National "Catholic" Reporter author ridicules Veneration of Saints and the Necessity of the Sacrament of Penance

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Read it here…

Bread and circuses during the Year of Mercy? No, grazie!

Take note about the author being a correspondent of The Tablet of London
The incident about that thing is here

I am so sad that there are Catholics who think that the veneration of Saints is “creepy, medieval, scary etc.”

If you check the comments, there is a certain user named Jesuitical claiming that Confession is unnecessary and that we could just confess directly to God. I do not know if she is Catholic but when there were supporters claiming that it was a Middle Age practice that should be abolished, I was heart broken.

Furthermore, the author claims to have studied Theology at the Pontifical Gregorian University.

I am saddened at this news seeing that there are many “Catholics” saying that Confession is unnecessary and that we should not go and see “rotting corpses which reflect the state of this Church”
 
Read it here…

Bread and circuses during the Year of Mercy? No, grazie!

Take note about the author being a correspondent of The Tablet of London
The incident about that thing is here

I am so sad that there are Catholics who think that the veneration of Saints is “creepy, medieval, scary etc.”

If you check the comments, there is a certain user named Jesuitical claiming that Confession is unnecessary and that we could just confess directly to God. I do not know if she is Catholic but when there were supporters claiming that it was a Middle Age practice that should be abolished, I was heart broken.

Furthermore, the author claims to have studied Theology at the Pontifical Gregorian University.

I am saddened at this news seeing that there are many “Catholics” saying that Confession is unnecessary and that we should not go and see “rotting corpses which reflect the state of this Church”
I wouldn’t waste my time or money on NC Reporter. It should have it’s middle name removed. God Bless, Memaw
 
I had an elderly priest tell me a few months ago (in the confessional, no less) that I “abused” the Sacrament of Reconciliation by coming monthly with venial sins and that a reasonable Catholic should only go to Confession once or twice in a lifetime! I bit my tongue, accepted absolution, and didn’t debate about the strength and graces that come from the sacrament, even when it was not “required.” (I’m definitely not scrupulous; my monthly confessions take only a few minutes.) While appalled (and wondering how many people thought, "well, then I won’t come anymore!), I’ve since decided his statement was a blessing. It made me think about WHY I do go to confession, and what a gift it is.
 
You really have to wonder about the motivation behind these corrosive articles.

Once the faith has been reformed to their liking, they won’t be Catholic at all.
 
Read it here…

Bread and circuses during the Year of Mercy? No, grazie!

Take note about the author being a correspondent of The Tablet of London
The incident about that thing is here

I am so sad that there are Catholics who think that the veneration of Saints is “creepy, medieval, scary etc.”

If you check the comments, there is a certain user named Jesuitical claiming that Confession is unnecessary and that we could just confess directly to God. I do not know if she is Catholic but when there were supporters claiming that it was a Middle Age practice that should be abolished, I was heart broken.

Furthermore, the author claims to have studied Theology at the Pontifical Gregorian University.

I am saddened at this news seeing that there are many “Catholics” saying that Confession is unnecessary and that we should not go and see “rotting corpses which reflect the state of this Church”
I don’t need to immediately read the article because on a free speech public message board there can be similar ideas expressed in different clothing.

Nonetheless, I will eventually read the article simply to find out the “current terminology.”
 
The tone of the article is certainly cynical and dismissive. Still, the author draws a clear distinction between believing in the Communion of Saints and the “veneration” of whole bodies. Withered fingers, detached arms, or even displayed whole bodies aren’t to me particularly edifying or inspiring. And the author of the article is totally correct about one thing: a fully-body display glass coffin isn’t an “urn.”
 
This is what you get when you have people who take it to heart when someone says “oh, it is not strictly necessary to pray to/venerate saints or Mary to be a good Catholic.” This is the kind of mindset that doesn’t grasp the simple idea that popular devotions are intrinsically linked to the Christian faith as it has been practiced for two thousand years.
 
If you check the comments, there is a certain user named Jesuitical claiming that Confession is unnecessary and that we could just confess directly to God. I do not know if she is Catholic but when there were supporters claiming that it was a Middle Age practice that should be abolished, I was heart broken.
Curiosity about the comments got the best of me.

