sis. She repeated it again today, that he said that–which was the final straw of why she left. The weird thing is HE invited my sis, not his wife. But, when you’re married someday, sometimes a spouse will do something as an individual, but there is this collective ‘we,’ that is just understood. I still think he meant it in a sarcastic way, because he didn’t seem happy with his wife, my sister said.

My sister said she certainly doesn’t want to come between these two, but she didn’t want her holiday completely ruined either.

I still think my large glass of wine idea would have been better. lol

Back up a bit, I actually talked to my nephew yesterday before all this happened, and he was VERY edgy. Pulling teeth to get him to talk to me…I was like…‘put your mom back on the phone.’ He is not ultra warm either, but he definitely sounded…like there was tension already being emitted into the air over there! lol He was definitely not happy about something.

This is why I don’t travel to see them often for the holidays. I love my sister…but when we all get together…her kids, and my dh and me…there is this weird tension…fakeness. I really don’t care to be a part of a pretend holiday, anymore. Her kids really need God in their lives, and they choose to push Him out…and it shows. I’m not perfect, but I don’t make people struggle with me to converse.

I mean, we say grace…we talk about the meaning of the day…we laugh…hug…hold hands…holidays are not about screaming, bickering, and being fake to one another. I felt sorry for my sister–she really just wanted to spend a nice time with them.

 

[whatevergirl]

First of all, there has to be more to this story. Something had to have happened to make your nephew feel this way whether it was an actual event or just a perceived event, there is something more there.

In my family, my stepmother hates my BIL. For the first few years of my sister’s marriage, I bought into eveything bad my stepmother said about my BIL. I was right there iwth her not liking my BIL. Then I stepped back and looked at the bigger picture and it turns out that my BIL isn’t that bad of a guy, he’s actually a pretty cool guy. But my stepmother still does not like him because she thinks he does stuff to her that he doesn’t do. She thinks he intentially does things to make her mad but he doesn’t. She just doesn’t like him so every move he makes is interpreted the wrong way. It’s hard to explain what I am talking about but I am wondering if your sister already doesn’t like her DIL so whenver she is around her there are perceived problems that aren’t really there.

But here is the kind of destructive part. My sister loves her husband and is fiercly protective of him. My stepmother is driving a huge wedge between herself and my sister’s family. If my stepmother isn’t careful, she is going to miss out on seeing her grandchildren because my sister is clinging to her husband as she should be. If my stepmother continues to think badly about my BIL, my sister is going to cut off contact because her two kids don’t need to be around someone who is constantly talking about bad about their dad. So my point is your sister needs to be very very careful about what she is going to do in this situation. This is her son’s life now and if he feels like his mother is a threat to his wife or kids your sister is going to be the one to be asked to leave.

Does any of this make any sense?

You make excellent points. Here’s my gut on this (and much of this is historical)–and I told my sis as much. The kids blame her for divorcing their dad, and now they can’t see their mom AND dad on holidays. That’s it. And until they ‘forgive’ her for whatever they perceive as her fault…or whatever, there will be this hidden disrespect.

They never call her, she always makes the effort. They ALWAYS call their dad though, see. I grew up with my sister and BIL, they raised me, as my parents died when I was very young…so, I saw firsthand a lot of the tension that led to their divorce. But, they still blame my sister…she said today, no matter what I do, my kids view me as ‘the bad guy.’ It’s sad. I don’t know what advice to give to her.

 

[Feanaro_s_Wife]

It’s sad. I don’t know what advice to give to her.

