mysticism

[fhansen]

If this link / website is even remotely close,

then my question is , is there some kind of thought process by some of the faithful that there is something one can pray or do to I guess for the lack of a better expression or phrase : physically encounter Christ / God in the flesh in the present physical state we are in here on earth.

is that the idea of mysticism ?

if it is , emphasis IF

should we not be feeling this sense of mysticism when we are in Adoration, participating at Mass, in our daily prayer life, when we go to encounter Christ by Eucharistic Communion. ?

Everyone would like to experience what the mystics did, unless, perhaps, for the more difficult revelations, where, for example, some aspect of evil is given to be experienced for an instructional purpose. But the tastes of God’s presence are tiny glimpses of the Beatific Vision IMO, and are what we all long for, whether we know it or not. It’s said that they’re ways of cultivating this extraordinary closeness to God but in the end the experiences come strictly at His discretion.

 

[JRKH]

So where would be the best place to start? The rosary?

Well - your OP asked for writings and I can’t think of anything better than the book in my signature as a starting point. It will give you a great distillation of the process.

That said, the Rosary is certainly a wonderful place to start.

Peace
James

 

[JRKH]

newadvent.org/cathen/10663b.htm ( the part I read is under historical sketch, addressing Christianity )

( also read the criticism part which to some degree addresses what the Catholic Church has to some degree acknowledge or refuted , and may acknowledge to a point ).

So granted this one link I found is not the entire authority on the subject nor has it explained every aspect of mysticisim but it has given me a round about understanding of it so some small degree.

If this link / website is even remotely close,

then my question is , is there some kind of thought process by some of the faithful that there is something one can pray or do to I guess for the lack of a better expression or phrase : physically encounter Christ / God in the flesh in the present physical state we are in here on earth.

is that the idea of mysticism ?

if it is , emphasis IF

should we not be feeling this sense of mysticism when we are in Adoration, participating at Mass, in our daily prayer life, when we go to encounter Christ by Eucharistic Communion. ?

In answer to your question here, in fact we should feel this sense of mysticism in Adoration and Mass. Further I suspect that some feel this more than others.
The thing to remember is that we are all in different places in our journey - and we are all working with different gifts, understandings and - frankly - desire.

why so many categories of faith ?

The reason for this is because we are always trying to answer - top explain - to clarify - and to understand. This is especially true in the western Church.
But in reality - the mystical approach seeks to cut through that which is unnecessary and get to the core. It can be a long and difficult journey - and one with many dangers as well. Which is why it is suggested that one not embark on the mystical path without good guidance.

Peace
James

 

[hazcompat]

The Collected Works of Edith Stein
VI
THE SCIENCE OF THE CROSS
Edith Stein Saint Teresa Benedicta of the Cross Discalced Carmelite
Translated by Josephine Koeppel, O.C.D.
Edited by Dr. L. Gelber and Romaeus Leuven, O.C.D.

Stein, Edith (2011-03-17). The Science of the Cross (The Collected Works of Edith Stein Vol. 6) (Kindle Locations 3-5). ICS Publications. Kindle Edition.

Peace

 

[john78]

ty for everyones patience and responses.

 

[Robert_Sock]

I know what you’re getting at but, in reality, there’s no connection whatsoever. No confusion, no disorder, no delusions of grandeur in mysticism, just humble awe before gifts directly given.

I’m sure this would tend to be quite true.

THANKS! We’re on the same page!

 

[billcu1]

Yes I too would like to thank all for responses. I never thought of mysticism as another category of faith but it certainly fits. To me mysticism is a more close contact with God on a personal level.

 

[billcu1]

I just read of a text called “Lectio Divina” or something like that. Anyone aware of it?

 

[hazcompat]

lectio-divina.org/index.cfm?fuseaction=category.display&category_id=4

Peace

 

[billcu1]

lectio-divina.org/index.cfm?fuseaction=category.display&category_id=4

Peace

It speaks of prayer. That’s what I need to learn more of. The best prayer I know of is the rosary. Are the benedictines or discalced carmalites the best to look to for prayer.

 

[hazcompat]

It speaks of prayer. That’s what I need to learn more of. The best prayer I know of is the rosary. Are the benedictines or discalced carmalites the best to look to for prayer.

divineoffice.org/

Peace

 

[bcuster]

Not usually considered a book on Catholic mysticism, but The Imitation of Christ leads me to think in a mystical manner.

I agree with this one. I am now reading Frank Sheed’s Theology for Beginners, and I am having the same experience.

I think that mysticism (experience of the Mystery of God) happens to ordinary people in many ordinary ways IF we pay attention to the way God is acting in our lives. I could be wrong, but it is how I understand the great Mystics.

 

[JRKH]

I agree with this one. I am now reading Frank Sheed’s Theology for Beginners, and I am having the same experience.

I think that mysticism (experience of the Mystery of God) happens to ordinary people in many ordinary ways IF we pay attention to the way God is acting in our lives. I could be wrong, but it is how I understand the great Mystics.

I think that this expresses it wonderfully. What the various “disciplines” would do is to help us to be more attuned to the experiences that are already going on.

Peace
James

 

[franklinstower]

Yes I too would like to thank all for responses. I never thought of mysticism as another category of faith but it certainly fits. To me mysticism is a more close contact with God on a personal level.

I read an article by a Trappist monk near my home in Salt Lake City. He wrote it to contrast the ways into holiness between mystics and non mystics. He had a lot to say about this subject but the bare bones is this.

Mystics are on a journey to God and to perfect charity (so far as it can be had in this life) and if they reach it they do so through the help of the many mystical experiences that come their way on that journey. If they get lost and do not complete the journey it is either because of undue attachment to the mystical experiences themselves, or else because of following the false mystical encounters that they have on the way in.