When Jesuitical is found, be sure to read Pete the Greek. He is a great defender of Catholicism. Really knows his stuff. I saved some of the comments from Pete the Greek to use later when appropriate*.*

Ephesians, chapter 6 usccb.org/bible/ephesians/6

10*
Finally, draw your strength from the Lord and from his mighty power.
11
Put on the armor of God so that you may be able to stand firm against the tactics of the devil.g
12
For our struggle is not with flesh and blood but with the principalities, with the powers, with the world rulers of this present darkness, with the evil spirits in the heavens.h
13
Therefore, put on the armor of God, that you may be able to resist on the evil day and, having done everything, to hold your ground.*(“http://www.usccb.org/bible/ephesians/6#57006013-i”)
14
So stand fast with your loins girded in truth, clothed with righteousness as a breastplate,j
15
and your feet shod in readiness for the gospel of peace.k
16
In all circumstances, hold faith as a shield, to quench all [the] flaming arrows of the evil one.l
17
And take the helmet of salvation and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God.m
 
Still, the author draws a clear distinction between believing in the Communion of Saints and the “veneration” of whole bodies. Withered fingers, detached arms, or even displayed whole bodies aren’t to me particularly edifying or inspiring.
Thank you for being a voice of reason in this thread. I wonder if anyone else who has commented so far has even read the article in the original post. Based on the comments, I was expecting some sort of anti-Catholic diatribe, but the article is nothing of the sort. It’s very discouraging that allegedly faithful Catholics would react out of such immense confusion and misunderstanding of the point the article’s writer was making. If he was dismissing the need for the sacrament of Reconciliation, I would be first in line to disagree with and criticize him. If he was dismissing the value of praying to and venerating saints, I would be his harshest critic. But he said nothing even resembling either of these. To those who are jumping in the phony outrage ring, I ask you: Where are your critical thinking skills?
 
If he was dismissing the need for the sacrament of Reconciliation, I would be first in line to disagree with and criticize him. If he was dismissing the value of praying to and venerating saints, I would be his harshest critic. But he said nothing even resembling either of these. To those who are jumping in the phony outrage ring, I ask you: Where are your critical thinking skills?
To be fair, he is only critical of the practice of displaying the bodies (bones?) of the saints, not the veneration of saints in general.

However, he does seem to be contemptuous of the Sacrament of Reconciliation. From the article:
Both of them are aimed, fundamentally, at one thing – getting people to go back to confession, a practice most Catholics gave up a long, long time ago.
Well, good luck, fellas.
Pope Francis is popular and influential, but it’s unlikely that even he will be able to spark a revival in a practice that most Catholics know (correctly) is not essential to their membership in God’s household.
But this is one verdict of the “sensus fidelium” that it seems the pope does not want to acknowledge.
Clearly, if he asserts that the practice of Reconciliation is “not essential” to Catholics, then he’s out of step with what the Church teaches. Even worse, if he frames up this disregard for the sacrament as part of the ‘sensus fidelium’, he’s claiming that this (mistaken) notion is part of the deposit of faith – a part that he charges the pope to be aware of and deliberately ignoring.

Make no mistake – this is a shot across the bow! When one speaks of the ‘sensus fidelium’ in this way, one means to say that there is particular knowledge (on the part of the faithful) of the validity of a doctrinal belief. From the ITC’s Sensus Fidei in the Life of the Church: “The sensus fidei fidelis is a sort of spiritual instinct that enables the believer to judge spontaneously whether a particular teaching or practice is or is not in conformity with the Gospel and with apostolic faith.”

In other words, he’s asserting that Catholics (including Pope Francis) know that Reconciliation is unnecessary, but Francis is sticking his head in the sand and refusing to acknowledge it.
 
Something that has always struck me as particularly odd about Catholics.

They will stand in line all night to pass by the relics of St. Therese, or St. Maria Goretti, or whatever saint’s bones are currently making the rounds.

But Our Lord, according to Catholic dogma, is TRULY present, Body, Blood, Soul, and Divinity in tabernacles in Catholic Churches throughout the world, and the churches (those at least that are open) are empty. :o:confused:
 
Something that has always struck me as particularly odd about Catholics.

They will stand in line all night to pass by the relics of St. Therese, or St. Maria Goretti, or whatever saint’s bones are currently making the rounds.

But Our Lord, according to Catholic dogma, is TRULY present, Body, Blood, Soul, and Divinity in tabernacles in Catholic Churches throughout the world, and the churches (those at least that are open) are empty. :o:confused:
👍👍👍👍👍
 
Thank you for being a voice of reason in this thread. I wonder if anyone else who has commented so far has even read the article in the original post. Based on the comments, I was expecting some sort of anti-Catholic diatribe, but the article is nothing of the sort. It’s very discouraging that allegedly faithful Catholics would react out of such immense confusion and misunderstanding of the point the article’s writer was making. If he was dismissing the need for the sacrament of Reconciliation, I would be first in line to disagree with and criticize him. If he was dismissing the value of praying to and venerating saints, I would be his harshest critic. But he said nothing even resembling either of these. To those who are jumping in the phony outrage ring, I ask you: Where are your critical thinking skills?
I have a technical question for you. What is the relevance of this quote which appears twice in the article?
" understand the ways in which God’s great love manifests itself in their daily lives."

