My Sister is Mormon....

[dianaiad]

People who feel they have “seen the light” and convert to Christianity, I suppose, feel a duty to educate others about why they left.

People who convert to Mormonism are discouraged rather strongly from bad mouthing their previous belief systems. You will not, for instance, find a “Maze of Catholicism” published by any LDS publisher, official or non.

Seems to me that finding the truth is sufficient. If you have to keep justifying your decision to leave a belief system for a different one over and above “Hey, THIS is truth!!! I want THIS!!” then there is a major problem with your decision making process.

 

[dianaiad]

We are not allowed to set foot in the Temple. We are not Mormon.

I would never refuse a Mormon entrance into a Catholic Church.

Nor would I ever refuse a Catholic entrance into an LDS meetinghouse.

True, you have to be more than simply “Mormon” to get access to the Temple, and I think that you would be rather upset if I tried to take communion in a cathedral, and believe me, I couldn’t join a convent.

Catholics have several places and rituals that are kept, not just for Catholics, but for specific Catholics; this is not exactly earthshaking.

Let’s try this: how would you feel about a priest smuggling in a camcorder to a confession session, leaving the priesthood and putting everything he recorded on youtube?

Even if the confession was some lovely old lady whose worst sin was envying her neighbor’s azalea bed?

 

[majick275]

Nobody I know believes it is foolish. The question was about why Mormons do not wear or display it. To us, the cross is the instrument of His death; He didn’t leave the cross of His own volition; He had to be removed from it. If we are going to use something to symbolize His resurrection and triumph, perhaps a better item would be–an empty grave. Or a rolled away stone, or empty winding clothes.

It doesn’t much matter. To us, as Pres. Hinckley stated, the symbol of His triumph is His resurrection and His promise and Life in OUR lives. As Catholics, I believe that you might understand this more than the “name it and claim it” group does.

I understand that many Christians wear the cross as a reminder to themselves and to others of their beliefs; it’s an anchor, as well as a symbol.When it works, that’s a very good thing. However, I think that, especially recently, it has come to be trivialized; it is worn as mere jewelry; bling. Because it is worn so casually, its impact is diluted.

Trust me, when I see a cross, or think about it, it’s impact is not diluted. I am instantly and forcibly reminded of His death and His sacrifice for us. It’s a gut twisting wrench. When I see the scriptures about how we are to ‘take up’ our own crosses, it is a very forcible reminder of what we are to do.

So perhaps that’s another reason why we do not wear it, or display it; we respect it too much.

Diana

so which is it? you can’t have it both ways. first you propose that the cross is an offensive symbol as it the tool of christ’s death, now you posit it is “too sacred”? this seems in line with the mromon propensity to eschew christian symbols in worship yet place some masonic ones in an essential category.

 

[majick275]

People who feel they have “seen the light” and convert to Christianity, I suppose, feel a duty to educate others about why they left.

yes, exactly. people who have been deceived by a scam or a cult and manage to find their way to the truth would naturally feel obligated to share with others in the hopes of helping them to escape/avoid the deception and find the one true god.

 

[majick275]

Nice.

In fact, the very first experience I ever had with anti-Mormon sentiment was when I was fourteen. My family had just moved to California from Utah, and I, naive and protected teenager that I was, invited a new friend to a church dance. She was all excited, until she found out that it was a MORMON church dance.

She held up her cross against me, backed up a few steps, turned around and ran across the athletic field to get away from me.

That was very odd, I thought…but I had no idea that it was just the beginning…

well i’ll give you that. i too experienced similar things as a young mormon in the “mission field”. i wonder if that is nearly as challenging as what catholics face in india or china?

 

[dianaiad]

so which is it? you can’t have it both ways. first you propose that the cross is an offensive symbol as it the tool of christ’s death, now you posit it is “too sacred”? this seems in line with the mromon propensity to eschew christian symbols in worship yet place some masonic ones in an essential category.

Which is it?

Both. As the symbol of His death, it is too strong a thing to dilute; it SHOULD be shocking…and sacred. Familiarity does indeed breed contempt.

If you don’t think so, just look around when you take a walk outside next, and see how many people are wearing crosses—and don’t think a thing about it.

Diana

 

[dianaiad]

…and it was a man, not a woman. It was accurate, and I didn’t ask. He stood in front of an entire church and shared his story. Brave.

Why “brave?”

He was in absolutely no danger of his life or his reputation. We don’t do that sort of thing, y’know. He stood up in front of people whose good opinions he wanted, and nothing will do that more quickly in a church that is anti anything than to tell an ‘escape’ story, especially if he could throw some ‘juicy’ secrets in there. I’m certain that he was celebrated, slapped upon the back, hugged and supported all over the place.

“Brave?”

(snort)

Not even a little bit. The most the church would do to him is excommunicate him, and he already took care of that himself. His family and friends might be a little PO’d, but then one does tend to feel betrayed when one, y’know, actually IS.

He left us and went elsewhere. That’s fine; his choice, his faith. That he betrayed promises he made in a place that he thought was sacred when he made them? That he betrayed promises that he KNEW his family, friends and former associated still think are sacred? That he betrayed promises that he had no need to betray in order to continue on in his new faith?

No. That’s not bravery. There was no courage required there. Hatred, perhaps, resentment, a wish to be accepted and perhaps lionized, yep.

but not bravery.

In case you haven’t figured it out yet, I disapprove strongly of those who do this sort of thing. To any faith.

 

[zaffiroborant]

Which is it?

If you don’t think so, just look around when you take a walk outside next, and see how many people are wearing crosses—and don’t think a thing about it.

Diana

How do you know what people think?

 

[dianaiad]

well i’ll give you that. i too experienced similar things as a young mormon in the “mission field”. i wonder if that is nearly as challenging as what catholics face in india or china?