Advice? To come spend her holidays with you of course
**
A relationship takes effort on both parts. She can do as much as she wants, but until her kids “forgive her” or whatever they need to do, she should accept that this is how things are and decide if she wants to keep butting her head against a wall and trying to have a happy holiday where it is very unlikely to happen or if she should make other plans:shrug:**

 

[pumpkinbeast]

I think she did the right thing, if she was being treated poorly. Hopefully she wasn’t doing anything rude back, so there may be more to the story… But if she wasn’t, then she had every right to leave. Personally, I think people should do that more often when people are rude to them, just up and leave, especially when family is involved. Maybe then people will sit up and take notice of their own behavior, and think about what happened to make the other person leave, and maybe they might even admit that they did something wrong. Leaving is much better than retaliating: in leaving, you show very clearly that (a) you have been hurt and (b) you’re not going to let people push you around. If you retaliate in some way, that only gets the rude person’s back up even more, and they’ll blame their own behavior on you. Leaving gives time for emotions to settle, so if anything needs to be dealt with, it can be dealt with in a calm, collected manner (hopefully ).

 

[whatevergirl]

Advice? To come spend her holidays with you of course
**
A relationship takes effort on both parts. She can do as much as she wants, but until her kids “forgive her” or whatever they need to do, she should accept that this is how things are and decide if she wants to keep butting her head against a wall and trying to have a happy holiday where it is very unlikely to happen or if she should make other plans:shrug:**

Agreed. I don’t even ask what they are all doing anymore for the holidays. (my nephews) Too many soured holidays just like I describe, that I have witnessed and experienced. DH and I used to pack up the kids when they were wee little…and hurry down to see her…(we lived in Orlando before we moved up north for a time)…and for what? For these SAME episodes? I told her…hey, at least you’re evolving…you didn’t say anything nasty, and just left.

I think given the circumstance, and how offended she was…how her son and wife were arguing…over and over all day…it probably was the best idea.

I have been in awkward situations like that before. I remember a neighbor who would invite me over for cocktails with other neighbors…and then she’d ignore me the whole night, as if I were invisible. Solution? Stopped going.

 

[whatevergirl]

I think she did the right thing, if she was being treated poorly. Hopefully she wasn’t doing anything rude back, so there may be more to the story… But if she wasn’t, then she had every right to leave. Personally, I think people should do that more often when people are rude to them, just up and leave, especially when family is involved. Maybe then people will sit up and take notice of their own behavior, and think about what happened to make the other person leave, and maybe they might even admit that they did something wrong. Leaving is much better than retaliating: in leaving, you show very clearly that (a) you have been hurt and (b) you’re not going to let people push you around. If you retaliate in some way, that only gets the rude person’s back up even more, and they’ll blame their own behavior on you. Leaving gives time for emotions to settle, so if anything needs to be dealt with, it can be dealt with in a calm, collected manner (hopefully ).

You read my sister’s mind. She said this, too…that she ‘hopes’ that they both realize that they were wrong…

Maybe I should have Christmas this year…I am very easy going…if people don’t want to talk to me…I put the music louder.

The only thing she could have done MAYBE…is gone up to them…put her arms around them both, and said…‘come on. This is Thanksgiving. We are blessed…let’s sit down and have a nice meal.’

Might have helped.

 

[Feanaro_s_Wife]

The only thing she could have done MAYBE…is gone up to them…put her arms around them both, and said…‘come on. This is Thanksgiving. We are blessed…let’s sit down and have a nice meal.’

Might have helped.

OR if they are the type to be “fake” they probably would just assume she was being fake too and have even more ammunition to not like her:shrug:

 

[whatevergirl]

True Malia. In growing up in a strong Italian family, I know my sister can sometimes be an acquired taste for many. lol My nephew’s wife has told me in the past, that she finds my sister to be eccentric…not a word I’d choose for my sister, but I can see what she means. I think that my sister’s growth in the Catholic faith, has caused her to become more humble at this point–but you know. I wonder if they are clinging to her old ‘way.’ She used to be very bossy, demanding, loud…I think that could be why my nephew’s wife is a little standoffish about her…

My sister would give them the world, and has in many ways…I just hope that my nephew apologizes to her. He should call to see how she is…but he also has some growing to do. I think that while he is very successful from a monetary view, he has a lot to learn about respecting his mother, and sadly, I have seen this ‘scene’ of disrespect to her for YEARS…since her boys were teens. There is something lacking in both his and his wife’s life…GOD!

