Names of God

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Lieutenant_Kije

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This is just a bunch of idle queries; I put it here since it is pretty inter-faith/cross-cultural.

–Do denominations ever feel particular about the cultural origins of the word for God? That is to say–is it considered problematic by any groups that the commonly used root theos has been at times used to refer to things distinctly not the Abrahamic God? Similarly–and more controversially–do any see a problem with Arabic-speaking Christians using Allah (the word Allah, idly, pre-dates Islam if I recall correctly) to refer to God (as some do)?

–What are the typical means for rendering YHWH into languages which are typically logographic rather than alphabetic? I am thinking specifically of Chinese here–do scholars tend to find a character with a similar approximate sound as YHWH or do they appropriate a character with a meaning such as “lord”?
 
“What’s in a name? That which we call a rose
By any other name would smell as sweet.”

Romeo and Juliet (II, ii, 1-2)

I doubt that God, the almighty and eternal one and only self-existent, is concerned about what we call Him. He just wants us to call Him.
 
I believe God wishes to be called his true name,that’s just me. It is not Buddah,Allah,or Zues to name a few.
 
FaithJoy said:
I believe God wishes to be called his true name,that’s just me. It is not Buddah,Allah,or Zues to name a few.
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We discussed this a little bit in PMs, but: what do you think that true name is? Yaweh or YHWH? You seem comfortable using the Germanic word God–are you comfortable with the Greek Theos or the Latin Deus? I ask because a great deal of contemporary English language etymology relies on both of those classical names. I know you aren’t comfortable with using Allah to mean God, so I won’t go there. If his true name is Yaweh and that is what he wishes to be called why on earth would one even use the term “God”?

In short: there is this tendency in some to be comfortable with Theos/Deus (when they have linguistic roots which pre-date the use of these terms to refer to YHWH) but not comfortable with non-Western equivalents such as Allah (or Shangdi/Tian in the case of Chinese–though the issue is much much much more complicated there). In both instances a word which predates the specific understanding or revelation of YHWH is appropriated and used to mean God (with a capital G). Why is it that certain people are comfortable doing this with Theos/Deus but not with other instances? Is there some underlying difference in meaning that I do not know?

I just realized my “in short” is longer than my first paragraph. >.>

Additionally, I still have no idea about methodologically representing YHWH in logographic languages (Chinese characters) but I doubt many on this forum have experience there so no biggie 😉
 
John_Paul_Jones said:
Yaweh is just the pronouciation of the Tetragrammaton YHWH. :rolleyes:
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That or wasn’t intended to be an exclusive one–I should have rendered it with a slash (Yaweh/YHWH). My bad if I confused you. I meant the question to be do you consider the name to be YHWH/Yaweh or something else?

Thanks for the sarcastic smiley though! 😉
 
The names of God from the Old Testament Yaweh/YHWH and Elohim, I don’t use that often, whether in conversation with people or in prayer, although I do use Lord in prayer, from what I understand, Lord being used in lieu of YHWH out of respect.

I believe in the Holy Trinity, (God the Father, God The Son and God The Holy Spirit)
In philosophical discussions I understand God as “God the Father.” “God The Father” is the name I use that others would refer to the creator God or 3O God (I’ve sewen used somewhere in another forum, 3O stands for omnipresent, omniscient, omnipotent.:))

When people talk about God in general I understand it as meaning The Holy Trinity to myself. But then of course I have to remind myself they don’t believe in Jesus Christ or the Trinity.When conversing with non-Christians I don’t say “God the Father,” or “The Trinity” I just use “God” in an attempt to find common ground & common language. They have their understanding of God and I have my understanding of God.

This all probably means nothing to an athiest. 😦
 
Elohim is not a name. It is the generic Hebrew word translated in English as “God”.
 
Lieutenant_Kije said:
Why is it that certain people are comfortable doing this with Theos/Deus but not with other instances? Is there some underlying difference in meaning that I do not know?
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In my opinion, the average Christian would not be comfortable referring to their deity as Zeus, despite the relationship between that name and your ‘pre-Abrahamic’ theos/deus. The reason for this should be clear: Zeus describes a particular god who is very clearly not the Christian god. Likewise, Allah, although it is related to a generic word for the idea of a divine being, is a specific name for a specific god who belongs to a religion which is not Christianity.

