Need help: saint/icon question

[philm46atthews]

Greetings:
I’ve joined this forum to hopefully get some assistance with a personal project I’m working on.

A very good friend of mine was raised Roman Catholic, but his parents converted to “evangelical” when he was like 10 or so. When he grew up he went to seminary & became a protestant pastor. He had always been more interested in the academic side of things & ended up getting a theological PhD from a Catholic institution. He is now very much considering going back to the Roman Catholic church. He will obviously have many gifts to offer Christ’s church, but it will be as a highly educated lay person.

I want to get him an icon that will help him in his quest for this new identity… but I don’t know enough about the saints of the Church to do so on my own. I’ve been wracking my brain… who was the most educated lay theologian of the Church? Is that even the route I want to go? I’ve thought of Thomas More, and Justin Martyr… I’ve thought of men like St. Ephriem and St. Alcuin who were Deacons.

Well, in the end, I’d appreciate any words of wisdom on this.

Thanks!

PM

 

[ZDHayden]

Well, the patron saint of theologians (lay or clerical) is St. Augustine, Bishop of Hippo.

St. Gregory Palamas is quite controversial: the Latins tend to disagree with him, but the Easterners revere him.

Sir/St. Thomas More is an interesting fellow, certainly,

For the first two, there are sure to be Icons (be warned that St. Augustine will frequently be called Blessed Augustine - if I am not mistaken, it means the same thing for the Eastern Catholic and Eastern Orthodox. It does send the wrong message to Westerners though.) I know there are some medals of St. Augustine floating around (I got one for $30) and I’ve seen some prayer cards with St Thomas More. I have not come across an icon of him nor a medal.

I hope this helps!

EDIT: The 4th century Archbishop of Constantinople, Gregory the Theologian is also a good choice. I believe he is revered in both East and West, and has icons, prayer cards, and medals available.

 

[I_Thirst]

I’d recommend St Josaphat. Not so much for the lay theologian aspect, but for the cause of his martyrdom. Your friend is returning to the Catholic Church and his family remains evangelical – this reminds me somewhat St Josaphat’s situation.

 

[I_Thirst]

For the first two, there are sure to be Icons (be warned that St. Augustine will frequently be called Blessed Augustine - if I am not mistaken, it means the same thing for the Eastern Catholic

If a saint is recognized by Rome, Eastern Catholics recognize the saint. The Eastern Catholic Church is in communion with Rome. East and West make up the two lungs of the Catholic Church, as JPII stated.

In the ECC, St Augustine is St Augustine, not Blessed Augustine.

Not sure about the Orthodox.

 

[ZDHayden]

If a saint is recognized by Rome, Eastern Catholics recognize the saint. The Eastern Catholic Church is in communion with Rome. East and West make up the two lungs of the Catholic Church, as JPII stated.

In the ECC, St Augustine is St Augustine, not Blessed Augustine.

Yes, but the title Blessed and Saint are often interchangeable among the Orthodox (those Easterners not in communion with Rome). I wished to state that in case our inquirer came across an icon of St. Augustine made by an Orthodox Christian.

 

[Jim_Dandy]

My choice would be the greatest theologian, Saint Thomas Aquinas.

 

[philm46atthews]

My choice would be the greatest theologian, Saint Thomas Aquinas.

No disagreement from me re Aquinas or Augustine & their ‘bona fides’…
However, these men were ordained and offered their gifts to the Church as priests (on up). My friend is looking at walking away from … um… for lack of a better way of putting it, the protestant version of sacramental ministry. What he’ll be left with is his intellectual talents and his baptism. This is why I was looking for a saintly figure of the past who perhaps in some small way might be in the same category.

pm

 

[Jesus_123]

+St. Thomas Aquinas of the Dominican Order of Preachers springs instantly to mind . . . this dear thoughtful Saint of the Church is one of the 33 official Doctors of our wonderful Apostolic Holy Roman Catholic Church and is considered the Catholic Church’s greatest theologian and philosopher . . .

. . . :coffeeread: . . .

