My soul feels like it's being pulled at both sides

[La-Petite-Fleur]

Hello everyone, God bless you :hug1:

As my title says, I just feel like I’m being pulled apart. I’m a Catholic convert. Lately I’ve been very worried about salvation.

All I want to do is what Jesus wants of me. The problem is, I’m not sure that I know what He wants. And that’s a problem, when non-Catholics say that Catholics aren’t real Christians, and Catholics say if you leave the Church you run a great risk of going to hell. It’s very frightening.

And in the midst of this battle, I’m left confused and a crying mess because I don’t know what to do (I don’t know what Jesus wants me to do). Even so, Jesus is my one and only. He means everything to me. He is my salvation, and my life is 100% His.

As I was raised in a protestant Christian background, I feel very condemned by non-Catholic Christianity, that basically says Catholics can’t go to heaven (because Catholics must be in submission to the Church & dogma contrary to Jesus (non-Catholic position). That worries me, because I’ve forgotten (I don’t remember) the proof that the Catholic Church was set up by Jesus and that it is His.

And what hurts, is that no matter what either side says, I know I love Jesus, and He is my salvation. But I worry that what non-Catholic Christians say about not praying to saints, idolatry, dogma, kneeling to the priest in confession, etc. Sometimes I worry that the dogma I have to accept is something that could damn me. But if I don’t accept it, I could be damned. Yet if Catholic dogma is true, I can’t (and don’t) reject it.

It’s all so hard, too hard perhaps. Because I never, ever had this struggle where I feel like my relationship with Jesus and the salvation that He has given me, is questioned. Questioned because each side says the other side is wrong and therefore each side believes that the soul could be in peril.

For me, my life, soul, and everything is about Jesus. I just want to close my eyes to it all, lay my head on Jesus’ chest, and just cry and cry. At least it would just be Him and me, and no one would come between us.

:tissues:

I asked my mother today if I could go to heaven even though I’m a member of the Catholic Church. She waited a few seconds and said “Yes, because He knows your heart”.

Sigh. It all comes down to this: 1) that non-Catholics say they are true Christans (and that Catholics are not), and that Catholics can’t go to heaven because we have to accept dogma that is damnable to a soul (perhaps according to some non-Catholics). 2) And of course Catholicism teaches one endangers their soul if they leave the church. 3) Jesus alone is my salvation and I am His 4) But I don’t know what He wants me to do, and I’m afraid of being damned by doing something He wouldn’t want. I feel like no matter what I do, there’s always going to be some Christian group that says I’ll be damned (or be in such danger). But again, Jesus is my salvation, no matter what… I’m just afraid of doing something He finds damnable, but the problem is, I don’t know what He wants me to do. I will go where he wants me to go, be what he wants me to be, do what he wants me to do, no matter what anyone says.

It’s not easy being a convert, that’s for sure. If anyone out there has any helpful words, especially if they feel like the Holy Spirit has a word for me, please let me know. I don’t really have a priest that I can talk to as I’ve moved around so much.

God bless you…

 

[Keikiolu]

Hello everyone, God bless you :hug1:

As my title says, I just feel like I’m being pulled apart. I’m a Catholic convert. Lately I’ve been very worried about salvation.

All I want to do is what Jesus wants of me. The problem is, I’m not sure that I know what He wants. And that’s a problem, when non-Catholics say that Catholics aren’t real Christians, and Catholics say if you leave the Church you run a great risk of going to hell. It’s very frightening.

And in the midst of this battle, I’m left confused and a crying mess because I don’t know what to do (I don’t know what Jesus wants me to do). Even so, Jesus is my one and only. He means everything to me. He is my salvation, and my life is 100% His.

As I was raised in a protestant Christian background, I feel very condemned by non-Catholic Christianity, that basically says Catholics can’t go to heaven (because Catholics must be in submission to the Church & dogma contrary to Jesus (non-Catholic position). That worries me, because I’ve forgotten (I don’t remember) the proof that the Catholic Church was set up by Jesus and that it is His.

And what hurts, is that no matter what either side says, I know I love Jesus, and He is my salvation. But I worry that what non-Catholic Christians say about not praying to saints, idolatry, dogma, kneeling to the priest in confession, etc. Sometimes I worry that the dogma I have to accept is something that could damn me. But if I don’t accept it, I could be damned. Yet if Catholic dogma is true, I can’t (and don’t) reject it.