Christians usually refer to their god using an all-inclusive word like ‘god’, because they are monotheists, and they feel there is no need to be more clear when referring to (what they feel is) the only god of the cosmos. If they decide to use names, they rely upon the Hebrew epithets of YHWH, such as ‘Lord of Hosts’. Naturally, the all-inclusive word they decide to use to describe the idea of ‘god’, will vary based on their mother tongue. As you pointed out, an English speaker will use the Germanic form; whilst, on the other hand, a Spaniard will use a word derived from Latin.

Now, having said this, I’m not so certain what the value is in observing these facts. Is there a larger point to this thread I’m not seeing clearly?
 
I don’t think that the name of God or how to pronounce it is important as to knowing God himself, Jesus told the Samaritans that they worship what they do not know. That has taught me that no matter what names we call The Most High with, if we really don’t know Him from within ourselves then it doesn’t matter…

(John 4:19-24):
“Sir,” the woman said, "I can see that you are a prophet. Our fathers worshiped on this mountain, but you Jews claim that the place where we must worship is in Jerusalem. Jesus declared, “Believe me, woman, a time is coming when you will worship the Father neither on this mountain nor in Jerusalem. You Samaritans worship what you do not know; we worship what we do know, for salvation is from the Jews. Yet a time is coming and has now come when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth, for they are the kind of worshipers the Father seeks. God is spirit, and his worshipers must worship in spirit and in truth.”
 
If you can utter ever hebrew character in the Torah, you come up with the name of God, according to some Kabbalists who chose to study this and card counting.
 
PaulDupre said:
“What’s in a name? That which we call a rose
By any other name would smell as sweet.”

Romeo and Juliet (II, ii, 1-2)

I doubt that God, the almighty and eternal one and only self-existent, is concerned about what we call Him. He just wants us to call Him.
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I get the point you’re making, but I doubt “ANY” name is proper to call Him. We all can think of some pretty disrespectful names that we’d never give to the Holy Father…so it does matter to a degree.
The Hebrew root for the phrase “to be” is “hayah”:

Hayah = to be

ehyeh = I will be
yeh = he will be

ehyah = I am
yah = he is

The Father was not yet “what” he needed to be for his children, so He said to Moses, “I will be what[ever] I [will/need to] be” [for my people]. So you will notice that the “future” (“in progress”) form of “hayah” was used: EHYEH * ASHER[whatever] EHYEH*.

“Yahweh” is incorrect. The Father had/has a plan that is “in progress” which meant he was not yet finished, and because all Hebrew names suggest particular “status/function/action”, the Holy Father’s name could not be in the “complete” status/function/action just yet, but in “in progress” status/function/action: so if Israel spoke his name in the past (which they wouldn’t) they would’ve said “Yeh”.

The “weh” (from “Yahweh” [with “e”]) was a transliteration error of the Hebrew character (thought to be a pronounced as a “hard ‘a’” when first read), but it should be read “wah”, as in “Joshua” (the name given to the Son of Nun by Moses).

There is also a “u” that’s not pronounced after the “H” (because it’s “breathed”) like in many other Hebrew names…so the Holy Father’s name was “Yeh-hu-wah”…up until the point of Christ’s birth.

Then the Father became “Salvation” (shu-wah) for his people be sending his son, which changed the Holy Father’s name to “Yeh-shu-wah”. The Holy Father then gave “His” name (and subsequently ALL of His authority) to the right hand of his salvation, his son.

Finally, (and probably the most overlooked) the Son told his disciples that he would ask the Holy Father to send another helper. We call his name “the Holy Spirit”, but this is not what Yeshua says.
[John 14:26] But the Counselor, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name
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, will teach you all things and will remind you of everything I have said to you.

Most read this passage to mean “in [Christ’s] authority”, but in biblical times one’s name and one’s authority were interchangeable…so the Holy Spirit essentially has the same name as Christ and the Father.

