Need Documents explaining Church's position on AIDS and Condoms

[JRKH]

I have been involved in a conversation on another board where the subject of AIDS and condoms came up. It came up in this statement:

No, I think the problem is the view that starving children are “…unimportant aspects of human life…” **and that the Catholic church supports the spread of AIDS (especially in Africa) by having decided that use of contraceptives is sinful. **

So you see that religion in general and the Catholic Church in particular was singled out.

Anyway I have done my best to explain the Church’s teachings on the matter but to no avail, at least with the antangonists in the discussion. (I did receive a nice PM from someone who was lurking but not posting)
I’ve reached the end of my abilites (and patience I think) but before I drop the subject, I would like to provide them with some links to any official church documents that might explain it better. I really don’t have the time these days to do the searching myself.

I’m sure it won’t convince them but still it might be beneficial to others.

Any help would be appreciated.

Peace
James

 

[fermat]

I would start by quoting the sections of the Catechism that deal with contraception. A google search on Catechism and contraception will get you started.

After you read through the sections, try and present them in a way were the meaning of the teachings is relevant to your discussions.

I did a blog post on this a while ago that you may or may not find helpful…

 

[Saint_Sebastian]

I have been involved in a conversation on another board where the subject of AIDS and condoms came up. It came up in this statement:

No, I think the problem is the view that starving children are “…unimportant aspects of human life…” **and that the Catholic church supports the spread of AIDS (especially in Africa) by having decided that use of contraceptives is sinful. **

So you see that religion in general and the Catholic Church in particular was singled out.

Anyway I have done my best to explain the Church’s teachings on the matter but to no avail, at least with the antangonists in the discussion. (I did receive a nice PM from someone who was lurking but not posting)
I’ve reached the end of my abilites (and patience I think) but before I drop the subject, I would like to provide them with some links to any official church documents that might explain it better. I really don’t have the time these days to do the searching myself.

I’m sure it won’t convince them but still it might be beneficial to others.

Any help would be appreciated.

Peace
James

vatican.va/roman_curia/congregations/cfaith/documents/rc_con_cfaith_doc_20081208_dignitas-personae_en.htmlJames, This one may help :

 

[ComputerGeek25]

I have been involved in a conversation on another board where the subject of AIDS and condoms came up. It came up in this statement:

No, I think the problem is the view that starving children are “…unimportant aspects of human life…” **and that the Catholic church supports the spread of AIDS (especially in Africa) by having decided that use of contraceptives is sinful. **

So you see that religion in general and the Catholic Church in particular was singled out.

Anyway I have done my best to explain the Church’s teachings on the matter but to no avail, at least with the antangonists in the discussion. (I did receive a nice PM from someone who was lurking but not posting)
I’ve reached the end of my abilites (and patience I think) but before I drop the subject, I would like to provide them with some links to any official church documents that might explain it better. I really don’t have the time these days to do the searching myself.

I’m sure it won’t convince them but still it might be beneficial to others.

Any help would be appreciated.

Peace
James

To me anyways, arguing this goes back to the 10 commandments.

“Thou shalt not commit adultery” is a good start on the topic. If people restrained a little self control, a whole slew of issues would be reduced - STD’s, unwanted pregnancies, abortions, divorce, etc. If people show a tiny amount of self control, the need for contraception would be lessened. The spread of STD’s would also be lessened. The church has always taught (going back to our Jewish roots) that pre-marital and adulterous sex has always been sinful, and for good reason.

 

[Mark77]

Read this article by Dr. Edward C. Green, an athiest & Director, HARVARD AIDS Prevention Research Project; washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/03/27/AR2009032702825.html

**HE AGREES WITH CHURCH TEACHING & WITH THE POPE! **

**Scientific & Governmental studies confirm the fact that Condoms do not reduce AIDS, but actually increase the spread of AIDS, just as the Church & the Pope have taught us!
**
Dr. Green hypothesizes that this is because of the misperception that condoms are 100% safe & therefore infected people can have sex with a condom & not endanger their partner.