It’s all so hard, too hard perhaps. Because I never, ever had this struggle where I feel like my relationship with Jesus and the salvation that He has given me, is questioned. Questioned because each side says the other side is wrong and therefore each side believes that the soul could be in peril.

For me, my life, soul, and everything is about Jesus. I just want to close my eyes to it all, lay my head on Jesus’ chest, and just cry and cry. At least it would just be Him and me, and no one would come between us.

:tissues:

I asked my mother today if I could go to heaven even though I’m a member of the Catholic Church. She waited a few seconds and said “Yes, because He knows your heart”.

Sigh. It all comes down to this: 1) that non-Catholics say they are true Christans (and that Catholics are not), and that Catholics can’t go to heaven because we have to accept dogma that is damnable to a soul (perhaps according to some non-Catholics). 2) And of course Catholicism teaches one endangers their soul if they leave the church. 3) Jesus alone is my salvation and I am His 4) But I don’t know what He wants me to do, and I’m afraid of being damned by doing something He wouldn’t want. I feel like no matter what I do, there’s always going to be some Christian group that says I’ll be damned (or be in such danger). But again, Jesus is my salvation, no matter what… I’m just afraid of doing something He finds damnable, but the problem is, I don’t know what He wants me to do. I will go where he wants me to go, be what he wants me to be, do what he wants me to do, no matter what anyone says.

It’s not easy being a convert, that’s for sure. If anyone out there has any helpful words, especially if they feel like the Holy Spirit has a word for me, please let me know. I don’t really have a priest that I can talk to as I’ve moved around so much.

God bless you…

Your Mom was right, your heart is with Jesus, if you are with Jesus,…

…and if you’re with Jesus you’re with the Church, and those who would condemn you for being with the Church are incorrect, because they don’t understand that the Church includes all people who are truly with Jesus, whether they call themselves Catholics or something else.

Check with the catechism about what “The Church” is.

“The Church”

Specifically: For those who may not be in The Church.

It is not for any man to say who is and isn’t to be “damned”, and those who say such things need to be prayed for so that they will be graced with the understanding of that error.

Mahalo ke Akua…!
E pili mau na pomaikai ia oe. Aloha nui.

 

[Fizendell]

It might be helpful for you to read Scott Hahn’s books or others who have come from Protestant backgrounds and converted to the Catholic faith. These writers will resonate with you and your experience AND help you understand what you have been taught as a Protestant and reconcile the teachings of the Catholic faith.

God bless you on your journey!

 

[dove51]

I get what you mean. I’m a little uncomfortable with some Catholic practices, being a new revert. Eucharistic adoration being one of them. I feel a little torn too.

But here are the two popular verses I like to re-read and feel safer in my newly-recovered faith.

• Matthew 16:18 - Jesus gives Peter authority and builds His church on him.
• John 20:23 - Support for the sacrament of reconciliation, which I think is a very Biblical and sound way to refute the Protestant form of asking for forgiveness.

I also love watching Catholics talk about this on YouTube. Here are some guys who are great:

youtube.com/user/OneTrueChurch
youtube.com/user/paleocrat

 

[4loveofJesus]

May God’s peace, love and mercy be with you and to all!

Be not afraid. The more you draw closer to Christ, the more you will be persecuted. Even Jesus Himself was accused by others for being a demon. If that happened to Him, Who is God Himself, how much more for us His followers?

I remember years ago my co-workers, patients who were Protestants would question/challenge my Catholic faith. I knew that the Catholic Church always has the answers because it is the only Church that Our Good Lord Jesus Christ founded, I just have to find the answers by studying what the Catholic Church is teaching. So, I ended up looking for the answers to their questions that eventually they stopped asking the questions because their misconceptions were answered. It made them question their beliefs, made them realize that what was being told to them about the Catholic Church were not true at all, and they finally realized that I would always find the answer to their questions about the Catholic Church. So, from being looked down and treated as a non- Christian, eventually, a relationship of respect for each other as Christians was fostered.

