Mystics?

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starrs0:
What is meant when someone is reffered to as a mystic?
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They play for the WNBA basketball team in Washington DC.
 
Hhi Starrs0, Did you ever understand something and have trouble explaining it? That’s what this is for me. Mysticism is a religious tendency and desire of the human soul towards an intimate union with the Divinity. I believe an example of a mystic may be Saint Teresa of Avila that experienced ecstacies(spelling?) or it may even be a stratch to describe St.Thomas Aquinas’ vision as mystical.

Hopefully someone can better explain this. Peace.
 
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SPOKENWORD:
I thought the MISS. TICKS. played for Mississippi State. 😃
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The Catholic Church has soooooooooo many mystics it is difficult to understand how any Catholic would not understand mysticism. At least intellectually. Many were given the title Doctor of the Church. Their lives speak of a deep intimacy with God…always expressed through the Trinity in terminology. Most of us will never know what they knew nor do the things that they were able to do through their faith… it takes a lot of conciousness… reality…Saint Francis was one of them… true Saint and true Mystic. These were the folks that God used through out the ages to bring about change and to guide the Church when it became corrupted and full of empty headed unconcious people. Like anything else though…what one does not understand…apart from what goes on in their own illusional little mind… one tends to mock…what can be said…nothing ! Laugh with a fool and silently ask God to bless him/her.
Shalom
 
Dear friends

Mysticism is a journey of a contemplative soul that is drawn by God, in, by and through Jesus Christ, to the truths of faith in a deeper and revelational manner. The revelations may be personal and not intended to be of wide use, but on the whole the mystics of all ages are of great and huge spiritual use to all peoples.

The soul that is led in mysticism, is led into a territory most frightening for that individual and almost certainly they will question their own sanity and their own abilites and worthiness of such a passage of travel in the Lord; such are the blessings and graces bestowed upon the mystic. Even all those around the mystic may be harsh towards them, even to the extent of ridicule and unkindness. The true mystic will not be detered on this path which is led my the Holy Spirit and Jesus Christ, nothing will stop it, because this is not the work of the mystic, but the work of God.

Mysticism is not for the weak or frail of heart, not for someone who is caught up in the lots of the world, nor for someone who is so accustomed to the praise of their peers that they cannot proceed in the Spirit, not for someone who cannot bear the laugh of ridicule upon their own ears directed not just towards themselves, but towards the Holy Spirit that leads them and Christ Jesus who’s path they follow.

The contemplative soul who is led by the Holy Spirit, as nothing is done by human volition as all things of fruit proceed from the Father and are pure gift and are of nothing to praise the human spirit with, but God the Father Himself, is led as such by the Father and cannot be led on this path by any other means if the soul is truly a mystic, because if they are not, their fruits will not manifest and they will be revealed the fake they are, but the mystic is always a fruit bearer and the fruits grow from age to age , down the generations and into eternity.

God Bless you and much love and peace to you

Teresa
 
Michael C:
Hhi Starrs0, Did you ever understand something and have trouble explaining it? That’s what this is for me. Mysticism is a religious tendency and desire of the human soul towards an intimate union with the Divinity. I believe an example of a mystic may be Saint Teresa of Avila that experienced ecstacies(spelling?) or it may even be a stratch to describe St.Thomas Aquinas’ vision as mystical.

Hopefully someone can better explain this. Peace.
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Hello Michael.👋Saint Teresa of Avila was a Mystic… a right brain Mystic…Saint Thomas Aquinas was a Mystic…a left brain Mystic…while they were the most integrated of people phychologically…using Reason and Feeling…Head and Heart… for this balance is what allows the Holy Spirit to flow freely…hence the** wholeness** or **holiness **that we learn about when we read about the Mystics… **they did express their deep and intimate relationships with God in different ways. Always for the good of the Church. **There are wonderful tapes out …one set on Saint John of the Cross is my favourite…(Saint Teresa was actually Saint John of the Cross’s spiritual director)…God gave Saint John the job of reforming the Carmalite Order…no easy task at that point in History…you have no idea of just how cruel those in the Church and in the Order were to him…they lacked understanding because they lacked spirituality. He expressed much in poetry …especially in his great work… “Living Flame Of Love” …Do not be deterred from your seaching to understand who the Mystics were and just what was sooooooooo beautiful about them. There is a reason why you are interested …I think you should check out some of the excellent books and tapes that are available on the Mystics. **The Carmalites ( they are on the web…Saint Teresa’s order too) should be able to direct you to some. Or you may find a group who is giving a course on them. Any Theology College or Seminary ( worth its salt ) would have this type of course and it would be found in Spirituality…especially the middle ages. Some folks are more mature than others in their Faith Michael…you may be one of them. :yup: . **
May God continue to bless you,
Shalom,
Catherine
 
