Necessary for Salvation

[jpink1019]

1. Is Mary’s Intercession required for Salvation in the Catholic Church.
   (Meaning do we need anything from the Mother of God to recieve Salvation?)
2. According to the teaching of the Church and from catholics yourselves, what is required for Salvation?

I have tried asking this question before, but it was not made clear.

 

[Bookcat]

According to the teaching of the Church and from catholics yourselves, what is required for Salvation?

Initially – and normally - an adult hears the Gospel --repents and believes and is baptized…etc

One who is prior to the advent of the age of reason can receive new life in Christ via the Sacrament of Faith --Baptism.

Now is Mary involved in praying for those would become her children? Certainly - as are other good Mothers.

Her “yes” was involved by God in our receiving Jesus Christ the Lord. Such is how God willed it to happen. The Angel came to her…

 

[Bookcat]

Some aspects

Compendium issued by Pope Benedict XVI

1. Why did the Son of God become man?

456-460

For us men and for our salvation, the Son of God became incarnate in the womb of the Virgin Mary by the power of the Holy Spirit. He did so to reconcile us sinners with God, to have us learn of God’s infinite love, to be our model of holiness and to make us “partakers of the divine nature” (2 Peter 1:4).

1. What does the word “Incarnation” mean?

461-463
483

The Church calls the mystery of the wonderful union of the divine and human natures in the one divine Person of the Word the “Incarnation”. To bring about our salvation the Son of God was made “flesh” (John 1:14) and became truly man. Faith in the Incarnation is a distinctive sign of the Christian faith.

1. In what way is Jesus Christ true God and true man?

464-467
469

Jesus is inseparably true God and true man in the unity of his divine Person. As the Son of God, who is “begotten, not made, consubstantial with the Father,” he was made true man, our brother, without ceasing to be God, our Lord.

1. What does the Council of Chalcedon (in the year 451) teach in this regard?

467

The Council of Chalcedon teaches us to confess “one and the same Son, our Lord Jesus Christ, perfect in his humanity, true God and true man, composed of rational soul and body, consubstantial with the Father by his divinity, and consubstantial with us by his humanity, ‘like us in all things but sin’ (Hebrews 4:15), begotten from the Father before all ages as to his divinity, and in these last days, for us and for our salvation, born of Mary, the Virgin and Mother of God, as to his humanity.”

---

1. How does Mary cooperate in the divine plan of salvation?

493-494
508-511

By the grace of God Mary was kept free from every personal sin her whole life long. She is the one who is “full of grace” (Luke 1:28), “the all holy”. When the angel announced to her that she would give birth to “the Son of the Most High” (Luke 1:32), she freely gave her consent with “the obedience of faith” (Romans 1:5). Mary thus gave herself entirely to the person and work of her Son Jesus, espousing wholeheartedly the divine will regarding salvation.

 

[jpink1019]

I will repeat myself…

Is Mary’s Intercession or involvement required for those now who are looking for Salvation through the Church?

A clear yes or no?

 

[Genesis315]

We need to to distinguish between what could be and what is. In the abstract, Mary’s intercession is not absolutely necessary–God could do it otherwise. But in reality, her intercession is always involved. This is the teaching of the Church, from the Second Vatican Council’s Dogmatic Constitution on the Church:
Lumen Gentium:

1. This maternity of Mary in the order of grace began with the consent which she gave in faith at the Annunciation and which she sustained without wavering beneath the cross, and lasts until the eternal fulfillment of all the elect. Taken up to heaven she did not lay aside this salvific duty, but by her constant intercession continued to bring us the gifts of eternal salvation.

vatican.va/archive/hist_councils/ii_vatican_council/documents/vat-ii_const_19641121_lumen-gentium_en.html

As for salvation in general, what is required is repentence for sin, faith and baptism, and perseverance in grace and charity.

 

[jpink1019]

We need to to distinguish between what could be and what is. In the abstract, Mary’s intercession is not absolutely necessary–God could do it otherwise. But in reality, her intercession is always involved. This is the teaching of the Church, from the Second Vatican Council’s Dogmatic Constitution on the Church:

vatican.va/archive/hist_councils/ii_vatican_council/documents/vat-ii_const_19641121_lumen-gentium_en.html

As for salvation in general, what is required is repentence for sin, faith and baptism, and perseverance in grace and charity.

Let me then put forth my question this way.

Does the following statement follow Catholic Doctrine?

“Jesus Christ alone is needed for our Salvation because of His sacrifice on the cross.”

 

[Bookcat]

I will repeat myself…

Is Mary’s Intercession or involvement required for those now who are looking for Salvation through the Church?

A clear yes or no?

One cannot avoid it.

It is what she does.

And Jesus is our Salvation – and it was with her cooperation --her yes --that God willed that Jesus became man! So she has been quite involved! By the will of God.

Could God have chosen to do something different? Sure. But this is what God chose.

 

[Actaeon]

1. Is Mary’s Intercession required for Salvation in the Catholic Church.
   (Meaning do we need anything from the Mother of God to recieve Salvation?)

