Need help with the "Gloria Patri"

[basinite]

I’m kind of stuck on how to understand a certain phrase in the “Gloria Patri” and I could use some help.

English version:

Glory be to the Father and to the Son and to the Holy Spirit.

Latin version:

Gloria Patri et Filio et Spiritui Sancto.

Since “Patri” (Father) uses the Genitive singular case it shows possession. Filio (Son) and Spiritui Sancto (Spirit Holy), both use the Dative singular case which indicates indirect objects , e.t., words that would usually be preceded by “to”, or “for” in English.

What I’m hung up on is that in Latin this prayer would mean that; All glory belongs to the Father and He gives it to the Son and to the Holy Spirit.

I thought that the Holy Trinity was made up of Equals, so naturally I’m a little confused by this.

Thanks in advance for your help.

 

[floresco]

I’m kind of stuck on how to understand a certain phrase in the “Gloria Patri” and I could use some help.

English version:

Glory be to the Father and to the Son and to the Holy Spirit.

Latin version:

Gloria Patri et Filio et Spiritui Sancto.

Since “Patri” (Father) uses the Genitive singular case it shows possession. Filio (Son) and Spiritui Sancto (Spirit Holy), both use the Dative singular case which indicates indirect objects , e.t., words that would usually be preceded by “to”, or “for” in English.

pater is a third declension noun, so the form patri is also dative singular. Grammaticaly, this is a parallel structure with all three Persons put in the same case.

 

[tee_eff_em]

Since “Patri” (Father) uses the Genitive singular case it shows possession. Filio (Son) and Spiritui Sancto (Spirit Holy), both use the Dative singular case which indicates indirect objects , e.t., words that would usually be preceded by “to”, or “for” in English.

pater is a third declension noun, so the form patri is also dative singular. Grammaticaly, this is a parallel structure with all three Persons put in the same case.

To be clear: *Patri *is also (like *filio *and spiritui sancto) dative singular.
Not *Patri *is also (in addition to being genitive singular) dative singular. The Genitive singular is patris.

Third Declension Paradigm
case | singular | plural
nominative | pater| patres
genitive | patris| patrum
dative | *patri *| patribus
accusative | patrem | patres
ablative | patre | patribus

tee

 

[basinite]

Thanks Floresco and tee eff em!

I thought “Pater” was a second declension masculine noun and used “er” instead of “us” like “ager” (field) :doh2:. I’m still learning Latin and won’t be starting my third declensions nouns for a few more days.

 

[floresco]

I thought “Pater” was a second declension masculine noun and used “er” instead of “us” like “ager” (field) :doh2:. I’m still learning Latin and won’t be starting my third declensions nouns for a few more days.

Third declension is tricky because the nominative singular ending is unpredictable. This is one reason it is so important to memorize both nominative and genitive forms when you learn a new word. You need to know both to be able to identify the declension.

I think that I was most tempted to quit studying Latin when I got to third declension. If this happens to you, I encourage you to keep working on it. There is a lot of memorizing at first but it gets easier.

(And thanks to tee eff em for clarifying my answer. I knew what I meant. )

 

[Adeodatus]

Thanks Floresco and tee eff em!

I thought “Pater” was a second declension masculine noun and used “er” instead of “us” like “ager” (field) :doh2:. I’m still learning Latin and won’t be starting my third declensions nouns for a few more days.

One way to think of it is to remember the Trinitarian formula:

“in nomine Patris, et Filii, et Spiritus Sancti”

There, Pater is in the genitive form Patris.

 

[MarkThompson]

One way to think of it is to remember the Trinitarian formula:

“in nomine Patris, et Filii, et Spiritus Sancti”

There, Pater is in the genitive form Patris.

And Spiritus is in the genitive form Spiritus (it’s fourth declension).