R
rayne100
Guest
What is the difference between a Witch and a Shaman in the Native American Religion/Culture?
I am legitimately curious.
I am legitimately curious.
- Status
R
reborn_pagan
Guest
I honestly have not a clue…From what i’ve reserched about the both of them…there all the same, just diffrent names
J
Jerusha
Guest
Shaman is a Russian term-- American Indians reject it-- even though it is used among anthropologists.
A witch is a witch is a witch. A negative term. I guess some exist.
The term medicineman, or medicine woman is used. Generally they maintain a low profile because of religious persecution and the tendency of white people to steal and pervert traditions.
A witch is a witch is a witch. A negative term. I guess some exist.
The term medicineman, or medicine woman is used. Generally they maintain a low profile because of religious persecution and the tendency of white people to steal and pervert traditions.
R
rayne100
Guest
My point was that Shaman for as much as I know it, was used for the Spiritual leader, medicine man, healer, prophet, however I read another post which referred to a witch as a Skinwearer. In a negative connotation,
I was wondering if there are any Native Americans on the board who would be able to tell me the name or title of the first and how it differs from the second.
M
mikew262
Guest
R
rayne100
Guest
That was not productive.I’ll get you my little pretty and your little dog too!!!
Funny, but not productive
M
mikew262
Guest
My apologies, but I couldn’t resist.That was not productive.
Funny, but not productive
L
Lion_of_Narnia
Guest
I once heard author Sherman Alexie (*Lone Ranger and Tonto Fist-fight in Heaven) *who is a Cour de Lion member ask at a book signing, “just what the (place of eternal damnation) does wicca have to do with Indian pow-wows???”
From the Indian perspecitive, Medicine Men & witchs are not equivalent
From the Indian perspecitive, Medicine Men & witchs are not equivalent
H
Hastrman
Guest
Well. I’m not a Native, but I went to school with a bunch of them, Navajos mostly. Among the Navajo…
A “medicine man” or “singer”, a hataalii, is the guardian of the Torah-esque law of the Navajo Way, given to them by Changing Woman to govern how they live within the Dinetah, the country bordered by the Four Mountains. Their main function is to perform “sings” or ritual healings, although at the Yeibichai dance they also become, temporarily, the avatars of nine of the Navajo gods, the Holy People.
A witch or “'ant’iizhii” (high tone on the a, nasal tones on all the i’s) is a person who intentionally violates Navajo taboos on incest or fratricide in exchange for power. They wear wolfskins and become yee naaldlooshii, skinwalkers, the evil shapeshifters who prowl around making werewolf-esque mischief. They use corpse poison, made from the powdered fingerprints of the dead, to bestow curses on people. They have “witches’ sings” where they chant prayers backwards, make evil sandpaintings out of ash, and have sex with corpses and relatives.
Oh, yeah, totally the same thing as medicine men, right? The Apache have similar witches, called “idlgashn”. The main difference is they use menstrual blood in addition to corpse-poison to bestow curses, and don’t become skinwalkers.
A “medicine man” or “singer”, a hataalii, is the guardian of the Torah-esque law of the Navajo Way, given to them by Changing Woman to govern how they live within the Dinetah, the country bordered by the Four Mountains. Their main function is to perform “sings” or ritual healings, although at the Yeibichai dance they also become, temporarily, the avatars of nine of the Navajo gods, the Holy People.
A witch or “'ant’iizhii” (high tone on the a, nasal tones on all the i’s) is a person who intentionally violates Navajo taboos on incest or fratricide in exchange for power. They wear wolfskins and become yee naaldlooshii, skinwalkers, the evil shapeshifters who prowl around making werewolf-esque mischief. They use corpse poison, made from the powdered fingerprints of the dead, to bestow curses on people. They have “witches’ sings” where they chant prayers backwards, make evil sandpaintings out of ash, and have sex with corpses and relatives.
Oh, yeah, totally the same thing as medicine men, right? The Apache have similar witches, called “idlgashn”. The main difference is they use menstrual blood in addition to corpse-poison to bestow curses, and don’t become skinwalkers.
R
rayne100
Guest
Thank you for taking the time to explain it to me. It seems I was correct in thinking that there was a difference.
