Need advice: non-clerical celibacy

[pensmama87]

Good grief! He’s a man! The US would deem him old enough to drink alcohol, drive, vote, and go to war to die for his country in a useless conflict with no resolution.

He SAID he didn’t want any advice on his decision, that it was between him and his spiritual advisor. Don’t you think it’s kind of rude to be discussing his “immaturity” when none of you know him except on a message board? At least respect him enough to respect his decisions and desires. It’s like you’re talking behind his back. There are men in my family who have never married for much the same reasons as the OP stated: they just didn’t want to. Married people always think every unmarried person wants to be married. We don’t. I would absolutely hate it.

Firstly, he’s as much a part of the conversation as he wants to be, because that’s how Internet forums work.

Secondly, if someone came up to you and said, “I am going to only eat pizza for the rest of my life because I don’t think I could ever, ever find a hot dog out there to suit me,” wouldn’t it occur to you - just a little bit - to say, “Um, pizza is great and all, but maybe you don’t know enough about hot dogs.”

Or pick a non-food topic with a little more seriousness behind it. I’m just in my third trimester and hungry.

 

[Xantippe]

Firstly, he’s as much a part of the conversation as he wants to be, because that’s how Internet forums work.

Secondly, if someone came up to you and said, “I am going to only eat pizza for the rest of my life because I don’t think I could ever, ever find a hot dog out there to suit me,” wouldn’t it occur to you - just a little bit - to say, “Um, pizza is great and all, but maybe you don’t know enough about hot dogs.”

Or pick a non-food topic with a little more seriousness behind it. I’m just in my third trimester and hungry.

Funny!

How about, “I am only going to read novels for the rest of my life because I don’t think I could ever, ever find a non-fiction book that could hold my interest for 300 pages.”

I think it would be fair (and not unkind) to say, in that case, “Maybe you haven’t found the right non-fiction book for you, but it may nonetheless be out there. Also, with time, your attention span and your range of interests may grow.”

(Not a big hotdog fan. Corndogs, though!)

 

[Lily_Bernans]

Secondly, if someone came up to you and said, “I am going to only eat pizza for the rest of my life because I don’t think I could ever, ever find a hot dog out there to suit me,” wouldn’t it occur to you - just a little bit - to say, “Um, pizza is great and all, but maybe you don’t know enough about hot dogs.”

Actually, no, it wouldn’t. What they eat is their business, not mine. And I would never bring up alternate food ideas if someone told me he or she was going to eat only pizza, and it was not a subject for discussion. I would be respectful of their wishes to not discuss it.

 

[Klemens_Hadwig]

After the recent little spate, I should perhaps remind some of the posters the purpose of this thread.

Here is my question: **How does one live a lay, celibate life with no prospect of marriage? **

Nothing more, nothing less.

Ms Bernans has offered such advice, which I very much appreciate, as have others. However, it seems that some posters have deviated this thread based upon some admittedly, unnecessary background information.

It is true that I chose to provide this background information. However, I foolishly thought it would assist those who sincerely wanted to provide answers to my question.

The question of whether I should pursue marriage should never have been part of this thread!

 

[Xantippe]

You’re an early 20-ish single guy with no prospects on the horizon.

Being chaste right now is going to look very similar whether or not you plan to marry. In either case, the formula is going to be roughly the same.

After the recent little spate, I should perhaps remind some of the posters the purpose of this thread.

Here is my question: **How does one live a lay, celibate life with no prospect of marriage? **

Nothing more, nothing less.

Ms Bernans has offered such advice, which I very much appreciate, as have others. However, it seems that some posters have deviated this thread based upon some admittedly, unnecessary background information.

It is true that I chose to provide this background information. However, I foolishly thought it would assist those who sincerely wanted to provide answers to my question.

The question of whether I should pursue marriage should never have been part of this thread!

 

[Virga]

"Xantippe:

You’re an early 20-ish single guy with no prospects on the horizon.

Being chaste right now is going to look very similar whether or not you plan to marry. In either case, the formula is going to be roughly the same.

Yeah.

That said, to live chastely as a single person requires grace which comes through prayer and the sacraments. I wouldn’t view it so much as “quelling” those natural impulses as I would view it as redirecting them.

Yup. Aside from maintaining a good prayer life and receiving the sacraments, I think it’s important to focus your energy in other ways. Our vocations are always meant to be a way in which we live out our Christian faith. In marriage, people serve God primarily through loving and serving a spouse and children. Religious communities will have their own charism. Some focus on teaching, others through prayer and contemplation.