There’s obviously a lot of history in any family–it’s just sad that she didn’t have a nice Thanksgiving meal with her family yesterday.

 

[OutinChgoburbs]

I’m sorry your sister got hurt in this.

You know what I’m going to say: She should just keep her mouth shut, and I mean silent. Nothing. Nada. Don’t send them anything, including Christmas presents. Don’t call. Don’t answer the phone when she sees it’s them. Don’t email- in fact block their email addresses.

Sending her son stuff will only fan the flames, and give him something to wave under people’s noses, as in, “See what she wrote! How could we not be upset!” even though he and his wife started it.

Better she teaches them through silence. She’ll be happier in the long run.They are not little children, but adults, well over the legal age limit.

And if Sonny calls her other son to involve him and he calls Mom, if I were I’d tell DS#2, “I don’t want to discuss it.” My :twocents:

 

[whatevergirl]

In a way, you have a good point. Not like she would be punishing him/them…but, maybe silence would be best. Thank you. I agree on the presents…as well.

 

[noclevername]

I’m sorry your sister got hurt in this.

You know what I’m going to say: She should just keep her mouth shut, and I mean silent. Nothing. Nada. Don’t send them anything, including Christmas presents. Don’t call. Don’t answer the phone when she sees it’s them. Don’t email- in fact block their email addresses.

Sending her son stuff will only fan the flames, and give him something to wave under people’s noses, as in, “See what she wrote! How could we not be upset!” even though he and his wife started it.

Better she teaches them through silence. She’ll be happier in the long run.They are not little children, but adults, well over the legal age limit.

And if Sonny calls her other son to involve him and he calls Mom, if I were I’d tell DS#2, “I don’t want to discuss it.” My :twocents:

This is excellent advise. Will someone please call my stepmother and tell her the same thing? She’s bad about writing letters and sending them and it always makes things worse. I have a letter she wrote me over 15 years ago when she was mad at me. In the ln the letter she told me that she has no reason to ever have any kind of relationship with me again. (she is still married to my dad) She didn’t talk to me for 10 years after that even though I tried my best to make things right between us. (to this day I still don’t know what had happened. My mother had just died and I wasn’t easy to get along wtih but I wasn’t bad. I don’t drink, do drugs, I’m not destructive, etc) I was kicked out of the family for a long time and I still don’t know why. Now she’s doing it to my BIL. But anyway, because of that letter, I will never ever trust my stepmother again. I am nice to her and have a cordial relationship with her but we’ve never talked about it and I just can’t be sure that I won’t do something to make her mad again and make her ignore me for another 10 years. I am back in the family now and no one has ever said anything about it. It’s a huge white elephant.

My point is that sometimes silence is best just like OutinChgoburbs posted. You sister doesn’t want to do something that could cause more harm. Sometimes things might can be healed but there will always be a huge reminder scar there.

 

[KCT]

I’m not sure I completely understand the situation, but . . .

I think writing letters just gives more fuel for the future and puts people on the defensive. When Christmas rolls around, if she’s invited she can tell them she was insulted at Thanksgiving and isn’t interested in coming unless things are better.

 

[SeekerJen]

I’m not sure I completely understand the situation, but . . .

I think writing letters just gives more fuel for the future and puts people on the defensive. When Christmas rolls around, if she’s invited she can tell them she was insulted at Thanksgiving and isn’t interested in coming unless things are better.

I’m not sure I would even say that much. I think a polite “No, thank you” with no further explanation given would be more than sufficient. After all, the assumption from the son may be that he can treat Mom however he wants and she’ll always be around. No explanation from her might finally make him doubt that.