St. Thomas Aquinas, O.P.

St. Thomas Aquinas, priest and doctor of the Church, patron of all universities and of students. His feast day is January 28th. He was born toward the end of the year 1226. He was the son of Landulph, Count of Aquino, who, when St. Thomas was five years old, placed him under the care of the Benedictines of Monte Casino. His teachers were surprised at the progress he made, for he surpassed all his fellow pupils in learning as well as in the practice of virtue.

When he became of age to choose his state of life, St. Thomas renounced the things of this world and resolved to enter the Order of St. Dominic in spite of the opposition of his family. In 1243, at the age of seventeen, he joined the Dominicans of Naples. Some members of his family resorted to all manner of means over a two year period to break his constancy. They even went so far as to send an impure woman to tempt him. But all their efforts were in vain and St. Thomas persevered in his vocation. As a reward for his fidelity, God conferred upon him the gift of perfect chastity, which has merited for him the title of the

"Angelic :angel1: Doctor".

:compcoff: Link: catholic.org/saints/saint.php?saint_id=2530

. . . all for Jesus+
. . . thank You Blessed Jesus our Lord and Saviour+
. . . thank You Gracious Heavenly Father+
. . . thank You Sweet Spirit of our Holy God+
. . . thank you Blessed Virgin Mary+
. . . thank you Holy Mother Church+
. . . Praise God From Whom All Blessings Flow!
:harp:​

 

[anodos]

I’ve seen some prayer cards with St Thomas More. I have not come across an icon of him nor a medal.

I know Amazon.com has medals of him, anywhere from $5 to over $1,000. (There’s a nice looking set of a Thomas More prayer card with medal for about $25.) I agree with another poster, though; for a theologian, St. Thomas Aquinas might be a better bet. To me Thomas More seems to be more closely identified with politics than theology.

 

[puzzleannie]

I want to get him an icon that will help him in his quest for this new identity…

I suggest Christ Pantocrater, the one with Christ holding the book of scripture, which should appeal both to what first drew him to the Evangelical realm, and what is calling him back.

 

[Julia_Mae]

No disagreement from me re Aquinas or Augustine & their ‘bona fides’…
However, these men were ordained and offered their gifts to the Church as priests (on up). My friend is looking at walking away from … um… for lack of a better way of putting it, the protestant version of sacramental ministry. What he’ll be left with is his intellectual talents and his baptism. This is why I was looking for a saintly figure of the past who perhaps in some small way might be in the same category.

pm

I think there are 4 thousand saints so someone might fit your bill exactly, but…

Saint Francis of Assisi, probably most associated with talking to birds on the public mind, was estranged from his family after being called to serve the Catholic Church, was never a priest and made a Deacon by a Pope just so he could preach. While he had no formal theological education, his ministry was certainly spreading the Word of God.

If you are looking only for a more intellectually famous non-priest type saint, I’d check with the Jesuits. Also, have you asked him who his patron Saint is?

 

[VENETI3]

Arguably the most influential theologians of the western church are St. Jerome, St. Augustine, and St. Thomas Aquinis and in the east (though im not greatly familiar with the ECC or Orthodox) I believe St. Basil is greatly reveared… Also look into St. Teresa of Avila and St. John of the Cross both are great doctors of the Church and struggled greatly for their beliefs and reforms.

I hope your friend is able to find his way, and let him know that all Catholics would be happy to welcome him back home, if that is were his heart leads him, Deo Volente.

 

[Jesus_123]

. . . :coffeeread: . . .
Ordering a Life Wisely

A Prayer by St. Thomas Aquinas

O merciful God,
grant that I may
desire ardently,
search prudently,
recognize truly,
and bring to perfect completion
whatever is pleasing to You
for the praise and glory of **Your **name.

Put my life in good order,
O my God.
Grant that I may know
what **You **require me to do.
Bestow upon me
the power to accomplish **Your **will,
as is necessary and fitting
for the salvation of my soul.