Teresa,

I loved your answer. It was so right on. I’ve always believed that “mystic” was kind of a quantitative term like “faithful” so it isn’t a matter of who is or isn’t a “mystic,” but where each person is in his/her mystical relationship with God.

To learn more about mysticism, I recommend you check out the book Mystical Theology: the Science of Love – you can read the table of contents and an excerpt online at the amazon link.

Reading it changed my whole outlook to theology, but it’s been a while and I’ve changed a lot since then so now I think I’ll just have to go read it again!

Alan
 
Hi there,

You have already had some good explainations. I would just like to add one point. When God leads a soul by this path, if that soul responds to these mystical gifts and graces eventually that soul will have a tremendous impact on the Church and the world. Look at the great saints that have been mentioned in other replies. They took thousands or more souls to Heaven with them. And continue centuries later to have an enormous influence for the good.

Kind regards
John Russell Jr
 
Another note: There are Jewish and Muslim mystics, too. As I understand it, the Greek mysterion or mystery, refers to something that can only be known by experience. Not something you can’t know, mind you, but something that words fail to describe, which is the experience of God. We’re talking about something like Buddhism, but experience of and a life hidden in a Person, and more than a force or an energy.

There are no words to precisely describe what it is that mystics experience. Or as the saying goes, “Those that say, don’t know, and those that know, don’t say.” That is why, I think, the mystics speak in metaphors and oblique sayings that are often misunderstood. But by the beauty of their lives, their devotion to living a life of love that is not sentimental or romanticized or self-absorbed, it is clear that what they live is the real deal. That is, they aren’t just people who have had a certain experience. They are people transformed by the experience of God.
 
I took a course in Catholic Mysticism given at a Franciscan Center for Spirituality.

The definition of Mysticism was given as the “experiencial awareness of the presence of God.” It is very hard to describe in human words.

We also learned that our Spiritual senses are different than our physical senses. When we “taste and see” the goodness of the Lord, we are not using our eyes and tongue. We feel with our heart and soul, not our fingers. And we hear with our Spiritual ears, which are not our physical ones.

And I suppose the scent of roses which is said to accompany some Mystical experiences could be different from other aromas—maybe others would not “smell” it.

In the book"The Mystic" by David Torkington (which was the book studied for this course) the three stages of prayer are described
Juvenile Prayer which is memorized Prayer
Adolescent prayer which is the Charismatic enthusiastic high praise.
Adult prayer which is the Contempletive prayer–

(these are just different types of prayer, and are all beneficial and can be used in any order once all are learned.)

Very, very few go beyond that to Mystical prayer, which would be the mystical experiences

We can “feel” the presence of God, but this is probably not an actual Mystical experience—they are very rare, and if anyone feels they may be having one they must go immediately for competant Spiritual direction. And while there are exceptions—some conversion experiences (the most well know being St Paul) the Mystics are very Holy people who spend much time in prayer—usually Contemplative. They strive for holiness constantly.

The Spiritual journey begins with Ascetical Practices (prayer, self-denial, sacraments, etc) which are the Purgative phase of the journey.
Then comes the Illuminative phase where God purifies (Dark Night of the Soul)
Lastly is the Unitive phase which is the true Intimacy with God.
 
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Mysty101:
In the book"The Mystic" by David Torkington (which was the book studied for this course) the three stages of prayer are described
Juvenile Prayer which is memorized Prayer
Adolescent prayer which is the Charismatic enthusiastic high praise.
Adult prayer which is the Contempletive prayer.
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Although an adult ought to be open to every sort of prayer, even contemplative prayer (mental prayer) is not a gift not given to all. It doesn’t mean a person is less holy if they find contemplative prayer a dry experience.
 
I posted the message below in another thread that seems relevant to your question.
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whosebob:
This was something I saw posted on EWTN’s Q&A boards, in the Philosophy forum; it seems applicable to this discussion . . .

