Need advice on liturgical oddities

[OraLabora]

This truly confuses me and perhaps others. If we are absolved from our sins at the penitential rite, then why not just cancel confession and save the trouble?

We are absolved of venial sins at the penitential rite. Mortal sin requires sacramental confession.

 

[ProVobis]

Actually the only place that should have absolution anyway is the sacrament of penance and not the penitential rite at all.

Confession is for specific and individual sins. The penitential rite is for our sins in general. We have to pass Immediate Judgement first.

 

[CutlerB]

Was it a Mass combined with Morning Prayer or Evening Prayer or Mass with Children? In those it can be omitted.

If not, was form C used (which allows improvisation) which replaces the normal Kyrie?

Form C is a set of three invocations such as:Lord Jesus, you were sent to heal the contrite: Lord, have mercy.
Lord, have mercy.

Lord Jesus, you are Son of God and Son of Mary: Christ, have mercy.
Christ, have mercy.

Lord Jesus, you are the Way that leads to the Father: Lord, have mercy.
**Lord, have mercy.

**There are many versions provided in the Sacramentary.

Neither. It was the main Sunday Mass. We had some Kyrie litany (a very short one), but the improv was not part of that.

 

[glendab]

I’ll repeat what I said earlier, if it causes you to sin, go elsewhere when you know he is going to serve. But beating your head against a wall isn’t going to change the situation one bit. :banghead: It will only give you a headache and increase your sins. We believe you that he may have made some mistakes and be sloppy in his service because of his old age. But all of that is his; don’t make it yours as well. If you are sure his mistakes are that serious and offensive to you, you don’t have to be there. If you feel the Chancery can help and will help, then speak to them. But taking score each time he visits and does something you think may be wrong is not going to rectify anything at all about the situation and as I said before, can and will increase YOUR sins. Anger is a deadly sin and it can become mortal if nurtured by self-righteous indignation and justification. Don’t let that spark turn into a bon fire in your heart. It will not do you any good and can cause grave harm to you. No one is immune. Get yourself out of the trap before you fall in further.

Okay, now I’ve said too much. Forgive me if I offend. I didn’t mean to so I apologize. I felt a need to make a strong point. And I hope it helps.

Glenda

 

[CutlerB]

Update on the vestment

I wrote a message to the pastor, enquiring if he knew what this was about and he replied that the visiting priest wore a special kind of alb (“Mantelalbe” in German, I couldn’t find an equivalent) which is apparently approved, especially for travelling priests (although that one lived close by). I have attached an image of the type of vestment.

Father said that while he prefers the chasuble too, he knows that the visiting priest (and “his generation”) prefer the alb-thing. I had to grin at that comment of Father’s.

Since I had never heard of such a vestment before (and quite frankly… the differences are minor), I mistook the “Mantelalbe” for a simple alb. My fault.

Here’s the picture.

 

[Beryllos]

… Okay, now I’ve said too much. Forgive me if I offend…

Don’t worry about it. I think you brought up a good point, that we are accountable for our response to the apparent faults and failings of others. There is the outward response. One could be justified to either grin and bear it, as you earlier wrote, or discuss it charitably with the priest, as twf wrote. There is also our inner response, of which you wrote most recently.

 

[GereOMH]

Done, thank you. I feel a genuine burden for people whose Mass experience seems so caught up with mentally noting what they think are irregularities, to the possible detriment of what should be their total experience of worship.

I agree, I think it is a terrible burden on the faithful that in addition to the fact that there are an almost bizarre number of licit options in the Missal, they cannot always depend on their celebrant to have chosen one of those, so many (especially older) priests were trained up in a time of not always thoughtful experimentation.

The people have a right to the Liturgy and Sacraments as laid out in the ritual books – look at the damage caused by the Australian priests who monkeyed around with the formula for Christian baptism!

But frankly, if the priest’s possible errors don’t affect validity, (form, matter and intention in the confecting of the Blessed Sacrament,) I would either mention it casually to him if the opportunity arose, or not at all.

(Save the Liturgy, Save the World)

 

[Vico]

This truly confuses me and perhaps others. If we are absolved from our sins at the penitential rite, then why not just cancel confession and save the trouble?

Does this explanation by St. Thomas Aquinas help, on the forgiveness of venial sin?I answer that, Forgiveness of sin, as stated above (Question 86, Article 2), is effected by man being united to God from Whom sin separates him in some way. Now this separation is made complete by mortal sin, and incomplete by venial sin: because, by mortal sin, the mind through acting against charity is altogether turned away from God; whereas by venial sin man’s affections are clogged, so that they are slow in tending towards God. Consequently both kinds of sin are taken away by penance, because by both of them man’s will is disordered through turning inordinately to a created good; for just as mortal sin cannot be forgiven so long as the will is attached to sin, so neither can venial sin, because while the cause remains, the effect remains.

newadvent.org/summa/4087.htm