Grant to me,
O Lord my God,
that I may not falter in times
of prosperity or adversity,
so that I may not be exalted in the former,
nor dejected in the latter.

May I not rejoice in anything
unless it leads me to You;
may I not be saddened by anything
unless it turns me from You.

May I desire to please no one,
nor fear to displease anyone,
but You.

May all transitory things,
O Lord,
be worthless to me
and may all things eternal
be ever cherished by me.

May any joy without You
be burdensome for me
and may I not desire anything else
besides You.

May all work, O Lord,
delight me when done for Your sake
and may all repose not centered in You
be ever wearisome for me.

Grant unto me,
my God,
that I may direct my heart

to You
and that in my failures
I may ever feel remorse for my sins
and never lose the resolve to change.

O Lord my God, make me
submissive without protest,
poor without discouragement,
chaste without regret,
patient without complaint,
humble without posturing,
cheerful without frivolity,
mature without gloom,
and quick-witted without flippancy.

O Lord my God, let me
fear You without losing hope,
be truthful without guile,
do good works without presumption,
rebuke my neighbor without haughtiness,
and – without hypocrisy -
strengthen him by word and example.

Give to me,
O Lord God,
a watchful heart,

which no capricious thought
can lure away from You.

Give to me
a noble heart

which no unworthy desire can debase.

Give to me
a resolute heart,

which no evil intention can divert.

Give to me
a stalwart heart,

which no tribulation can overcome.

Give to me
a temperate heart,

which no violent passion can enslave.

Give to me,
O Lord my God,
understanding of You,
diligence in seeking You,
wisdom in finding You,
discourse ever pleasing to You,
perseverance in waiting for You,
and confidence in finally embracing You.

Grant that with** Your **hardships
I may be burdened in reparation here,
that Your benefits
I may use in gratitude upon the way,
that in Your joys
I may delight in glorifying You
in the Kingdom of Heaven.

You Who
live and reign,
God,
world without end.

Amen.

. . . all for Jesus+
. . . thank You Dearest Lord+
. . . thank You Gracioius Heavenly Father+
. . . thank You Sweet Spirit of our Holy God+
. . . thank you Blessed Virgin Mary our Mother+
. . . thank you Holy Mother Church+
​

 

[Bix]

A very good friend of mine was raised Roman Catholic, but his parents converted to “evangelical” when he was like 10 or so. When he grew up he went to seminary & became a protestant pastor.

I want to get him an icon that will help him in his quest for this new identity… but I don’t know enough about the saints of the Church to do so on my own. I’ve been wracking my brain… who was the most educated lay theologian of the Church? Is that even the route I want to go? I’ve thought of Thomas More, and Justin Martyr… I’ve thought of men like St. Ephriem and St. Alcuin who were Deacons.
Thanks!

PM

My thoughts are little different, but you said any ideas…

The Blessed Virgin Mary is my suggestion. There are thousands of wonderful saints, but you mentioned 1) he is considering this, 2) his family is Protestant, as well as 3)this being an aid on his quest. Your friend is clearly intelligent and will find many saints to relate to, but considering his 10 years raised as a Roman Catholic, I believe an icon of her would be helpful.

My Mother was raised by a Catholic father and Protestant mother, attending both services. She is an active, practicing Protestant. However, if she has a need for a really large prayer to be answered or is in despair, she has always gone to a Catholic church to pray as she feels closer to God there… I was raised a Protestant; taken to the Catholic church to pray… As an adult, my choice is Roman Catholic. Ten years ago I saw a beautiful galena egg of the Blessed Mother and Jesus(I was teaching in a Protestant church at the time) and … I can’t explain it, but I continuously went to see if the item was still available(it wasn’t something inexpensive you would purchase on a whim) Naturally, it sits in my home today. never underestimate the power of her aid in even the most trivial things.

This may not be suited for your situation, but thought I would share.
God Bless and Good luck!

 

[fred_conty]

I believe St. Dominic was a Deacon and certainly one who was on fire as a preacher.
Your friend might want to desire to be a Deacon in the Latin Church if married. He could preach and baptise.