 

[MCGar]

True Malia. In growing up in a strong Italian family, I know my sister can sometimes be an acquired taste for many. lol My nephew’s wife has told me in the past, that she finds my sister to be eccentric…not a word I’d choose for my sister, but I can see what she means. I think that my sister’s growth in the Catholic faith, has caused her to become more humble at this point–but you know. I wonder if they are clinging to her old ‘way.’ She used to be very bossy, demanding, loud…I think that could be why my nephew’s wife is a little standoffish about her…

Ahhh, here is the rub. I slightly suspected this issue and I’m glad your sister has changed for the better. BUT if the DIL has been treated to a loud, bossy, demanding MIL in the past then obviously she would have her guard up. Even if it’s no longer like this, these things take time to get over. But they usually don’t ‘get over’ these sorts of things until they are actually adressed.

Obviously you and your sister would like her DIL and her son to apologize for how rude they were, but has your sister ever pointed out her own actions in the past and apologized sincerely for them? Because that is the thing, if her past actions aren’t addressed, then really they are still going on becuase they haven’t been apologized for. (in other words, it looks like she is still not sorry for them because she hasn’t apologized)

You can see past your sisters former ‘ways’ and her current humbleness because you love her, have a long history with her and are actively knowledgable about her current life. But your DIL doesn’t have that same attachment, she can’t be expected to have warm fuzzies about someone she doesn’t have a long standing attachment to. And being Italian is no excuse. lol, I know because my family is Mexican and there are tons of predominant personality quirks that go along with that, but as long as people are adults and have to live in a world with other cultures then they can’t use their cultures as an excuse, they just have to learn to behave better.

My sister would give them the world, and has in many ways…I just hope that my nephew apologizes to her. He should call to see how she is…but he also has some growing to do. I think that while he is very successful from a monetary view, he has a lot to learn about respecting his mother, and sadly, I have seen this ‘scene’ of disrespect to her for YEARS…since her boys were teens. There is something lacking in both his and his wife’s life…GOD!

There’s obviously a lot of history in any family–it’s just sad that she didn’t have a nice Thanksgiving meal with her family yesterday.

I personally think this story leans too much to blaming the DIL and excusing the son by saying he could’ve just been sarcastic. He’s a grown man who said something rude and then told his mom ‘Byyyyee’ as she was leaving because she felt so bad. Even if he slipped and stuck his foot in his mouth the first time, he had no compuncture to apologize and ask his mom not to leave.
He treated his mother shabbily and the only thing she can to about it is talk to him directly about his own actions.

Personally I would wait until the sting has faded and call him up. Let him know that it hurt her feelings, but she loves him but she doesn’t feel she should be disrespected like that.

As for how the DIL acted, well it really is between her and her husband how she talks to him. None of us know how they talk to each other in private or if she apologizes afterwards and is actively working on how she talks.

 

[whatevergirl]

You really bring up some interesting points…thank you.
McGar–I think that you hit the nail on the head for me anyways…lol I am personally angry (not that it’s my beef to have but in looking at the situation, this makes me angry) with my nephew who allowed his mother to storm out of his house, after she had a few glasses of wine on top of it…and still has not called her to see how she is. Above it all, he could have pulled her aside and said, mom I’m sorry–please stay…let’s start over…and the same for his wife.

I don’t envision him as a guy caught in the middle…really. I envision more that my nephew has not respected my sister for years…and he blames her for divorcing his dad. He doesn’t approve of her dating life, yet approves of his dad’s…and so on. I think if his wife dislikes her, then he will take her side more so, because he lacks respect for her. But, my sister caused that, not her.

I actually don’t dislike his wife…she has come over to my place without my sister…and we have had a blast, and she emails me all the time…I am thinking that she looks at my sister, through the lense that my nephew does–with a certain disdain for divorcing her husband.

Her family–her mom and dad have been married for 35 years, her mom is extremely philanthropic…etc…and I think she looks at my sister as a diva. lol My sister is a diva…she is very dramatic, but to know her, is to love her. But, I have even had many a battle with her…but I’m her blood. You are right, my DIL doesn’t have the history.

Ah the holidays…

It’s the most wonderful time of the yeeeeaaaar…lol :harp: