NCR and its priestesses

[bones_IV]

Link

'single-gender lifestyles'.

What in the world does that mean? I’m a single-gender person myself, I’m a male. Yet in the context of that paragraph I’m ‘ignoring Church teaching’ on that?

Huh?

When even the deeply traditional Greek Orthodox church finds a way to authorize ordaining women deacons

EXCUSE ME?! Where the blue hell do they get this idea? NO Orthodox synod would ever do that because it’s a theological impossibility and it’d be a change, and we don’t change (the calendar caused enough of a fight amongst us). If they’re getting their info from those heretical pseudo-dox sects (which would be like us treating sedevacantists like mainstream Catholics) they are either incredibly stupid or incredibly dishonest.

The Orthodox Church never has and never will ordain women. Nuff said. Case closed. Would the Distorter please refrain from sticking their nose in our business and dragging us down with them?

 

[NewUlm1976_2000]

Link

'single-gender lifestyles'.

What in the world does that mean? I’m a single-gender person myself, I’m a male. Yet in the context of that paragraph I’m ‘ignoring Church teaching’ on that?

Huh?

I believe the point trying to be brought across is that other (non-Catholic) denominations have shown that women can also do the same jobs that historically have been done by men. Women can be just as spiritual as men and there are real life examples showing that they can run a parish in (parish administrators) and out of the Catholic Church. That their vocations do not have to be limited to where they are. That is how I read this.

 

[Brendan]

EXCUSE ME?! Where the blue hell do they get this idea? NO Orthodox synod would ever do that because it’s a theological impossibility and it’d be a change, and we don’t change (the calendar caused enough of a fight amongst us). If they’re getting their info from those heretical pseudo-dox sects (which would be like us treating sedevacantists like mainstream Catholics) they are either incredibly stupid or incredibly dishonest.

The Orthodox Church never has and never will ordain women. Nuff said. Case closed. Would the Distorter please refrain from sticking their nose in our business and dragging us down with them?

The Greek Orthodox Church does have ‘Deaconess’, they are generally senior nuns known for their service ministries.

But you are quite correct, they do NOT recieve Holy Orders, but are Consecrated into the office. The role of the Deaconess NEVER involves a liturgical role, such as chanting the Gospel. Like all women, they are not permitted into the Sanctuary.

 

[bones_IV]

The Greek Orthodox Church does have ‘Deaconess’, they are generally senior nuns known for their service ministries.

But you are quite correct, they do NOT recieve Holy Orders, but are Consecrated into the office. The role of the Deaconess NEVER involves a liturgical role, such as chanting the Gospel. Like all women, they are not permitted into the Sanctuary.

Right.

 

[THurifer2]

Interesting that the real issue isnt Ordaining Women…but a splitting open of Morality. Take a look at the moral stances these women have on the issues of Abortion and Homosexuality.

One of them is divorced and married to a former priest.

All of them seem to be absolute FLAKES.

 

[scylla]

I believe the point trying to be brought across is that other (non-Catholic) denominations have shown that women can also do the same jobs that historically have been done by men. Women can be just as spiritual as men and there are real life examples showing that they can run a parish in (parish administrators) and out of the Catholic Church. That their vocations do not have to be limited to where they are. That is how I read this.

That makes sense and would be acceptable if the Priesthood was just a job.

This is why in pagan religions and non-catholic belief systems it is perfectly ok to have women priestesses.

Yet just because they can act like a priest doesn’t mean that the role is proper or it is a good thing. Just because I can act like a mommy (I am a man) doesn’t mean that I can be one.
The role of the Priesthood is to stand in the person of Christ who was incarnate as a man.
To advocate women priests would be to represent Jesus not as a man and to deny the incarnation.

I would suggest you listen to Peter Kreeft’s explanation on this,
peterkreeft.com/audio.htm

God Bless
Scylla

 

[bpbasilphx]

**
EXCUSE ME?! Where the blue hell do they get this idea? NO Orthodox synod would ever do that because it’s a theological impossibility and it’d be a change,**

Well, the State Church of Greece, for one.

St. Nectarios, for another. He ordained a couple of deaconesses for his women’s monasteries.

And you can read the service for ordaining a deaconess here and draw your own conclusions about the service.

anastasis.org.uk/ordinations.htm

I will point out that the rite is called CHEIROTONIA and NOT Cheirothesia, the opening prayer (Divine Grace…) and others the same as for a Deaon, Presbyter, or Bishop, it takes place during the Liturgy in the SAME PLACE as for a male deacon, and the new Deaconess is vested with the orarion and replaces the chalice on the altar.

Deaconesses are also talked about in the Pedalion.

Deal with it.

 

[bones_IV]

**
EXCUSE ME?! Where the blue hell do they get this idea? NO Orthodox synod would ever do that because it’s a theological impossibility and it’d be a change,**

Well, the State Church of Greece, for one.

St. Nectarios, for another. He ordained a couple of deaconesses for his women’s monasteries.

And you can read the service for ordaining a deaconess here and draw your own conclusions about the service.

anastasis.org.uk/ordinations.htm

I will point out that the rite is called CHEIROTONIA and NOT Cheirothesia, the opening prayer (Divine Grace…) and others the same as for a Deaon, Presbyter, or Bishop, it takes place during the Liturgy in the SAME PLACE as for a male deacon, and the new Deaconess is vested with the orarion and replaces the chalice on the altar.

Deaconesses are also talked about in the Pedalion.

Deal with it.

Let’s be clear about a few things.

Deaconesses can’t-

They do not recieve the Sacrament of Holy Orders
They do not read the Gospel at the Divine Liturgy
They do not wear vestments at Divine Liturgy
They do not Baptize or witness Marriages ( but neither do Eastern Deacons anyway)

They are not allowed up on the altar at all actually.
They sit\stand with the other members of the laity and perform no liturigical function other than what the laity normally do.

 

[bones_IV]

We don’t have women deacons, never had never will. Deaconesses is another matter. Ordained yes just like abbesses are blessed like their male counterparts, and wear some of the pontifical vestments. Deaconesses are a ministry of women to women. When a deacon serves with a priest, he doesn’t place the chalice on the altar the priest does. So much misinformation out there. When women are ordained to the office of deaconess their role tends to be social ministry and assistants to women being baptized.

 

[Ovenbird03]

I like the part where the one lady ‘became a priest’ when a chalice was given to her as a gift.

Um…WHAT?

And the part about the only way of finding a church you like is to start your own.

AND the part about if everyone who didn’t follow one tenet of the faith was ‘out of the church’ than a lot of conservative Catholics would be out…(so?)

Sad, very sad. Especially the women who left religious orders.

 

[japhy]

Jean Marchant, who “was ordained under a pseudonym in 2005”. Let’s imagine Jean Marchant is a man who is being ordained validly in the Catholic Church. Can he be ordained under a pseudonym? How on earth is a pseudonym ordination acceptable?!

 

[Andreas_Hofer]

The Greek Orthodox Church does have ‘Deaconess’, they are generally senior nuns known for their service ministries.

But you are quite correct, they do NOT recieve Holy Orders, but are Consecrated into the office. The role of the Deaconess NEVER involves a liturgical role, such as chanting the Gospel. Like all women, they are not permitted into the Sanctuary.

**
EXCUSE ME?! Where the blue hell do they get this idea? NO Orthodox synod would ever do that because it’s a theological impossibility and it’d be a change,**

Well, the State Church of Greece, for one.

St. Nectarios, for another. He ordained a couple of deaconesses for his women’s monasteries.

And you can read the service for ordaining a deaconess here and draw your own conclusions about the service.

anastasis.org.uk/ordinations.htm

I will point out that the rite is called CHEIROTONIA and NOT Cheirothesia, the opening prayer (Divine Grace…) and others the same as for a Deaon, Presbyter, or Bishop, it takes place during the Liturgy in the SAME PLACE as for a male deacon, and the new Deaconess is vested with the orarion and replaces the chalice on the altar.

Deaconesses are also talked about in the Pedalion.

Deal with it.

The NCR was flat out (and easily avoidably) wrong because no Orthodox church has female deacons. If Bones IV was trying to deny deaconesses as well then I’m sure he stands corrected, but the substance of his complaint remains. It is insanely easy for the writer of an editorial to do some online reading and find out that a deaconess is not the same thing as a deacon. Either the NCR didn’t bother, which would be ****-poor journalism, or else they don’t understand or care about the distinction, which is intellectually dishonest.

As to the fact that deaconesss are, according to the Greek text, ordained, I don’t understand why people try to make a big deal out of that. In the Latin rites a subdeacon is also ordained - but being ordained and receiving Holy Orders are not synonymous, as a subdeacon does not receive the latter.

 

[benedictgal]

Link

'single-gender lifestyles'.

What in the world does that mean? I’m a single-gender person myself, I’m a male. Yet in the context of that paragraph I’m ‘ignoring Church teaching’ on that?

Huh?

When even the deeply traditional Greek Orthodox church finds a way to authorize ordaining women deacons

EXCUSE ME?! Where the blue hell do they get this idea? NO Orthodox synod would ever do that because it’s a theological impossibility and it’d be a change, and we don’t change (the calendar caused enough of a fight amongst us). If they’re getting their info from those heretical pseudo-dox sects (which would be like us treating sedevacantists like mainstream Catholics) they are either incredibly stupid or incredibly dishonest.

The Orthodox Church never has and never will ordain women. Nuff said. Case closed. Would the Distorter please refrain from sticking their nose in our business and dragging us down with them?

In any event, if that were to happen, then that would really set back any efforts of reconciliation between the two Sister Churches because of the issue of valid ordinations and Apostolic Succession. If the Orthodox were indeed ordaining women to the diaconate, then, things between our Church and theirs would be ruptured, and, it would have made all of the headlines.

 

[benedictgal]

I believe the point trying to be brought across is that other (non-Catholic) denominations have shown that women can also do the same jobs that historically have been done by men. Women can be just as spiritual as men and there are real life examples showing that they can run a parish in (parish administrators) and out of the Catholic Church. That their vocations do not have to be limited to where they are. That is how I read this.

I am curious. Would your namesake have ordained a woman to the priesthood?

Your post fails to take into account what Pope John Paul II issued regarding female clergy:

Notification

1. Our offices have received from several countries signs of courses that are being planned or underway, directly or indirectly aimed at the diaconal ordination of women. Thus are born hopes which are lacking a solid doctrinal foundation and which can generate pastoral disorientation.

1. Since [the Church] does not foresee such ordination, it is not licit to enact initiatives which, in some way, aim to prepare women candidates for diaconal ordination.

1. The authentic promotion of women in the Church, in conformity with the constant ecclesial Magisterium, with special reference to [the teaching] of His Holiness John Paul II, opens other ample prospectives of service and collaboration.

1. The undersigned Congregations within the sphere of their proper authority thus turn to the individual ordinaries, asking them to explain [this] to their own faithful and to apply diligently the above-mentioned directives.

One of the authors of this notification was someone by the name of Joseph Cardinal Ratzinger, who has since become Pope Benedict XVI.

Therefore, your comment regarding female clergy stands in opposition to a matter on which Rome has already decided. Inasmuch as there are female pastoral administrators, they cannot be ordained priests. The Church does not have the authority to do so, as indicated in the above citation. This is an example of Peter binding himself to Tradition.