Natural family planning and abstinence

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M1986

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I have a question regarding natural family planning and sexual activities other than intercourse. My husband and I are practicing nfp as we are not financially ready for children. We are both required to work at this time. I have learned that Catholicism teaches it is not acceptable to engage in sexual activity (such as oral sex, genital stimulation of ones partner, etc) that does not allow for the possibility of procreation. My question is, why then is it ok to engage in sexual intercourse during times in your cycle when you know that you are infertile, when you know with near certainty that intercourse will not result in conception? How is that any different? It is frustrating for me since the only time during my cycle when I seem to be capable of arousal is right before and during ovulation. It is putting a strain on the intimacy in our relationship and I can’t imagine enduring this one-sidedness for our entire marriage (unless of course we just stop using nfp and irresponsibly have more children than we can financially and emotionally care for).
 
The short answer: God designed the sexual act to go like this - penis in vagina with man ejaculating into vagina. Anytime a married couple has sex, that’s what has to happen in order for it to be “procreative”. Contraception thwarts the procreative aspect by interfering with the nature of the act. (Condoms block sperm, the pill blocks ovulation/is abortificient, etc.) And oral sex, etc. obstruct the act because the penis doesn’t go in the vagina and the man doesn’t ejaculate into the vagina.

I’m sorry you’re struggling. I will pray for you. :gopray:
 
M1986 said:
I have learned that Catholicism teaches it is not acceptable to engage in sexual activity (such as oral sex, genital stimulation of ones partner, etc) that does not allow for the possibility of procreation. My question is, why then is it ok to engage in sexual intercourse during times in your cycle when you know that you are infertile, when you know with near certainty that intercourse will not result in conception? How is that any different?.
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It is OK to **abstain **from the act or **engage **in the act as designed. When using NFP, you either engage in the marital act or you don’t depending on whether you are trying to conceive, trying to avoid, or not trying either way.

It is not OK to **replace ** the act with masturbation (which is what oral or manual stimulation to orgasm is).
 
Hi 🙂

I’m not married but I will try to help answer your questions. Again, please take this with a grain of salt as I admit I am not as knowledgable about this as other posters may be! You are correct that the Roman Catholic Church does not approve of intimate activites that are not designed to create children. As for your question of why it’s prohibited to do the former but why it’s okay to engage in intimacy during your “infertile” periods is because:
1.) That is the only natural way to produce a child. Intimacy should be both unitive and procreative. The 2 go together.
2.) Even when most people are seemingly “infertile” during specific times of the month, not using artificial contraception still gives God a chance to help form a new life if it is His will.

Hope I helped and good luck. 🙂
 
Thank you everyone for your thoughtful and informative replies. I just have to try and wrap my head around how the act of intercourse is acceptable only because it is procreative, even though following nfp to prevent conception means only engaging in intercourse when it is NOT procreative. Would a correct understanding be that the act is meant to REPRESENT procreation, regardless or whether or not it will occur? Since of course there is no way for other sexual activities to represent procreation.
 
M1986 said:
Thank you everyone for your thoughtful and informative replies. I just have to try and wrap my head around how the act of intercourse is acceptable only because it is procreative, even though following nfp to prevent conception means only engaging in intercourse when it is NOT procreative. Would a correct understanding be that the act is meant to REPRESENT procreation, regardless or whether or not it will occur? Since of course there is no way for other sexual activities to represent procreation.
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The point is that even if conception is unlikely it is open to life because the couple is completing the act fully, without in any way rejecting God by using artificial means to prevent contraception.
 
M1986 said:
I have a question regarding natural family planning and sexual activities other than intercourse. My husband and I are practicing nfp as we are not financially ready for children. We are both required to work at this time. I have learned that Catholicism teaches it is not acceptable to engage in sexual activity (such as oral sex, genital stimulation of ones partner, etc) that does not allow for the possibility of procreation. My question is, why then is it ok to engage in sexual intercourse during times in your cycle when you know that you are infertile, when you know with near certainty that intercourse will not result in conception? How is that any different? . It is putting a strain on the intimacy in our relationship and I can’t imagine enduring this one-sidedness for our entire marriage (unless of course we just stop using nfp and irresponsibly have more children than we can financially and emotionally care for).
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Does anybody has the answer to this part?
 
SusanneT said:
The point is that even if conception is unlikely it is open to life because the couple is completing the act fully, without in any way rejecting God by using artificial means to prevent contraception.
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Right. Very well stated, though I think you mean conception rather than contraception.
 
It is frustrating for me since the only time during my cycle when I seem to be capable of arousal is right before and during ovulation.

Does anybody has the answer to this part of the problem?😳
 
That sucks OP. I can somewhat relate though I don’t have it as bad. I tend to have a high libido a few days after ovulation which is convenient. However it drops off very fast then. I find that planning the days we’ll have sex and making sure to not leave it until I’m very tired help a bit with the libido problem. I hope you can work something out with your husband :hug1: I am sure you can find a less frustrating solution: there are a lot of books on ways of showing affection / bonding during abstinence times. Of course with a high libido some may make the frustration worse (e.g. cuddling) but I am sure there are ways of bonding that you will both enjoy and might take your mind off sexual frustration a bit. Just a suggestion.
 