Could it possibly be in a fact sheet given to the journalists at the January 29, 2016 press conference? Since, at the moment, there is not immediate access to printed information, then using critical thinking skills is a tad necessary.

Part of my older than dirt critical appreciation of the written word is to learn from the author’s own words, his message in an article such as “Bread and circuses during the Year of Mercy? No, grazie!”
From post 10. “It’s very discouraging that allegedly faithful Catholics would react out of such immense confusion and misunderstanding of the point the article’s writer was making.”
From your point of view (post 10), as an independent reader, what would be the key point that the article’s writer was making, plus its confusion and the misunderstanding?
 
[/INDENT][/INDENT]From your point of view (post 10), as an independent reader, what would be the key point that the article’s writer was making, plus its confusion and the misunderstanding?
Key point: The unfortunate nature of taking cadavers and cadaver parts on tour to present a spectacle (“bread and circus”) for a nameless, faceless paying audience, all while pretending that it has anything to do with the objective of the Church’s Jubilee Year of Mercy.

Confusion: Any objection to such a spectacle must be an attack on the belief in the Communion of Saints or the very veneration of or devotion to the saints.
 
Key point: The unfortunate nature of taking cadavers and cadaver parts on tour to present a spectacle (“bread and circus”) for a nameless, faceless paying audience, all while pretending that it has anything to do with the objective of the Church’s Jubilee Year of Mercy.

Confusion: Any objection to such a spectacle must be an attack on the belief in the Communion of Saints or the very veneration of or devotion to the saints.
I agree to your key point – “The unfortunate nature of taking cadavers and cadaver parts on tour to present a spectacle (“bread and circus”)”
with this exception. I am not convinced that there is pretending, maybe yes, maybe no. The point of “dressed-up corpses” (my printed article page 3) is the key point especially in the below quote also from my printed pages 3-4.

I put in bold the point which eventually has to be addressed because it appears twice in the article. Is the author actually, but maybe unintentionally, presenting the real important issue of the “Extraordinary Holy Year of Mercy”? We can discuss this later.
From my printed pages 3-4 of the article.

"Do the men in the Vatican – including our dear Pope Francis – really think that dressing up dead bodies, even of the holiest of saints, is really going to help people “understand the ways in which God’s great love manifests itself in their daily lives”?

Most reasonable Catholics – Italians included – disagree with the need for such props and gimmicks the jubilee committee is using to promote the Holy Year."

I do not agree with your statement about confusion. – “Any objection to such a spectacle must be an attack on the belief in the Communion of Saints or the very veneration of or devotion to the saints”

Looking at the flow of the article, the first comments about the Sacrament of Confession are these from my printed page 2.
"Both of them are aimed, fundamentally, at one thing – getting people to go back to confession, a practice most Catholics gave up a long, long time ago.

Well, good luck, fellas.

Pope Francis is popular and influential, but it’s unlikely that even he will be able to spark a revival in a practice that most Catholics know (correctly) is not essential to their membership in God’s household."
From page 3, referring to the bodies of two dead Capuchin saints.

“It’s more than a little ironic that Fisichella, who is considered to be one of Italy’s most intelligent theologians, is being asked to promote this medieval, pietistic practice.”

In my opinion, the basic objection to the spectacle of dressed-up corpses is that it is a medieval, pietistic practice. Medieval is the operative word.

Please keep all of the above in mind as I switch to the comments section. Here Pete the Greek replies to the medieval issue.
“Know what’s also ‘medieval’ and ‘ancient’? The Eucharist, The Trinity, marriage, etc. Just because something didn’t have its origin in your latest issue of Cosmo isn’t a good reason to throw it out.”

My apology for this rough draft; but I needed to get my ideas down on paper before I forget them during a busy weekend.

Most of us do not need Robert Mickens to tell us what is happening to the Catholic Sacraments. In this article, Mickens first gives us the normal “evidence” for the decreased interest in the Sacrament of Confession and Reconciliation. Then, out of the blue, Pete the Greek alerted me to the obvious – we are living in a modern world and the Catholic Church needs to update those “medieval” and “ancient” teachings.
Mickens says on page 3. "But, beyond all that (referring to Padre Pio and Leopoldo Mandic`), this is the 21st century. Not the Middle Ages.