Every country in Africa has shown an increase in AIDS INFECTIONS while endorsing condoms except one, Uganda. Uganda has not endorsed condom use & stresses monogamy & one partner! Those are modern dilutions of the best solution, MARRIAGE!

Sancta Maria, Mater Dei, Ora Pro Nobis Peccatoribus!

mark

 

[PJM]

=JRKH;6147489]I have been involved in a conversation on another board where the subject of AIDS and condoms came up. It came up in this statement:

No, I think the problem is the view that starving children are “…unimportant aspects of human life…” **and that the Catholic church supports the spread of AIDS (especially in Africa) by having decided that use of contraceptives is sinful. **

So you see that religion in general and the Catholic Church in particular was singled out.

Anyway I have done my best to explain the Church’s teachings on the matter but to no avail, at least with the antangonists in the discussion. (I did receive a nice PM from someone who was lurking but not posting)
I’ve reached the end of my abilites (and patience I think) but before I drop the subject, I would like to provide them with some links to any official church documents that might explain it better. I really don’t have the time these days to do the searching myself.

I’m sure it won’t convince them but still it might be beneficial to others.

Any help would be appreciated.

Peace
James

I seem to recall such a document ahhile back?
Try the Bishops web site. www.uscc.org/nsb/

 

[JRKH]

To me anyways, arguing this goes back to the 10 commandments.

“Thou shalt not commit adultery” is a good start on the topic. If people restrained a little self control, a whole slew of issues would be reduced - STD’s, unwanted pregnancies, abortions, divorce, etc. If people show a tiny amount of self control, the need for contraception would be lessened. The spread of STD’s would also be lessened. The church has always taught (going back to our Jewish roots) that pre-marital and adulterous sex has always been sinful, and for good reason.

Actually this is the tack I am taking. Not directly from a religious persepctive, since I am discussing with Atheists, but rather from a logical standpoint.

Their argument is that the Church’s rejection of condoms for AIDS prevention is supporting the spread of AIDS.

My position is that anyone who follows church teaching (whether catholic or not) of sex only in marriage, are virtually immune to the AIDS virus.
Anyone who chooses not to follow the Church’s teaching on sex and marriage is not likely to follow church teaching on using condoms.

I expect to get another respopnse tonight or tomorrow and if I do I will ask them to demonstrate, in some realistic way, how the church’s teaching will have any significant effect on those who choose to have sex with multiple partners.

Peace
James

 

[peary1]

HUMANE VITAE

vatican.va/holy_father/paul_vi/encyclicals/documents/hf_p-vi_enc_25071968_humanae-vitae_en.html

 

[JRKH]

Thanks to everyone who has contributed.
I’ll look through things as I get the opportunity.

I think the other conversation is petering out some.
The person who brougth up the issue has not posted in awhile and I suspect that if he comes back he will likely simply try to change the subject since he appears not to have an answer to my arguments.

I have also recieved PM’s from a couple of people who are erading along and appreciating the defence I am using. They also seem to recognize the “insincerity” and “provocotive” nature of some of the arguments used against the Church.

Again I must thank The Holy Spirit for leading me here to CAF where I have learned so much.

Peace
James

 

[ComputerGeek25]

Thanks to everyone who has contributed.
I’ll look through things as I get the opportunity.

I think the other conversation is petering out some.
The person who brougth up the issue has not posted in awhile and I suspect that if he comes back he will likely simply try to change the subject since he appears not to have an answer to my arguments.

I have also recieved PM’s from a couple of people who are erading along and appreciating the defence I am using. They also seem to recognize the “insincerity” and “provocotive” nature of some of the arguments used against the Church.

Again I must thank The Holy Spirit for leading me here to CAF where I have learned so much.

Peace
James

There are a few good posts here - refer to some of the news articles and scripture. Theology of the body and Humae Vitae provide good ground work and explaination of Church teaching.

The issue tends to be that people (who generally have a bone to pick with the church) usually take this line (“Catholic Church is against condoms to fight HIV/AIDS”) out of it’s context. They do not bother to read the theology/reasoning behind it. There are several well reasoned theological and scientific reasons why the church is against condoms, in general.