Regarding Mystics and Visionaries

Dear Dr. Geraghty,

The Church does generally distinguish between a mystic and a visionary, kind of like squares and rectangles I think . . .

Many visionaries were/are also mystics, like St. Faustina. But not every mystic is a visionary. For example, I would think Fr. Thomas Dubay qualifies as a well-known living mystic (others may disagree), but as far as I know he doesn’t claim to have been privileged with any special revelations that would categorize him as a visionary.

As a synonym for mystic, I think the term “contemplative” can be used. To be sure, it can be noted that a well-known mystic is usually someone who records in writing or in other ways communicates his intense contemplative union with God. And in such a way that his unique personal spirituality and devotion (we all have or can develop this in our lives) becomes identified with his uniqe historical personage and personality.

But not every person is motivated, inclined or given the graces to record in a diary or some other form his dialogue with God. But all persons are called and offered the grace to grow in contemplative union with their Maker. And so many mystics are “born” and grow closer to God every day, among lay persons, religious and clergy. Most of them will remain completely anonymous, the leaven of their mystical communion with God still observable, though, in its effects, that is in their grace-powered works of mercy.

The reception of special revelations in the form of visions or voices is an uncommon grace from God and should be understood separately from the wonderful but “common” interior lights that all the baptized may receive as they grow in contemplative union. Not every person, indeed most people, will never receive an authentic vision. And among visionaries, even fewer seem to be given private revelations in such a way that is clear God also wants them to be shared publicly. Examples of visionaries who were also mystics are (again) St. Faustina Kowalska, St. Margaret Mary Alacoque, and St. Catherine of Siena. The child visionaries of Fatima are good examples of persons who were authentic visionaries but wouldn’t be categorized as mystics, at least at the time they received the private revelations.

From the late (Servant of God) Fr. John Hardon’s “Pocket Catholic Dictionary.”

Mysticism: The supernatural state of soul in which God is known in a way that no human effort or exertion could ever succeed in producing. There is an immediate, personal experience of God that is truly extraordinary, not only in intensity and degree, but in kind . . . *n Christian mysticism all union between the soul and God is a moral union of love, in doing his will even at great sacrifice to self; there is no hint of losing one’s being in God or absorption of one’s personality in the divine.

If we define a visionary as someone who receives a private revelation, then we can reference Fr. Hardon’s definition of private revelation.

Private Revelations: Supernatural manifestations by God of hidden truths made to private individuals for their own spiritual welfare or that of others . . . Private revelations occur as supernatural visions, words, or divine touches. Often it is impossible to distinguish the three forms in practice, especially since they may be received simultaneously.

In the Hearts of Jesus and Mary.*

I hope you find it helpful. By the way, the EWTN webpage that I quoted from can be found here.
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Thanks WhoseBob.

I remembered your post from the previous thread and thought it would be very appropriate here - but I couldn’t find it. Thanks for re-posting!
 
It’s so hard to describe the Divine using our limited knowledge and vocabulary. But there have been some wonderful insights offered in this thread that have deepened my understanding. In particular, thanks Catherine, Mysty, Teresa and Alan.

Here’s a link to Mysticism on New Advent:
newadvent.org/cathen/10663b.htm

As was noted I am sure TRUE Mystics are quite rare…but, as Alan shared, people can be on different levels in their “mystical relationships” with God.

I think we all have abilities that are beyond those defined by the physical laws of science. Perhaps we use them somewhat naturally when we are young (why do kids recall their dreams more easily? :o), but, as we become more proficient in the ways of the world, we lose those abilities.

Interesting thread. As a former Pastor once said to me, “The more he learns about God, the more he finds he doesn’t know.”
God Bless, dbqcj
 
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dbqcj:
Interesting thread. As a former Pastor once said to me, “The more he learns about God, the more he finds he doesn’t know.”
God Bless, dbqcj
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You hit the nail on the head about why mysticsm is so hard to explain in words. It is often said a mystic/contemplative knows by “not knowing.” The concept of “not knowing” is a way mystics sometimes explain the “experience” of God that goes beyond our rational and reasoning nature. The mystic doesn’t come to know God by the power of their intellect . . . they just know. And “how” they know is the unexplainable part of it all.

Well I probably butchered up that pretty good!
 
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