Now, though God’s grace, I do not feel intimidated anymore if people approach or ask me about the Catholic faith, and Its Teachings. I have been approached numerous times by Protestants, Non-Christians, those who have left the Catholic faith or have not been practicing it, and all I feel is joy, just to be able to bear witness to the Truth about Our Good Lord Jesus Christ, His Catholic Church and Its Teachings. I always think of these as Holy Spirit moments.

It is through these experiences/trials that have helped me not only learn more about my faith, but it made me love and trust God and His Catholic Church more. It encouraged me to live that Christian way of life, with great appreciation and frequent reception of the Sacraments of confession and holy eucharist. To follow Christ no matter what the cost may be. And for these I am eternally grateful.

God bless!

Blessed be Jesus and Mary!

 

[La-Petite-Fleur]

Although the hour is late (eastern standard time) and I’m a little too sleepy to respond in thanks to each individually, I want everyone to know that I appreciate your responses very much. Thank you :hug1:.

 

[Tietjen]

… And what hurts, is that no matter what either side says, I know I love Jesus, and He is my salvation. But I worry that what non-Catholic Christians say about not praying to saints, idolatry, dogma, kneeling to the priest in confession, etc. Sometimes I worry that the dogma I have to accept is something that could damn me. But if I don’t accept it, I could be damned. Yet if Catholic dogma is true, I can’t (and don’t) reject it.

Hi La-Petite-Fleur,
I am very sorry that you are experiencing this. Really, my only advice for you is to dive deeper and learn more what the Catholic Church REALLY teaches concerning these issues. It’s NOT what many Protestants claim. The Catholic Church was around 2000 years ago… that is fact. What other Christian Church can claim this? The Catholic Church is the Church that compiled the Bible. The reformation brought forth the incomplete Bibles used by many Protestant Churches today. Many Protestant Churches have many of the truths found within the Catholic Church, but they have these truths only because the Catholic Church guarded the truths for a 1½ millennia prior to Protestantism. Then, the “reformers” took those things that they wanted from the Church and formed their own denominations and the practice continues to this day; thus the thousands of different Protestant denominations.

I’d suggest that you read the early Church Fathers and what they had to say. In addition, the Catechism is essential when trying to determine the truth about what the Church teaches. DON’T buy into what Protestants say, but get your answers straight from the Church. It’s all there for you to see.

Oh, and one last thing. I would most certainly question a Church that claims another Church is going to Hell. That is for God alone to decide. You won’t hear the Catholic Church saying that the ( Fill In The Blank ) Protestant Church is hell-bound.

God bless.

 

[BarbaraTherese]

I really think you would benefit from a talk with a priest. You may not know your current local parish priest very well, but that is not a reason to not make an appointment to have a talk with him - you are quite free to do so should you choose. That is one of the functions, and an important one, of our priests - to care for souls as a shepherd for his sheep.

Your dedication to and love of Jesus is very apparent and that is the spiritual…your conflict and concerns are over religion and it is entirely understandable to me and lifelong Catholic that if you have been converted to Catholicism from another Christian religion or influences that you could experience difficulties and conflicts. They need to be resovled so you may be at Peace and you may need help to do so.
The other option open to you is to ring up a religious order of priests, brothers or nuns and ask could you have a talk with one of them. If they are not able to help themselves they certainly should be able to direct you to where you can get help.
I am located in Sth. Australia, and not much help.

I wil keep you in prayer and hope that this thread will help you with your concerns…God Bless…Barb

 

[Robin_L.in_TX]

Dear La-Petite-Fleur,

Remember, the Good Shepherd knows His sheep, and they know Him. Fear not.

Use this time to get to know Jesus and His Church better. It is NOT a piece of bread that I kneel before in the Blessed Sacrament, it is Jesus Himself, Body, Blood, Soul, and Divinity. When His disciples thought that Jesus’ taching on the Eucharist was too hard, HE LET THEM WALK AWAY! And He still lets us walk away if we do not trust Him enough to accept His teaching.

We do not kneel to the priest in the confessional. Each and every sacrament is a personal encounter with Jesus through the priest in persona Christi. When the priest holds the bread and wine and speaks the words of consecration, he does not transform them into the Body and Blood of Jesus, the Holy Spirit does. The priest stands in the place of Christ and speaks the words for Him, but it is Jesus’ Words at the Last Supper that effectively transform the bread and wine in the true, substantial, sacramental Body, Blood, Soul, and Divinity of the risen Christ.