Well now, that’s really two different questions, isn’t it?

Do we need Mary’s intercession to save us? No. We are joined to Christ’s death and ressurection in baptism and imparted with saving Grace at that point.

But do we as humans need SOMETHING from Mary to receive salvation? Yes! Mary played an integral role in God’s plan, insofar as she served several key purposes:

1. Mary’s body is the temple of the New Covenant, and her womb is the Tabernacle of Christ, where He reposed before His incarnation and final Passover Sacrifice.
2. Mary is the “King’s doorway into Israel” prophecied by Isaiah
3. Where Eve’s disobedience made her cursed and led to the downfall of mankind, Mary’s obedience made her blessed and led to the salvation of mankind… she is the new Eve.

Furthermore, we must realize that God doesn’t make arbitrary decisions, ESPECIALLY not around the salvation of mankind. God ordains things to be because it is right and good that they should be that way… so when God ordained Mary to be the mother of Christ, He did so because it was right and good that she should be the mother of Christ.

So is Mary’s intercession necessary to save us? No. Is Mary an integral part in God’s continuing plan for the salvation of man? Yes.

1. According to the teaching of the Church and from catholics yourselves, what is required for Salvation?

Just as the Bible says: We must believe and be baptised.

And as St Paul clarifies: to believe is to love Christ, and to love Christ is to follow His commandments: chiefly to love God and to love our neighbors as God loves us (and in so doing, to live as righteous a life as we can and to repent of our sins when we fail)… in those two commandments (love God and love our neighbors) all the moral law is summarized.

 

[jpink1019]

Note: I hope that my questions on this forum are not repetitive or annoying. It is quite possible for someone to simply direct me straight to documents concerning the teaching of the church, with my questions.

But, I wanted to point out that talking with other christians and discussing is a rather vital part of any christians spiritual search.
Especially if I am not catholic and I would like to know where the catholic community stands on certain issues.

 

[Bookcat]

Let me then put forth my question this way.

Does the following statement follow Catholic Doctrine?

“Jesus Christ alone is needed for our Salvation because of His sacrifice on the cross.”

Jesus is not alone. One can not separate him from the Father and the Holy Spirit.

Sort of like asking – is the Father alone needed for creation.

He simply was not and that is how it is.

 

[Della]

Let me then put forth my question this way.

Does the following statement follow Catholic Doctrine?

“Jesus Christ alone is needed for our Salvation because of His sacrifice on the cross.”

Yes, Jesus Christ is the sole redeemer of mankind and our only means of salvation.

Do others, including Mary, cooperate in the work of salvation that Christ wrought? Yes, they do.

 

[Bookcat]

The conception of Jesus and his birth – is very much tied up with the death and resurrection of Christ. And Mary is of course also involved there --she did not leave him alone but was united with him in her heart and love.

 

[Actaeon]

Does the following statement follow Catholic Doctrine?

“Jesus Christ alone is needed for our Salvation because of His sacrifice on the cross.”

While a simplistic way of viewing God’s plan of salvation, I would say that the statement is correct according to Catholic teaching.

However, it ignores the continuity of God acting throughout history in the persons of Abraham, Elijah, Moses, David, John the Baptist, etc.

These people are not the cause of our salvation, nor are they the source of our grace… they are not the Way, the Truth, and the Light… but they ALL held roles in preparing the world for the reception of Christ.

Note: I hope that my questions on this forum are not repetitive or annoying. It is quite possible for someone to simply direct me straight to documents concerning the teaching of the church, with my questions.

But, I wanted to point out that talking with other christians and discussing is a rather vital part of any christians spiritual search.
Especially if I am not catholic and I would like to know where the catholic community stands on certain issues.

nonsense and fiddlesticks! You’re behaving respectfully, it is our pleasure to discuss things with you in a spirit of mutual Christian charity!

 

[jpink1019]

Well now, that’s really two different questions, isn’t it?

Do we need Mary’s intercession to save us? No. We are joined to Christ’s death and ressurection in baptism and imparted with saving Grace at that point.

But do we as humans need SOMETHING from Mary to receive salvation? Yes! Mary played an integral role in God’s plan, insofar as she served several key purposes:

1. Mary’s body is the temple of the New Covenant, and her womb is the Tabernacle of Christ, where He reposed before His incarnation and final Passover Sacrifice.
2. Mary is the “King’s doorway into Israel” prophecied by Isaiah
3. Where Eve’s disobedience made her cursed and led to the downfall of mankind, Mary’s obedience made her blessed and led to the salvation of mankind… she is the new Eve.

Furthermore, we must realize that God doesn’t make arbitrary decisions, ESPECIALLY not around the salvation of mankind. God ordains things to be because it is right and good that they should be that way… so when God ordained Mary to be the mother of Christ, He did so because it was right and good that she should be the mother of Christ.

So is Mary’s intercession necessary to save us? No. Is Mary an integral part in God’s continuing plan for the salvation of man? Yes.

Just as the Bible says: We must believe and be baptised.