Non mystics are on the same journey to perfect Charity and if they reach that end it is because of the deep reservoir of inner strength that they gain from pursuing this journey long term and without mystical encounters to bolster them. If they fail to complete the journey it is because of a lack of fortitude and perseverance due to not receiving lots of candy from God.

The monk also stated that in the end, all things being equal it is the same degree of charity and holiness that is attained to by both groups however the mystic tends to have greater discernment in the end and the non mystic tends to have greater inner strength.

This article has been tremendously helpful in my understanding of spirituality in general.

 

[billcu1]

I read an article by a Trappist monk near my home in Salt Lake City. He wrote it to contrast the ways into holiness between mystics and non mystics. He had a lot to say about this subject but the bare bones is this.

Mystics are on a journey to God and to perfect charity (so far as it can be had in this life) and if they reach it they do so through the help of the many mystical experiences that come their way on that journey. If they get lost and do not complete the journey it is either because of undue attachment to the mystical experiences themselves, or else because of following the false mystical encounters that they have on the way in.

Non mystics are on the same journey to perfect Charity and if they reach that end it is because of the deep reservoir of inner strength that they gain from pursuing this journey long term and without mystical encounters to bolster them. If they fail to complete the journey it is because of a lack of fortitude and perseverance due to not receiving lots of candy from God.

The monk also stated that in the end, all things being equal it is the same degree of charity and holiness that is attained to by both groups however the mystic tends to have greater discernment in the end and the non mystic tends to have greater inner strength.

This article has been tremendously helpful in my understanding of spirituality in general.

What’s a “false mystical encounter” ? Not having the right teacher or something? IMO if God calls you he’ll test you but not mislead you.

 

[tskrobacz]

Check out the Cloud of Unknowing also!

 

[franklinstower]

What’s a “false mystical encounter” ? Not having the right teacher or something? IMO if God calls you he’ll test you but not mislead you.

A false mystical encounter is one that does not come from God. They can come from your own unconscious mind, from wishful thinking, and also from the devil. St John of the cross talks about how it can be exceedingly difficult to tell the difference between the two.

I have had a number of false mystical encounters-- in each case the vision or experience was pointing me in a direction that seemed loving and joyful, but that lacked actual depth and could not lead to real spiritual maturity. False mysticism does not lead one into union with God even though it often presents itself as if it will.

 

[hazcompat]

Mystical Prayer in the Holy Spirit
This reading on mystical (contemplative) prayer, taken from Bonaventure’s Omnia, 5, 312
Christ is both the way and the door. Christ is the staircase and the vehicle, like the throne of mercy over the Ark of the Covenant, and the mystery hidden from the ages. A man should turn his full attention to this throne of mercy, and should gaze at him hanging on the cross, full of faith, hope and charity, devoted, full of wonder and joy, marked by gratitude, and open to praise and jubilation. Then such a man will make with Christ a pasch, that is, a passing over. Through the branches of the cross he will pass over the Red Sea, leaving Egypt and entering the desert. There he will taste the hidden manna, and rest with Christ in the sepulchre, as if he were dead to things outside. He will experience, as much as is possible for one who is still living, what was promised to the thief who hung beside Christ: Today you will be with me in paradise.
For this passover to be perfect, we must suspend all the operations of the mind and we must transform the peak of our affections, directing them to God alone. This is a sacred mystical experience. It cannot be comprehended by anyone unless he surrenders himself to it; nor can he surrender himself to it unless he longs for it; nor can he long for it unless the Holy Spirit, whom Christ sent into the world, should come and inflame his innermost soul. Hence the Apostle says that this mystical wisdom is revealed by the Holy Spirit.
If you ask how such things can occur, seek the answer in God’s grace, not in doctrine; in the longing of the will, not in the understanding; in the sighs of prayer, not in research; seek the bridegroom not the teacher; God and not man; darkness not daylight; and look not to the light but rather to the raging fire that carries the soul to God with intense fervor and glowing love. The fire is God, and the furnace is in Jerusalem, fired by Christ in the ardour of his loving passion. Only he understood this who said: My soul chose hanging and my bones death. Anyone who cherishes this kind of death can see God, for it is certainly true that: No man can look upon me and live.
Let us die, then, and enter into the darkness, silencing our anxieties, our passions and all the fantasies of our imagination. Let us pass over with the crucified Christ from this world to the Father, so that, when the Father has shown himself to us, we can say with Philip: It is enough. We may hear with Paul: My grace is sufficient for you; and we can rejoice with David, saying: My flesh and my heart fail me, but God is the strength of my heart and my heritage forever.
Blessed be the Lord forever, and let all the people say: Amen. Amen!

Peace

 

[J_Peterson]

The Big Book of Christian Mysticism by Carl McColman is a very good overview.

Fire Within by Fr. Thomas Dubay was very good but very academic. It’s also good place to start. It’s very Orthodox.

I’m currently reading Mysticism (A Study in the Nature and Development of Spiritual Consciousness) by Evelyn Underhill. She was not Catholic (Anglican I believe) and although she relies heavily on the writings of the Catholic saints, she does not limit herself to Christianity so not all will like it. That said it’s a very good study so far. She makes the distinction between false mysticism very clear but it may not be for everybody.

ETA: After reading Waiting for God, I’m a bit smitten with Simone Weil. Although she was not baptized, she was a stong believer in Catholicism. There are some who believe that she was baptized shortly before her death though. She is a fascinating person: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simone_Weil

 

[billcu1]

I talked to my new priest today and he told me to start with lectio divina. He went over the techniques for me and as pennance I start with the mass liturgy.