The Church is sacramental. Yes, it is made up of human sinners, but never forget that, in a state of grace, in the sacraments we are united with Jesus Himself who is God, united in the Trinity. So when the Holy Spirit leads the Magisterium to declare a Truth to be necessary to our Faith, the authority of the Church was given to it by Jesus Himself. He told us that the Holy Spirit would lead the Apostles to remember the things that Jesus taught them and promised that the gates of hell would not prevail against it.

So the Catholic Church is Jesus’ Church built upon Peter and the Apostles on whom Jesus, God, breathed just the as the Holy Spirit overshadowed the waters at creation, and as God breathed into Adam on the sixth day.

God bless you, La-Petite-Fleur. In the Sermon on the Mount Jesus promised that blessed are they who are persecuted for His sake. Your fears can be a great blessing if you now study these issues which trouble you until you know them inside and out–until you know the Good Shepherd as He knows you. Fear not. The Church and the Sacraments will let you experience Jesus more intimately than ever before. They will never lead you away from Him.

May our Blessed Mother who, while not understanding everything , pondered everything in her mind, saying yes to the Holy Spirit, until she did His will by asking Jesus to begin revealing Himself at the wedding at Cana.

In Christ’s peace and joy,

Robin L. in TX

 

[InLight247]

You sought for truth and have made a choice of converting to Catholicism.
At the time of your conversion, you have already gone through struggles and have already overcome them. Decision has been made. Do not re-run those struggles again.

Catholic Church, the one, apostolic and universal church, is established by our Lord Jesus himself. Catholics acknowledge salvation outside the Church. The Church never condemns Protestants. Though some Protestants condemn Catholics, we don’t have to be bothered by their lack of knowledge.

Trust in God’s mercy and enjoy your Catholic faith.
Instead of being torn, choose not to be torn.
Dig into the depth of this rich faith, learn more about Catholicism. It will strengthen you.

God want you to have peace of mind. So by all means, be in peace.

And talk to your Parish priest even you are not familiar with him yet.
You can build a relationship as long as you stay in that parish, however short it may be.

God bless!

 

[JimR-OCDS]

Jesus said to them, "I am the bread of life; whoever comes to me will never hunger, and whoever believes in me will never thirst.

But I told you that although you have seen (me), you do not believe. Everything that the Father gives me will come to me, and I will not reject anyone who comes to me, because I came down from heaven not to do my own will but the will of the one who sent me.

And this is the will of the one who sent me, that I should not lose anything of what he gave me, but that I should raise it (on) the last day.

For this is the will of my Father, that everyone who sees the Son and believes in him may have eternal life, and I shall raise him (on) the last day." John 6:35-40

People who have hangups over religion, don’t know Jesus, because they would understand that religion doesn’t save us, Jesus does.

God Bless
Jim

 

[La-Petite-Fleur]

Keikiolu, Fizendell, dove51, 4loveofJesus, Tietjen, BarbaraTherese, Robin L. in TX, InLight247, JimR-OCDS …

Thank you all so very much. I’ve read every post & they’ve been both helpful and consoling.

Sometimes I wonder if perhaps I have these concerns is because I don’t know early church history. If I could *know *without a doubt (not only faith, but knowledge) that the Catholic Church is truly the Church created by Jesus Himself, I think I would feel so much better. I have faith that it is, but I wish I could know so as well. And also, just as important, I’d like to know that the Catholic Church has the ability to put forth dogma. Because if (besides faith) I knew these two things to be true, then I don’t think I would ever be afraid again. And so if other non-Catholic Christians told me it’s wrong to have devotions to Mary, etc, etc, I would KNOW they were wrong, because I would know the Holy Spirit is the one who has given the dogmas to the Catholic Church, and that would put my soul at ease because I would know everything about the Catholic Church is okay.

Along with praying that God will reveal the truth to me, how may I find information that helps me to realize if the two (Catholic Church from Christ & Holy Spirit reveals all dogma to Catholic Church) are true?

God bless you all, and thank you for your prayers.