Dear M1986: There is also the part that seems that the church doesn’t have an absolute answer on oral, genital estimulations, etc, during intercourse. I have gotten both responses from within the church, (allowed and NOT allowed). Also not a subject that can easily be talked about with clerics without been specific. I’m with you on this one, hopefully there’ll be good answers here.
 
tamedlion said:
Dear M1986: There is also the part that seems that the church doesn’t have an absolute answer on oral, genital estimulations, etc, during intercourse. I have gotten both responses from within the church, (allowed and NOT allowed). Also not a subject that can easily be talked about with clerics without been specific. I’m with you on this one, hopefully there’ll be good answers here.
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Oral and manual stimulation of genitals is allowed during FOREPLAY between married couples, ***as long as the act ultimately culminates with the penis going into the vagina and ejaculating into the vagina. ***

It’s not okay to have oral/manual stimulation without the penis ending up in the vagina and ejaculating into the vagina.
 
kptrs said:
Oral and manual stimulation of genitals is allowed during FOREPLAY between married couples, ***as long as the act ultimately culminates with the penis going into the vagina and ejaculating into the vagina. ***

It’s not okay to have oral/manual stimulation without the penis ending up in the vagina and ejaculating into the vagina.
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A dear older priest told me other wise, but in any case, I hope I can remember KPTRS on my judgement day, God bless you!
 
kptrs said:
The short answer: God designed the sexual act to go like this - penis in vagina with man ejaculating into vagina. Anytime a married couple has sex, that’s what has to happen in order for it to be “procreative”. Contraception thwarts the procreative aspect by interfering with the nature of the act. (Condoms block sperm, the pill blocks ovulation/is abortificient, etc.) And oral sex, etc. obstruct the act because the penis doesn’t go in the vagina and the man doesn’t ejaculate into the vagina.

I’m sorry you’re struggling. I will pray for you. :gopray:
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And there you have it, folks!
I love that we can talk like adults here!
 
kptrs said:
Oral and manual stimulation of genitals is allowed during FOREPLAY between married couples, ***as long as the act ultimately culminates with the penis going into the vagina and ejaculating into the vagina. ***

It’s not okay to have oral/manual stimulation without the penis ending up in the vagina and ejaculating into the vagina.
Click to expand...
This rule just seems like something that was decided by MEN over 2000 years ago, and no matter how much I wrack my brain I can’t think of a reason that actually justifies it. No sex before marriage I can understand, and no sex unless you ultimately intend to bring life into the world I can also understand. But other than that I can’t see how it makes sense. Maybe 2000 years ago when men thought their penises, sperm, etc were God’s gift to women (literally lol), but now I just don’t get it. Sorry to be crude.
 
M1986 said:
This rule just seems like something that was decided by MEN over 2000 years ago,
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No dear, it is God’s design for human from the beginning. Our bodies are not our own. They are God’s temple. Sexual intercouser is part of God’s design. It has its proper place in our lives, but we attempt to distort its purpose in many ways.
 
M1986 said:
…I just have to try and wrap my head around how the act of intercourse is acceptable only because it is procreative, even though following nfp to prevent conception means only engaging in intercourse when it is NOT procreative. Would a correct understanding be that the act is meant to REPRESENT procreation, regardless or whether or not it will occur? Since of course there is no way for other sexual activities to represent procreation.
Click to expand...
It’s important not to trip up on the meaning of words. The word “procreative” as used here does not mean that procreation is possible. The word “procreative” is describing something about what you are doing. You are engaging sexually in a manner that is “ordered to” or points to procreation. The the state of the person - eg. sterility (permanent or temporary) has NO bearing on whether the act was procreative.

The Church recognises that our sexual faculty - this is evident by observation - seeks both unity and procreation. It concludes that man should not undo the natural association of these attributes.
 
Rau said:
It’s important not to trip up on the meaning of words. The word “procreative” as used here does not mean that procreation is possible. The word “procreative” is describing something about what you are doing. You are engaging sexually in a manner that is “ordered to” or points to procreation. The the state of the person - eg. sterility (permanent or temporary) has NO bearing on whether the act was procreative.

The Church recognises that our sexual faculty - this is evident by observation - seeks both unity and procreation. It concludes that man should not undo the natural association of these attributes.
Click to expand...
Thank you, Rau, your explanation helps a lot! To think about procreative as something that is being done vs something that is happening. To think of the act as being “ordered to” procreation helps me to understand where the Church is coming from. Thank you again 🙂
 
A practical suggestion so that you will not want to indulge in these illicit practices:

We have at times struggled with abstinence and like you finding the only time I enjoyed sex was during or just before fertile times.

But by learning NFP fully and observing fertile signs carefully, we now find that we can enjoy full relations much closer to ovulation than before … 4, 3 or 3 even 2 days before predicted ovulation, whereas before we abstained once we got to 6 days before - at a time when I had no real interest in sex.
You do not say what NFP method you use? Maybe therefore NFP lessons and/or a good teacher will help ?
 
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