As lay celibates, aside from working to support oneself, it’s good to live in a way to serve others if possible. Serving others either through volunteering or getting involved in your parish for example is a way to redirect your desires.

Most likely the attraction and desire for marriage will come up from time to time. Even priests and religious find themselves having this desire within them. It’s normal. If you truly choose to remain celibate, then accept the idea that you might always have these feelings to some degree. At that point, remind yourself that you’ve made the choice to serve God and live your life in a different way. It’s a constant choice that you’ll make.

 

[BlueEyedLady]

Actually, no, it wouldn’t. What they eat is their business, not mine. And I would never bring up alternate food ideas if someone told me he or she was going to eat only pizza, and it was not a subject for discussion. I would be respectful of their wishes to not discuss it.

If he came to a fitness forum and said that he would only eat pizza for the rest of his life and then asked how he could train for a marathon, you’d probably suggest he give up on the pizza idea. If he refused, you would probably let him know that at this early stage, it’s fine, but eventually, something would have to give.

He came to a family life section of a Catholic forum with a secular view of family and very bad theology about marriage/vocations (the notion that you get to choose your vocation). Then he wanted to know how he could be a good Catholic. Well, the first step would be giving up there bad theology in favor of prayerful discernment.

This isn’t disrespectful or pushing him into marriage, it’s simply a fact of the faith he professes.

 

[pianistclare]

If he came to a fitness forum and said that he would only eat pizza for the rest of his life and then asked how he could train for a marathon, you’d probably suggest he give up on the pizza idea. If he refused, you would probably let him know that at this early stage, it’s fine, but eventually, something would have to give.

He came to a family life section of a Catholic forum with a secular view of family and very bad theology about marriage/vocations (the notion that you get to choose your vocation). Then he wanted to know how he could be a good Catholic. Well, the first step would be giving up there bad theology in favor of prayerful discernment.

This isn’t disrespectful or pushing him into marriage, it’s simply a fact of the faith he professes.

Well stated. I agree.

 

[Lily_Bernans]

If he came to a fitness forum and said that he would only eat pizza for the rest of his life and then asked how he could train for a marathon, you’d probably suggest he give up on the pizza idea. If he refused, you would probably let him know that at this early stage, it’s fine, but eventually, something would have to give.

He came to a family life section of a Catholic forum with a secular view of family and very bad theology about marriage/vocations (the notion that you get to choose your vocation). Then he wanted to know how he could be a good Catholic. Well, the first step would be giving up there bad theology in favor of prayerful discernment.

This isn’t disrespectful or pushing him into marriage, it’s simply a fact of the faith he professes.

What you wrote makes no sense to me. I don’t see how he came with a “secular” view of the family or with “bad” theology. He simply said he doesn’t want to marry and asked for suggestions on how to live as part of the celibate laity. No bad theology there. Christ and St. Paul advised those who could to refrain from marriage since the unmarried life was a higher calling. Therefore, he simply wanted suggestions on how to live as a good celibate member of the laity. That’s GOOD theology, not bad.

No, I would not advise anyone on their diet. I would refer them to a dietician or a nutritionist. The OP* said any discussion about his vocation would be done with his spiritual advisor*, as it should be. He is not neglecting discernment, which he made clear. He simply doesn’t want our advice on it, which is as it should be. We are not his spiritual director. We don’t even know him off the message board. His theology, and his approach, are sound and should be commended.

 

[Lily_Bernans]

Yeah.

Yup. Aside from maintaining a good prayer life and receiving the sacraments, I think it’s important to focus your energy in other ways. Our vocations are always meant to be a way in which we live out our Christian faith. In marriage, people serve God primarily through loving and serving a spouse and children. Religious communities will have their own charism. Some focus on teaching, others through prayer and contemplation.

As lay celibates, aside from working to support oneself, it’s good to live in a way to serve others if possible. Serving others either through volunteering or getting involved in your parish for example is a way to redirect your desires.

Most likely the attraction and desire for marriage will come up from time to time. Even priests and religious find themselves having this desire within them. It’s normal. If you truly choose to remain celibate, then accept the idea that you might always have these feelings to some degree. At that point, remind yourself that you’ve made the choice to serve God and live your life in a different way. It’s a constant choice that you’ll make.

Wonderful advice, Virga! I have volunteered at a Catholic hospice for some years, and it has added to my life immensely. I find that as my personal relationship with Christ deepens, my desire for any commitment to a spouse greatly lessens, but yes, feelings of attraction do come up from time to time. They don’t mean that one should give up the commitment to the celibate life, though, as you indicated, only that one must deal with the feelings.