 

[inthecloud]

As someone who seem to be surrounded by protestant fundamentalist you will find this site and forum interesting too.

chnetwork.org/

 

[Tietjen]

Sometimes I wonder if perhaps I have these concerns is because I don’t know early church history.

That is easy enough to overcome. There are MANY books available, not the least of which the writings of the early Church fathers.

If I could *know *without a doubt (not only faith, but knowledge) that the Catholic Church is truly the Church created by Jesus Himself, I think I would feel so much better.

I can understand where you are coming from as I was a cradle catholic and then fell away in my early 20s only to discover the Truth and return in my late 30s. For me it was not so hard to KNOW that the Catholic Church was/is the Church Christ was talking about in Mt 16:18-19. Christ promised that the Church will survive and not even the gates of hell would prevail against it. So, logically, what other Church has existed since the time of Christ? Here is a hint:

Orthodox Church - founded in 1054
Lutheran - founded in 1517 - by Martin Luther
Anabaptist - founded in 1521 - by Nicholas Storch & Thomas Munzer
Anglican - founded in 1534 - by Henry VIII
Presbyterian - founded in 1560 - by John Knox
Baptist - founded in 1609 - by John Smyth
Methodist - founded in 1739 - by John & Charles Wesley
Episcopalian - founded in 1789 - by Samuel Seabury
Mormon - founded in 1830 - by Joseph Smith
Church of Christ - founded in 1836 - by Warren Stone & Alexander Campbell
Seventh Day Adventist - founded in 1844 - by Ellen White
Jehovah’s Witnesses - founded in 1874 - by Charles Russell
Assemblies of God - founded in 1914 - by Unknown
etc.
etc.

Now if one believes that one of these Churches is the “One True Church” then that person would have to say that Christ purposefully denied the “True Church” to all those generations from the time of His death until that particular Church became founded. Even the Bible, which is used today, was compiled by the Catholic Church (Councils of Hippo - 393 AD & Carthage - 397 AD)! This was uncontested for sixteen centuries! Would the Holy Spirit, which guards the Church until the end of time, really allow His Church and all those generations to go so long without the Bible? If so, then one would have to say that Christ was mistaken back in the book of Mathew.

I have faith that it is, but I wish I could know so as well. And also, just as important, I’d like to know that the Catholic Church has the ability to put forth dogma. Because if (besides faith) I knew these two things to be true, then I don’t think I would ever be afraid again.

Then fear not! For if we know that the Catholic Church was the only Church that meets the timeline established by Christ (See above) then we also must know that it must have been the Catholic Church that He spoke about in John 14:16, 26 when He declared that the Holy Spirit will be with us always. Then in John 16:13 we see that Christ said that the Holy Spirit would guide us to all truth. When we look at I Tim 3:15 we find that the Church IS the pillar of Truth. St Irenaeus said, “For where the Church is, there is the Spirit of God; and where the Spirit of God, there the Church and every grace. The Spirit, however, is Truth.” (200 AD)

Luke 10:16 says the Church has the power to speak with Christ’s voice.
Mt 18:18 says the Church has the power to legislate.
Mt. 18:17 says the Church has the power to disciple.
1Cor 11:23-24 says that the Church has the power to sacrifice (Eucharist)
John 20:23 says that the Church has the power to forgive sin.
Was the Bible referring to the (Fill in the blank) Church which didn’t even exist yet?

One last point and then I’ll step off my soapbox. We know from the Bible that God’s Church is guided by the Holy Spirit always til the end of time. We also know from the Bible that God is unchanging and that all 3 persons of the Holy Trinity are unified and One. If that is true, then why is it that soooo many Churches continue to disagree with one another and branch out to further spawn more and more denominations? They all can trace their roots back to the first Church (the Catholic Church) and they all have SOME Truth, but why call a branch a tree when we already have the full truth (as revealed by God) and thus the trunk which is rooted in Jesus Christ?

God bless.

 

[CatholicCajun]

Your post reminded me (and I don’t know why?) of a bumper sticker we saw on the back of a van in New Orleans one day, it simply said “Catholics love Jesus, too!” THought it was awesome. God BLess you and pray for peace in your life and in your heart.

