Need historical documents for Jesus

[_Abyssinia]

Non Christian Jewish evidence that mentions Jesus within 150 years of his death

• Talmud
• Jewish historian Josephus

Extra Biblical Christian evidence that mentions Jesus within 150 years of his death

• Clement of Rome
• 2 Clement from anon author
• Igantius of Antioch
• Letter to Philippians from Polycarp
• Martyrdom of Polycarp
• Didache
• Letter of Barnabas
• Shepherd of Hermas
• Fragments of Papias
• Letter of Diognetus
• Epistula Apostolorum
• Heggisipus
• Justyn Martyr
• Aristides
• Athenagoras
• Theophilus of Antioch
• Quadratus
• Aristo of Pella,
• Melito of Sardis

Secular or pagan sources that mention Jesus within 150 years of his death

• Roman historian Tacitus
• Rome politcian Pliny the Younger
• Historian Phlegon
• Greek satirist Lucian
• Roman philosopher Celsus
• Historian Suetonius
• historian Thallus,
• Prisoner Mara Bar-Serapion whose text is in a British Museum

New Testament books that mention Jesus

• Epistle to the Ephesians
• 1 Thessalonians
• 2 Thessalonians
• Acts of the Apostles
• 1 Corinthians
• 2 Corinthians
• Epistle to the Galations
• 1 Timothy
• 2 Timothy
• Gospel of Mark
• Gospel of Matthew
• Gospel of John
• Gospel of Luke
• Jude
• Epistle of the Colossians
• Epistle to the Romans
• Epistle to Titus
• 1 John
• 2 John
• 3 John
• Epistle to Philemon
• Epistle to the Hebrews
• Epistle of St James
• Book of Revelation
• 1 Peter
• 2 Peter

 

[TimothyH]

FYI I am not trying to be a jerk but I am looking for answers supporting Jesus.

The Bible records many things about Jesus. The authors say that they were “eyewitnesses” to everything he said and did.

-Tim-

 

[Usige]

Sure it doesn’t disprove it but I would probably doubt there was a “World War” if the only source was one guy who claimed to have read letters from his great grandfather.

I was merely leading you to the fact that many parts of accepted history are based on only 1 or 2 sources often written from 3rd hand accounts. Many times they are based on documents that we no longer have access to.

You main objecting appeared to be that the historians that wrote of him were doing so 60 - 95 years after his death. The impression you gave was that history must be recorded by an eye witness or atleast someone who was alive when the event happens. Neither of these are used as a standard for other historical figures, so why apply a different standard for the existence of Jesus?

 

[cornbread_r2]

The Bible records many things about Jesus. The authors say that they were “eyewitnesses” to everything he said and did.

-Tim-

Could you please cite passages where the NT authors explicitly claim to be eyewitnesses? Thanks in advance.

(Even if the author of Matthew’s gospel really was one of the 12 Apostles, he almost certainly wasn’t present for certain events, such as when Jesus was tempted in the desert or during his trial, among others).

 

[_Abyssinia]

Sure it doesn’t disprove it but I would probably doubt there was a “World War” if the only source was one guy who claimed to have read letters from his great grandfather.

If the test of historicity depends purely on relatively few sources which might be written decades or centuries after the person or events they write about existed or happened, then why do historians believe Tiberius Caesar, Julius Caesar and Alexander the Great existed?

I have read that there 10 sources mention Tiberius Caesar within 150 years of his death; the Gospel of Luke, Strabo, Pliny the Younger, Seneca, Plutarch, Tacitus, Josephus, Suetonius, Valerius Maximus, Velleius Paterculus.

Appart from epigraphy and coins, sources that mention Alexander the Great, Flavius Arrianus, Plutarch, Diodorus of Sicily, M Junianus Justinus, Quintus Curitus Rufus, Appian. Some of these sources are written hundreds of years after Alexander the Great’s death.

5 sources mention Julius Caesar’s military pursuits by Cicero, Julius Caesar has left writings, Salona Decree, Appian, and Livy.

Note that the Gospel of Luke records the existence of Tiberius Caesar in addition to other historians, this attests to the Gospel of Luke’s reliable historical record

 

[_Abyssinia]

Sure it doesn’t disprove it but I would probably doubt there was a “World War” if the only source was one guy who claimed to have read letters from his great grandfather.

I have read that there 10 sources mention Tiberius Caesar within 150 years of his death; the Gospel of Luke, Strabo, Pliny the Younger, Seneca, Plutarch, Tacitus, Josephus, Suetonius, Valerius Maximus, Velleius Paterculus.

Appart from epigraphy and coins, sources that mention Alexander the Great, Flavius Arrianus, Plutarch, Diodorus of Sicily, M Junianus Justinus, Quintus Curitus Rufus, Appian. Some of these sources are written hundreds of years after Alexander the Great’s death.

5 sources mention Julius Caesar’s military pursuits by Cicero, Julius Caesar has left writings, Salona Decree, Appian, and Livy.

Note that the Gospel of Luke records the existence of Tiberius Caesar in addition to other historians, this attests to the Gospel of Luke’s reliable historical record

 

[_Abyssinia]

Sure it doesn’t disprove it but I would probably doubt there was a “World War” if the only source was one guy who claimed to have read letters from his great grandfather.

I have read that there 10 sources mention Tiberius Caesar within 150 years of his death; the Gospel of Luke, Strabo, Pliny the Younger, Seneca, Plutarch, Tacitus, Josephus, Suetonius, Valerius Maximus, Velleius Paterculus.