Was this directed at me? I certainly did not think they were the same
L
lizaanne
Guest
duh - never mind - my browser skipped and I clicked in the wrong forum 
~Liza
~Liza
H
Hastrman
Guest
No, not you, several of the others (reborn_pagan, for one). It’s a common misconception that Natives don’t have the concept of witches-as-evil, but I think the Navajo and Apache kind of disprove that, don’t they?Was this directed at me? I certainly did not think they were the same
J
Jerusha
Guest
Yeah-- I don’t know of witches in my cultural tradition, but it has been diluted enough–
Hastmann has it right.
more whites are involved in witchcraft in the US than Indians
Hastmann has it right.
I’ll get you my little pretty and your little dog too!!!
more whites are involved in witchcraft in the US than Indians
H
Hastrman
Guest
J
Jerusha
Guest
1/8 Winnebago, 1/8 Sac& Fox
R
rayne100
Guest
This is misleading. I am sure that there are quite a few who claim to be Witches, however professing a pagan religion (even wicca) is not the same thing as Witchcraft.What tradition is that?
Well, more whites than indians claim to be witches.
Witchcraft is another skill set altogether.
But I do thank you again Hastrman for giving me your understanding of the difference between witches and (what I kew as Shamans) ( I appologise, I still do not know what to call them in your culture).
F
Freshman88
Guest
I object. That is blatant racism and stereotyping. My Slavic ancestors have done no such thing. There may be such a tendency in Western European countries(the colonizers anyway), but they are certainly not the whole of “white people”.
I hate it when my race is bashed for something a bunch of colonizers, (of whom I have no relation to at all) did.
R
rayne100
Guest
You have a valid point…it was an incendiary statement
J
Jerusha
Guest
:banghead:
—Synonyms 1.** Tendency, direction, trend, drift refer to inclination or line of action or movement. A tendency is an inclination toward a certain line of action (whether or not the action follows), and is often the result of inherent qualities, nature, or habit: *a tendency to procrastinate. *Direction is the line along which an object or course of action moves, often toward some set point or intended goal: *The change is in the direction of improvement. *Trend emphasizes simultaneous movement in a certain direction of a number of factors, although the course or goal may not be clear for any single feature: Business indicators showed a downward trend. Drift emphasizes gradual development as well as direction: the drift of his argument. 2. proclivity, leaning.
Since when is the use of the word “tendency” associated with stereotyping? Indians have a tendency to have problems with alcohol.
When white people use the race card-- I find it hilarious. Why not try reading this article:
splcenter.org/intel/intelreport/article.jsp?aid=721
See tend1, -encyhttp://cache.lexico.com/dictionary/graphics/luna/thinsp.png]
—Synonyms 1.** Tendency, direction, trend, drift refer to inclination or line of action or movement. A tendency is an inclination toward a certain line of action (whether or not the action follows), and is often the result of inherent qualities, nature, or habit: *a tendency to procrastinate. *Direction is the line along which an object or course of action moves, often toward some set point or intended goal: *The change is in the direction of improvement. *Trend emphasizes simultaneous movement in a certain direction of a number of factors, although the course or goal may not be clear for any single feature: Business indicators showed a downward trend. Drift emphasizes gradual development as well as direction: the drift of his argument. 2. proclivity, leaning.
Since when is the use of the word “tendency” associated with stereotyping? Indians have a tendency to have problems with alcohol.When white people use the race card-- I find it hilarious. Why not try reading this article:
splcenter.org/intel/intelreport/article.jsp?aid=721
F
Freshman88
Guest
I know what “tendency” means. Don’t be silly.:banghead:
When white people use the race card-- I find it hilarious. Why not try reading this article:
splcenter.org/intel/intelreport/article.jsp?aid=721
You didn’t understand what I wrote. That tendancy is not a WHITE tendancy, Perhaps it is an Anglo tendancy, perhaps a French or Spanish tendancy. But that is only THREE. Just three nations out of the whole europe. How does that constitute a tendancy? It doesn’t. Likewise, the American treatment of Natives is hardly represenative of the whole of europe. How can a couple hicks in the American backwaters create a tendancy in a race of hundreads of millions. It doesn’t make any sense. There is no tendancy in most European nations, and most Europeans. Again, it is hardly a tendancy.
I have the right to pull the race as much as anyother race does. That comment was just silly.
- Status