 

[La-Petite-Fleur]

There is perhaps one worry that causes the most fear: I worry that the Catholic Church, in it’s dogma, might say that Jesus is not the only way.

Thankfully, I think I’ve heard several priests say that the Catholic Church teaches that Jesus is the only source of salvation, it is only by him that anyone, no matter what their religion, gets into heaven. Therefore Jesus is the only way into heaven. Other religions may have truth, and perhaps others can be saved, but it is not their path or religion that is the source of their salvation, it is Jesus Christ.

Please tell me that the Catholic Church doesn’t deny that Jesus is the only source of salvation (and in that sense, the only Way).

 

[Tietjen]

There is perhaps one worry that causes the most fear: I worry that the Catholic Church, in it’s dogma, might say that Jesus is not the only way.

The Church does not teach that Salvation apart from Jesus Christ is possible.

Thankfully, I think I’ve heard several priests say that the Catholic Church teaches that Jesus is the only source of salvation, it is only by him that anyone, no matter what their religion, gets into heaven. Therefore Jesus is the only way into heaven. Other religions may have truth, and perhaps others can be saved, but it is not their path or religion that is the source of their salvation, it is Jesus Christ.

Yes, this is true. However, it is a process and though our Lord died on the cross for all, not everyone will make it into Heaven. Each individual plays a role in their own Salvation as well. God allows men to freely choose and does not force Himself upon them. But now we’re on the edge of a subject that separates the Catholic Church from many Protestant Churches and before continuing on into that arena, I want to reasure you that the Catholic Church DOES teach, know, believe and understand that Salvation does come through Jesus Christ alone. But it is upon us to cooperate with the sacrafice that Christ made for us.

Please tell me that the Catholic Church doesn’t deny that Jesus is the only source of salvation (and in that sense, the only Way).

From the Catechism of the Catholic Church:

Para #169 - Salvation comes from God alone; but because we receive the life of faith through the Church, she is our mother: “We believe the Church as the mother of our new birth, and not in the Church as if she were the author of our salvation.” Because she is our mother, she is also our teacher in the faith.

Para #1741 - Liberation and salvation. By his glorious Cross Christ has won salvation for all men. He redeemed them from the sin that held them in bondage. “For freedom Christ has set us free.” In him we have communion with the “truth that makes us free.” The Holy Spirit has been given to us and, as the Apostle teaches, “Where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is freedom.” Already we glory in the “liberty of the children of God.”

Para #620 - Our salvation flows from God’s initiative of love for us, because “he loved us and sent his Son to be the expiation for our sins” (1 Jn 4:10). “God was in Christ reconciling the world to himself” (2 Cor 5:19).

In other words, the Church knows that without Christ’s sacrifice on the cross there would be no salvation.

 

[La-Petite-Fleur]

The Church does not teach that Salvation apart from Jesus Christ is possible.

Yes, this is true. However, it is a process and though our Lord died on the cross for all, not everyone will make it into Heaven. Each individual plays a role in their own Salvation as well. God allows men to freely choose and does not force Himself upon them. But now we’re on the edge of a subject that separates the Catholic Church from many Protestant Churches and before continuing on into that arena, I want to reasure you that the Catholic Church DOES teach, know, believe and understand that Salvation does come through Jesus Christ alone. But it is upon us to cooperate with the sacrafice that Christ made for us.

From the Catechism of the Catholic Church:

Para #169 - Salvation comes from God alone; but because we receive the life of faith through the Church, she is our mother: “We believe the Church as the mother of our new birth, and not in the Church as if she were the author of our salvation.” Because she is our mother, she is also our teacher in the faith.

Para #1741 - Liberation and salvation. By his glorious Cross Christ has won salvation for all men. He redeemed them from the sin that held them in bondage. “For freedom Christ has set us free.” In him we have communion with the “truth that makes us free.” The Holy Spirit has been given to us and, as the Apostle teaches, “Where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is freedom.” Already we glory in the “liberty of the children of God.”

Para #620 - Our salvation flows from God’s initiative of love for us, because “he loved us and sent his Son to be the expiation for our sins” (1 Jn 4:10). “God was in Christ reconciling the world to himself” (2 Cor 5:19).

In other words, the Church knows that without Christ’s sacrifice on the cross there would be no salvation.