Personally, I do not see the article as directly attacking Catholicism. What I do see is that the author is inferring that the Sacrament of Confession and Reconciliation belongs in the medieval, pietistic practice category which is home to the “bread and circuses” event of displaying the bodies of two dead Capuchin saints. For those modern progressive emerging Christianity big tent individuals, the medieval connection is one more nail in the coffin of the Sacrament of Confession and Reconciliation.

Personally, I am not totally confident that I have made a strong case for dismissing the Sacrament of Confession and Reconciliation because it belongs with “medieval” and “ancient” pietistic practices. However, there is a prevalent view on the internet that certain “old” annoying doctrines need to be re-evaluated according to the ideas in this “new” century.
 
The tone of the article is certainly cynical and dismissive. Still, the author draws a clear distinction between believing in the Communion of Saints and the “veneration” of whole bodies. Withered fingers, detached arms, or even displayed whole bodies aren’t to me particularly edifying or inspiring. And the author of the article is totally correct about one thing: a fully-body display glass coffin isn’t an “urn.”
A very good point - although I wonder if Robert Mickens (being English) ever happened to go to Westminster Cathedral where the remains of St John Southworth (died 1654) are displayed in a glass casket (normally in a side chapel but in the centre of the nave on his feast day)… Still, the veneration of relics (as well as entire bodies or body parts) has always been a “take it or leave it” aspect of the Catholic faith and, granted, it’s not something which appeals to everyone. That said, many do of course feel a deeply held devotion to relics and Mickens’ approach doesn’t give these people their due. Although, as Lomar observed, we’d wish that the level of devotion that’s displayed towards relics (such as those of St Therese) would be matched by the level of devotion to the Eucharist, such devotion can often be a gateway to a deeper and closer relationship with Christ - in other words, where there’s faith (however slight) there’s hope!
Clearly, if he asserts that the practice of Reconciliation is “not essential” to Catholics, then he’s out of step with what the Church teaches. Even worse, if he frames up this disregard for the sacrament as part of the ‘sensus fidelium’, he’s claiming that this (mistaken) notion is part of the deposit of faith – a part that he charges the pope to be aware of and deliberately ignoring.
Strictly speaking this is true - although it really falls into the “yes, but” category - since even those outside of the Church (including those who have fallen away from it) who would obviously not receive the sacrament of reconciliation can still receive the grace of salvation. In the words of the Council Fathers in Lumen Gentium: “Nor does Divine Providence deny the helps necessary for salvation to those who, without blame on their part, have not yet arrived at an explicit knowledge of God and with His grace strive to live a good life. Whatever good or truth is found amongst them is looked upon by the Church as a preparation for the Gospel.” Of course, that’s not to deny the immense importance of the sacrament of reconciliation for the work of salvation. So really, I think that Mickens is missing the point - it’s not about whether or not reconciliation is truly essential for salvation but rather about the invaluable benefits it brings us before then and, especially the closer relationship with God, our loving Father, that we gain from it and it is this relationship which, IMHO, Pope Francis’ message is all about.
 
This is what you get when you have people who take it to heart when someone says “oh, it is not strictly necessary to pray to/venerate saints or Mary to be a good Catholic.” This is the kind of mindset that doesn’t grasp the simple idea that popular devotions are intrinsically linked to the Christian faith as it has been practiced for two thousand years.
Yup. I am not even surprised.
 
Do those who defend this author know he once expressed a desire that Pope Emeritus Benedict (the “Rat” he called him) would soon die to free the Church of his outdated conservative theology? That’s why, at least in part, the tablet let him go…
 
Saint Padre Pio of Pietrelcina, pray for us.
Lord have mercy, Lord have mercy, Lord have mercy.

Hail Mary, full of grace, the Lord is with thee.
Blessed art thou amongst women, and Blessed is the fruit of thy womb, Jesus.
Holy Mary, Mother of God, pray for us sinners now
and at the hour of our death, Amen.

The goats have come out to taunt us. Let them fall silent. Do not let their voices be heard. They kill the weak and the ignorant.

Let St. Leopold Mandic and St. Padre Pio be witnesses to the One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic faith.

Glory be to the Father, and to the Son, and to the Holy Spirit.
As it was in the beginning, is now and ever shall be world without end. Amen.
 
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