All religions both face such challenges, and issue them. Catholics have faced intense persecution, and still do in many places.

So do Mormons. I’m not going to downplay the problems Catholics face in India or China.

As for me, on my own mission I was stoned (with real rocks) and shot at. Does that count?

 

[dianaiad]

How do you know what people think?

Ask them. They’ll tell you–or more likely, they’ll give you a funny look and tell you where to put your question.

Which is also an answer, since someone who respects the cross they wear would give you the answer you hope they do.

Me…I teach Special Ed in a high risk high school I see a LOT of crosses–on Bloods and Crips and any number of other gangbangers. None of 'em wear it because they are honoring Christ in their lives.

 

[dzheremi]

What other people do or believe do not matter. You are not accountable for them. Our Lord died on the cross you so reject so that YOU may have salvation. He also commanded us to take up or own crosses and follow Him. I personally do not wear a cross (I own several, but they are heirlooms from now deceased family members; I would be terribly afraid of losing them or damaging them inadvertantly if I wore them every day), but if I did it would be in rememberance of His great sacrifice, and the weight of my own cross that I struggle to carry as He commanded me to.

To view it simply as an instrument of death and hence reject it…I don’t understand…you guys DO know that He rose again after three days, right? The cross cannot extinguish Him, nor the tomb contain Him. So it is also a symbol of His victory over death through His glorious resurrection. What was once perhaps a symbol of death, is now a symbol of life.

 

[mfbukowski]

Well, yours is the “old school”, and probably most predominant view in Utah at least. It is also what I was raised to believe…that the cross is nearly downright evil. The first time a Mormon told me they wear a cross, I thought they were making it up.

I live in UT, my daughter wears crosses for the explicit purpose of warding off Mormons. (She is agnostic.)

So you were Mormon, and now are catholic and your daughter is agnostic. Does that bother you? What is the catholic position on agnostics? Do they go to heaven?

 

[mfbukowski]

My daughter and I are both converting. She was never baptized.

I have not seen my friend in about 13 years and I wasn’t curious until now, when my daughter stirred the pot of questioning. I supposed it never really mattered before, for one, because I am limited use for religion until I started down the road to becoming a Catholic after finally feeling as if I was in the right place.

Do Catholics think that “feeling as if I was in the right place” is a good reason to join their church? I thought they didn’t think that way.

 

[dzheremi]

Interesting question, mfbukowski. To put it another way that is more appropriate for a Catholic, does the feeling of “being in the right place” come before or after the study and acceptance of the truth of Church doctrine and teachings? I know the answer already, since I am also a convert to Catholicism, but it might not be immediately obvious to Mormons, who seem to feel that a “burning in the bosom” is evidence of the truth of their faith. That is what we object to.

 

[RebeccaJ]

Nice.

In fact, the very first experience I ever had with anti-Mormon sentiment was when I was fourteen. My family had just moved to California from Utah, and I, naive and protected teenager that I was, invited a new friend to a church dance. She was all excited, until she found out that it was a MORMON church dance.

She held up her cross against me, backed up a few steps, turned around and ran across the athletic field to get away from me.

That was very odd, I thought…but I had no idea that it was just the beginning…

Well, I never taught my daughter to run from mormons. If I did, she couldn’t be around my family.

She gets proselytized all the time. She noticed that wearing a cross slowed that down somewhat. Anecdotal? Maybe.

She has many LDS friends, the sort who aren’t afraid of non-Mormons who wear crosses. Hanging from chains, body piercings or tattooed on their skin.

 

[twosweetgirls]

Interesting question, mfbukowski. To put it another way that is more appropriate for a Catholic, does the feeling of “being in the right place” come before or after the study and acceptance of the truth of Church doctrine and teachings? I know the answer already, since I am also a convert to Catholicism, but it might not be immediately obvious to Mormons, who seem to feel that a “burning in the bosom” is evidence of the truth of their faith. That is what we object to.

And that would be exactly me. After I’d studied and researched enough to logically and effectively thwart my anti-Catholic bigotry, I realized that my own feeling of “being in the right place” (finally!) was firmly rooted in logic–and wasn’t really a “feeling” per se, but a sense of “OOOOoooohhh, I get it now!” Praise God that He has a sense of humor with me.

 

[mfbukowski]

so which is it? you can’t have it both ways. first you propose that the cross is an offensive symbol as it the tool of christ’s death, now you posit it is “too sacred”? this seems in line with the mromon propensity to eschew christian symbols in worship yet place some masonic ones in an essential category.

Some masons wear crosses; does this make the cross a Mason symbol? Our symbols are not masonic. The masons use symbols that are ancient, our symbols are ancient, and some are the same. They don’t mean the same things.

That is like saying we must all speak Latin because we use the Roman alphabet.

 

[mfbukowski]

yes, exactly. people who have been deceived by a scam or a cult and manage to find their way to the truth would naturally feel obligated to share with others in the hopes of helping them to escape/avoid the deception and find the one true god.

This post was about joining Christianity. Are you saying that christianity is a cult?

 

[majick275]

Which is it?

Both. As the symbol of His death, it is too strong a thing to dilute; it SHOULD be shocking…and sacred. Familiarity does indeed breed contempt.

If you don’t think so, just look around when you take a walk outside next, and see how many people are wearing crosses—and don’t think a thing about it.

Diana

and you have the ability to see into their hearts and minds and KNOW they don’t think a thing about it?

 

[majick275]

All religions both face such challenges, and issue them. Catholics have faced intense persecution, and still do in many places.

So do Mormons. I’m not going to downplay the problems Catholics face in India or China.

As for me, on my own mission I was stoned (with real rocks) and shot at. Does that count?

i think it does. so does persecution = truth?