And as St Paul clarifies: to believe is to love Christ, and to love Christ is to follow His commandments: chiefly to love God and to love our neighbors as God loves us (and in so doing, to live as righteous a life as we can and to repent of our sins when we fail)… in those two commandments (love God and love our neighbors) all the moral law is summarized.

I see that you have mentioned her purpose.
A vessel of salvation, because she carried Jesus Christ.
But does the Catholic Church teach that we NEED Mary to have Salvation, to have Access to the Father?

 

[R_C]

In God’s plan, salvation came to men through Our Lady, since it is from her that the living God took flesh and the Savior was born. So yes, her intercession is required for salvation.

However, how does that translate to our side (the parenthesis question) is a different story.

Probably the greatest Mariologist the Church ever had was St. Luis Grignon de Montfort, whose Treatise on the True Devotion is a must-read. He identifies three kinds of devotion to Mary, the basic (bare minimum) one being honoring her as the Mother of Christ and as true Mother of God.

Anything below that offends God Himself, who commanded: honor your Father and your Mother. And there can be no doubt that Mary is our mother by adoption, for we are all members of the body of Christ, and Christ is the son of Mary.

Holy Church has always taught that the minimum requirement for justification is to be baptized in the name of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. In this, sanctifying grace merited by Christ is restored in our soul.

As for salvation, we need to do quite a lot. Remember St. Paul? Run the race as to win. While this can be done through grace by imitating the Lord, ultimately it translates to (a) a constant battle against our own flesh, (b) a war against the rulers of the world of darkness, and (c) a life of self-sacrifice in imitation of the Lord, who told us to “give up self, take up the cross, and follow Him”. So it’s not clean-cut, but that should not scare us, because:

• God asks specific things from each of us individually, and nothing He asks is impossible to do
• no temptation is impossible to overcome, for where sin abounds grace shall abound all the more
• weakness does not make it harder for us, for in fact in our weakness the strength of Christ is perfected

There are many ways in which the Church throughout the centuries has been describing the path that can lead to the successful imitation of Christ. Each spirituality has its own treasure and is appealing to different people, and each person is endowed with different gifts from the Spirit and has a different calling or vocation. But if you want a clean-cut path to salvation, this is it: love God with your whole heart and every man as yourself. Do this - says the Lord - and you shall live.

 

[Della]

I see that you have mentioned her purpose.
A vessel of salvation, because she carried Jesus Christ.

She did more than “carry” Jesus Christ, she was his mother–she conceived him in her womb, not carried him like lunch in a paper bag.

But does the Catholic Church teach that we NEED Mary to have Salvation, to have Access to the Father?

Not in the narrow sense you mean. Christ is the one mediator of justice between God and man. Only he, because he was fully divine and fully human could make reparation for our sins.

This does not mean that others can’t intercede by their prayers for us, whether they are part of the Church Militant (here on earth) or part of the Church Triumphant (those in heaven), for Jesus plainly told us that the dead are not dead, but living.

 

[jpink1019]

Yes, Jesus Christ is the sole redeemer of mankind and our only means of salvation.

Do others, including Mary, cooperate in the work of salvation that Christ wrought? Yes, they do.

I have seen this very often.
Mary and the saints, cooperating in the work of salvation.

But is she a Prerequisite for someone to be able to recieve Jesus Christ and Receive Salvation?

 

[jkiernan56]

1. Is Mary’s Intercession required for Salvation in the Catholic Church.
   (Meaning do we need anything from the Mother of God to recieve Salvation?)
2. According to the teaching of the Church and from catholics yourselves, what is required for Salvation?

I have tried asking this question before, but it was not made clear.

LOVE, LOVE, LOVE, LOVE, LOVE, LOVE, LOVE, LOVE - did I say LOVE?

 

[Bookcat]

*God involved Mary in such *-- the very body of Jesus --his growing up --the very existence of the blood of Christ shed on the cross – involved Mary.

Now if one means – if someone never heard of Mary – could they enter into salvation?? yes.

 

[Actaeon]

I see that you have mentioned her purpose.
A vessel of salvation, because she carried Jesus Christ.
But does the Catholic Church teach that we NEED Mary to have Salvation, to have Access to the Father?

Again, that’s a question that can be taken two different ways.

In the sense that Christ is the Way, the Truth, and the Light and is the sole mediator of salvific grace… no, Mary is not “necessary” to salvation. And Mary certainly doesn’t sit in heaven scooping up every prayer and passing them on to the Father as though she is some sort of cosmological secretary!

But in the sense that she’s an integral part of the way that God chose to enact His plan of salvation, and that God ordained that His plan be put into effect in the way it was, she is necessary insofar as Christ’s incarnation is concerned. God COULD have chosen any other woman, or He could have chosen to be born from a white elephant (buddhist reference there)… but He didn’t. That is why Mary is honored, and why she has esteemed place in the church: not because Christ isn’t the sole mediator of saving grace, and not because she’s an intermediary, but because her cooperation in God’s plan made her an integral part of that plan such that “[Her] soul magnifies the Lord, and all generations will call [her] blessed”