Wonderful relief! Thank you, all of you. I feel so at ease now knowing the Catholic Church says although those of other faiths may be saved, that Jesus is still the only source of salvation. I couldn’t live with myself if I were forced to say that Jesus wasn’t the only way (regarding salvation). I can’t explain how much better I feel already.

I suppose I only have two more questions, if anyone is interested in answering to help me better understand a couple of things.

One, is devotion to Mary and the other Saints. And two, praying to saints.

What does devotion entail? What does it not entail? I think perhaps I’m confusing adoration with devotion, and I would like to move away from my preconceived definitions so that I can know the truth.

As for simply praying to the Saints… I think I have read several sources that say it’s okay to pray to saints because Jesus spoke to Moses and Elijah. However, is there not a difference between Jesus talking to them and us praying to saints, as the two that Jesus was speaking with were present and appearing in front of Him on earth, as in conversation? Although I do remember the Psalm 148 “Praise ye him, all his angels: praise ye him, all his hosts.” But he does go on to say “Praise ye him, sun and moon: praise him, all ye stars of light.” I really don’t think he was praying to the sun, moon, and stars. So likewise I’m not sure that he was praying to angels. If there are more examples, please share them because I do want to believe without fear.

I need to be put at ease by knowing that God doesn’t mind devotions and prayers to Saints. I have great confidence that I will be able to know that both are okay.

 

[inthecloud]

When you pray to Mary and the saints you ask them to pray with you or for you. Is not different that when you ask to other people to pray for you or with you to God. The people who died in Christ and are in heaven are not really dead becase they have eternal life. And they form part of the Communion of the Saints with Jesus followers on earth.

 

[Tietjen]

One, is devotion to Mary and the other Saints. And two, praying to saints.

What does devotion entail? What does it not entail? I think perhaps I’m confusing adoration with devotion, and I would like to move away from my preconceived definitions so that I can know the truth.

I understand devotion, in this case, to entail a deep respect for the saint and/or our Holy Mother. We venerate them for the examples that they set, the sacrifices they made, their service to our Lord, etc. What it doesn’t mean is that we put them on the same level as God. It is possible to have multiple devotions which are of verying levels. For example, a wife (or husband) may be devoted to their spouse. However, that does not mean that they aren’t devoted to God on an even higher level. Or a person can be devoted to their profession, but that doesn’t mean that they place their profession above their spouse.

As for simply praying to the Saints… I think I have read several sources that say it’s okay to pray to saints because Jesus spoke to Moses and Elijah. However, is there not a difference between Jesus talking to them and us praying to saints, as the two that Jesus was speaking with were present and appearing in front of Him on earth, as in conversation? Although I do remember the Psalm 148 “Praise ye him, all his angels: praise ye him, all his hosts.” But he does go on to say “Praise ye him, sun and moon: praise him, all ye stars of light.” I really don’t think he was praying to the sun, moon, and stars. So likewise I’m not sure that he was praying to angels. If there are more examples, please share them because I do want to believe without fear.

We as Catholic believe in the Communion of Saints. This refers to the bond of unity among all believers, both the living and those who are physically dead, who are committed followers of Jesus Christ. We know that human beings who are living on the earth are capable of being followers of Christ. We know too that those who have passed from this life and are now in Heaven are also followers of Christ. Romans 12:5 says that Christians are members of the body of Christ. Eph 4:4 and Col 3:15 says that Christ has only one body. Romans 8:35-39 says that death cannot separate Christians from Christ or from one another. So, in other words, both those Christians here on earth and those souls who have already entered Heaven share a common love of Christ. We’re a family in the Lord. Now, if you are going through a tough time, doesn’t it make sense to turn to Family? This is what we do with the saints. We ask (pray) them to pray for us to the Lord for his intercession. No one has any problem with a brother or sister coming to them and saying, “will you pray for me.” So, if we (us and the saints) are family in Christ, why wouldn’t we ask them to pray for us as well? And since the saints are already standing in the presence of God, how much more appropriate is it than asking a human being on earth who may or may not be on good relations with our Lord to pray for us?

We know that angels and saints place the prayers of the holy ones at God’s feet (Rev 5:8, Tob 12:12, Rev 8:3-4).