All three persons essentially share the same name…which isn’t unheard of because many fathers give their names to their sons (even my dad gave his name to my order brother).
[Matthew 28:19] Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name
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of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit.

Notice that the passage does not say “in the names (plural) of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit”, but uses the “singular” form to denote a single name.

There is only one name…and that name is above every name; Yehushua; the name of the Father, given to the Son, and then to the Holy Spirit.**
 
Maybe we can get a little more Muslim (name removed by moderator)ut on this. But it seems that we are both correct on this. It seems that Muslims believe that Allah is a name and at the same time means God. That would make a lot of sense because the use of Allah changed from one deity to another over a period of time.letusreason.org/Islam6.htm
 
Lieutenant_Kije said:
This is just a bunch of idle queries; I put it here since it is pretty inter-faith/cross-cultural.

–Do denominations ever feel particular about the cultural origins of the word for God? That is to say–is it considered problematic by any groups that the commonly used root theos has been at times used to refer to things distinctly not the Abrahamic God? Similarly–and more controversially–do any see a problem with Arabic-speaking Christians using Allah (the word Allah, idly, pre-dates Islam if I recall correctly) to refer to God (as some do)?

–What are the typical means for rendering YHWH into languages which are typically logographic rather than alphabetic? I am thinking specifically of Chinese here–do scholars tend to find a character with a similar approximate sound as YHWH or do they appropriate a character with a meaning such as “lord”?
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Weird question. Bible clearly said that Yahweh IS THE NAME OF GOD.

**Exodus 3:15 God also said to Moses, "Say this to the Israelites: Yahweh, the God of your fathers, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob, has sent me to you. This is My name forever; this is how I am to be remembered in every generation.

**

.
 
Splinker said:
If you can utter ever hebrew character in the Torah, you come up with the name of God, according to some Kabbalists who chose to study this and card counting.
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Splinker, are there any Jewish documents from the 5th, 6th, 7th century of the Jews who lived in Arabia, preferably in Mecca & Medina before & during mohamads time…?

I am interested in knowing what name did the Jews of Arabia called God.

Thanks!
 
jakasaki said:
Splinker, are there any Jewish documents from the 5th, 6th, 7th century of the Jews who lived in Arabia, preferably in Mecca & Medina before & during mohamads time…?

I am interested in knowing what name did the Jews of Arabia called God.

Thanks!
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Jakasaki, I am sure you would feel insulted if someone called you names. Or a name that is not your name. What more of God ?!

How can Christians even accept that God has a name besides what He has given us?

Exodus 3:15 God also said to Moses, "Say this to the Israelites: Yahweh, the God of your fathers, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob, has sent me to you. This is My name forever; this is how I am to be remembered in every generation.

What did Jesus say? Jesus said that God gave His name to Him. What is God’s name? Yah-weh. What is Jesus’ name? Yah-shuah. The Father and The Son !.

.
 
PaulDupre said:
Elohim is not a name. It is the generic Hebrew word translated in English as “God”.
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Elohim isn’t a name? :confused:

According to the JewishEncyclopedia.com:
The most common of the originally appellative names of God is Elohim.
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and it goes further on to say:
The root-meaning of the word is unknown. The most probable theory is that it may be connected with the old Arabic verb “alih” (to be perplexed, afraid; to seek refuge because of fear). Eloah, Elohim, would, therefore, be “He who is the object of fear or reverence,” or “He with whom one who is afraid takes refuge” (comp. the name “fear of Isaac” in Gen. xxxi. 42, 53; see also Isa. viii. 13; Ps. lxxvi. 12). The predominance of this name in the later writings, as compared with the more distinctively Hebrew national name Yhwh, may have been due to the broadening idea of God as the transcendent and universal Lord.
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See Elohim doesn’t strictly translate as a “generic Hebrew word” meaning only “God,” but has a deeper meaning behind it. The ordinary name for God is “El” and even Jesus use a form “El” in the address “Eli” (or “My God”) in prayer when He said “Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani.”
 
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