Need help with Aramaic word for ''in memory of''

[bnapgh]

As I understand the significance of Jesus’ words at the last supper, when He instituted the Holy Eucharist, the English ‘‘do this in memory of Me’’ does not carry the same significance of the original Aramaic or Hebrew words which connote a traditional Hebrew memorial holocaust or sacrifice by a Levite priest. Is this correct and can anyone share with me the actual Hebrew or Aramaic words and their religious significance in the Old Testament?

Thanks in advance!

 

[Dave_Noonan]

As I understand the significance of Jesus’ words at the last supper, when He instituted the Holy Eucharist, the English ‘‘do this in memory of Me’’ does not carry the same significance of the original Aramaic or Hebrew words which connote a traditional Hebrew memorial holocaust or sacrifice by a Levite priest. Is this correct and can anyone share with me the actual Hebrew or Aramaic words and their religious significance in the Old Testament?

Thanks in advance!

I’d be happy to help, but I probably need some more details. Are you talking about the part of the grain offering that is burned on the altar? (E.g. Leviticus 6:15?)

 

[bnapgh]

I’d be happy to help, but I probably need some more details. Are you talking about the part of the grain offering that is burned on the altar? (E.g. Leviticus 6:15?)

Thanks, Dave, but I do not know the OT connotation. I remember that on what I think was a Journey Home program many years ago, a guest (Scott Hahn??) commented that the Hebrew words spoken at the Last Supper referenced a solemn Jewish sacrifice for the dead, or something. That’s all I know. Thanks for offering.

 

[maryj]

Try this thread
forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=88426

 

[maryj]

The fourth cup: Scott Hahn
catholic.com/thisrock/1991/9109fea1.asp

 

[Dave_Noonan]

The fourth cup: Scott Hahn
catholic.com/thisrock/1991/9109fea1.asp

Hahn’s statement “The structure of the Passover seder, known as the Haggadah, appears to have been formalized long before the time of Jesus” is pretty problematic. There’s no evidence for this as the oldest complete Haggadah we have is from the 14th century as I recall. Even the earliest Jewish tradition doesn’t date the Haggadah this early.

Anyway, does this article answer your question? I’m guessing no?

 

[bnapgh]

Both articles were very informative and appreciated. These go a long way, but my memory still tells me there is an Aramaic or Hebrew word that struck me as even more insightful.

You are both kind to help this pilgrim.
Thanks!

God bless!

 

[bnapgh]

Hahn’s statement “The structure of the Passover seder, known as the Haggadah, appears to have been formalized long before the time of Jesus” is pretty problematic. There’s no evidence for this as the oldest complete Haggadah we have is from the 14th century as I recall. Even the earliest Jewish tradition doesn’t date the Haggadah this early.

If I read Hahn properly he mostly agrees with you, in that while there is no specific record from ancient times, he reasons that since there are such strong parallels between John’s gospel and the oldest Haggadah on record, it seems reasonable to Hahn to expect the Haggadah might very well have been the practice even then.
Scot Hahn:

.Readers may complain about my assuming the proto-Talmudic character of the liturgical structure of the seder. Someone could argue that it is anachronistic to retroject the seder liturgy from the Mishnah back to the first century. I respond by pointing out that virtually all scholars recognize substantial similarities in form between the Jewish paschal liturgy recorded in the New Testament and the Mishnah. For instance, Paul’s mention of “the cup of blessing” (1 Cor. 10:16) surely connects with the third cup. I don’t know any commentator who denies a connection here. Moreover, the Mishnah is not known for an innovative approach to liturgical reforms. Thus, so long as I am not building my argument on a comprehensive identity of form between the two, I think I avoid any anachronism and remain on safe ground–indeed, the same safe ground as the vast majority of exegetes (e.g. Joachim Jeremias) and liturgiologists (e.g. Joseph Jungmann).

 

[Dave_Noonan]

If I read Hahn properly he mostly agrees with you, in that while there is no specific record from ancient times, he reasons that since there are such strong parallels between John’s gospel and the oldest Haggadah on record, it seems reasonable to Hahn to expect the Haggadah might very well have been the practice even then.

Actually, a number of scholars have speculated that this works the other way–that Jewish practices drew on Christian ones.

 

[NotWorthy]

As I understand the significance of Jesus’ words at the last supper, when He instituted the Holy Eucharist, the English ‘‘do this in memory of Me’’ does not carry the same significance of the original Aramaic or Hebrew words which connote a traditional Hebrew memorial holocaust or sacrifice by a Levite priest. Is this correct and can anyone share with me the actual Hebrew or Aramaic words and their religious significance in the Old Testament?

Thanks in advance!

I don’t know about the Aramaic, but I do know that the Greek words (which are what the inspired authors wrote in) has a special significance.

Here’s some I was looking at recently in preparing for our Sunday Bulletin.

***Touto poieite eis ton emen anamnesin ***translated "Do this in remembrance of Me"
Poiein (“DO”) has sacrificial overtones. In the Septuagint (LXX), the Greek version of the OT, there are about seventy sacrificial uses of poiein. One example: “Now this is what you shall OFFER [Gr poieseis] upon the ALTAR: two lambs a year old, day by day, continually” (see Exodus 29:38).
ANAMNESIS (“REMEMBRANCE”) also has sacrificial overtones. It occurs only eight times in the NT and the Greek OT. All but once (Wisdom 16:6) it is in a sacrificial context: “There is in these SACRIFICES a REMINDER [Gr anamnesis] of sin year after year” (Heb 10:3).
“And you shall put pure frankincense with each row, that it may go with the bread as a MEMORIAL portion [Gr anamnesis] to be OFFERED by fire to the Lord” (Lev 24:7).

In my opinion, “Do This in Memory of Me” is one of the worst translations in the Church!

 

[maryj]

Both articles were very informative and appreciated. These go a long way, but my memory still tells me there is an Aramaic or Hebrew word that struck me as even more insightful.

You are both kind to help this pilgrim.
Thanks!

God bless!

Zikkaron, is that the word you are thinking of, I found this very interesting

bringyou.to/apologetics/p39.htm

 

[bnapgh]

Those last two ring the bell!

Thanks to everyone, but particular appreciation for the specific answers to my memory from NotWorthy and MaryJ