Appart from epigraphy and coins, sources that mention Alexander the Great, Flavius Arrianus, Plutarch, Diodorus of Sicily, M Junianus Justinus, Quintus Curitus Rufus, Appian. Some of these sources are written hundreds of years after Alexander the Great’s death.

5 sources mention Julius Caesar’s military pursuits by Cicero, Julius Caesar has left writings, Salona Decree, Appian, and Livy.

Note that the Gospel of Luke records the existence of Tiberius Caesar in addition to other historians, this attests to the Gospel of Luke’s reliable historical record

 

[_Abyssinia]

Sure it doesn’t disprove it but I would probably doubt there was a “World War” if the only source was one guy who claimed to have read letters from his great grandfather.

I have read that there 10 sources mention Tiberius Caesar within 150 years of his death; the Gospel of Luke, Strabo, Pliny the Younger, Seneca, Plutarch, Tacitus, Josephus, Suetonius, Valerius Maximus, Velleius Paterculus.

Appart from epigraphy and coins, sources that mention Alexander the Great, Flavius Arrianus, Plutarch, Diodorus of Sicily, M Junianus Justinus, Quintus Curitus Rufus, Appian. Some of these sources are written hundreds of years after Alexander the Great’s death.

5 sources mention Julius Caesar’s military pursuits by Cicero, Julius Caesar has left writings, Salona Decree, Appian, and Livy.

Note that the Gospel of Luke records the existence of Tiberius Caesar in addition to other historians, this attests to the Gospel of Luke’s reliable historical record:shrug:

 

[_Abyssinia]

Sure it doesn’t disprove it but I would probably doubt there was a “World War” if the only source was one guy who claimed to have read letters from his great grandfather.

I have read that there 10 sources mention Tiberius Caesar within 150 years of his death; the Gospel of Luke, Strabo, Pliny the Younger, Seneca, Plutarch, Tacitus, Josephus, Suetonius, Valerius Maximus, Velleius Paterculus.

Appart from epigraphy and coins, sources that mention Alexander the Great, Flavius Arrianus, Plutarch, Diodorus of Sicily, M Junianus Justinus, Quintus Curitus Rufus, Appian. Some of these sources are written hundreds of years after Alexander the Great’s death.

5 sources mention Julius Caesar’s military pursuits by Cicero, Julius Caesar has left writings, Salona Decree, Appian, and Livy.

Note that the Gospel of Luke records the existence of Tiberius Caesar in addition to other historians, this attests to the Gospel of Luke’s reliable historical record

 

[_Abyssinia]

Sure it doesn’t disprove it but I would probably doubt there was a “World War” if the only source was one guy who claimed to have read letters from his great grandfather.

I have read that there 10 sources mention Tiberius Caesar within 150 years of his death; the Gospel of Luke, Strabo, Pliny the Younger, Seneca, Plutarch, Tacitus, Josephus, Suetonius, Valerius Maximus, Velleius Paterculus.

Appart from epigraphy and coins, sources that mention Alexander the Great, Flavius Arrianus, Plutarch, Diodorus of Sicily, M Junianus Justinus, Quintus Curitus Rufus, Appian. Some of these sources are written hundreds of years after Alexander the Great’s death.

5 sources mention Julius Caesar’s military pursuits by Cicero, Julius Caesar has left writings, Salona Decree, Appian, and Livy.

Note that the Gospel of Luke records the existence of Tiberius Caesar in addition to other historians, this attests to the Gospel of Luke’s reliable historical record

 

[_Abyssinia]

Sure it doesn’t disprove it but I would probably doubt there was a “World War” if the only source was one guy who claimed to have read letters from his great grandfather.

I have read that there 10 sources mention Tiberius Caesar within 150 years of his death; the Gospel of Luke, Strabo, Pliny the Younger, Seneca, Plutarch, Tacitus, Josephus, Suetonius, Valerius Maximus, Velleius Paterculus.

Appart from epigraphy and coins, sources that mention Alexander the Great, Flavius Arrianus, Plutarch, Diodorus of Sicily, M Junianus Justinus, Quintus Curitus Rufus, Appian. Some of these sources are written hundreds of years after Alexander the Great’s death.

5 sources mention Julius Caesar’s military pursuits by Cicero, Julius Caesar has left writings, Salona Decree, Appian, and Livy.

Note that the Gospel of Luke records the existence of Tiberius Caesar in addition to other historians, this attests to the Gospel of Luke’s reliable historical record

 

[_Abyssinia]

Sure it doesn’t disprove it but I would probably doubt there was a “World War” if the only source was one guy who claimed to have read letters from his great grandfather.

I have read that there 10 sources mention Tiberius Caesar within 150 years of his death; the Gospel of Luke, Strabo, Pliny the Younger, Seneca, Plutarch, Tacitus, Josephus, Suetonius, Valerius Maximus, Velleius Paterculus.

Appart from epigraphy and coins, sources that mention Alexander the Great, Flavius Arrianus, Plutarch, Diodorus of Sicily, M Junianus Justinus, Quintus Curitus Rufus, Appian. Some of these sources are written hundreds of years after Alexander the Great’s death.

5 sources mention Julius Caesar’s military pursuits by Cicero, Julius Caesar has left writings, Salona Decree, Appian, and Livy.

Note that the Gospel of Luke records the existence of Tiberius Caesar in addition to other historians, this attests to the Gospel of Luke’s reliable historical record

 

[_Abyssinia]

Could you please cite passages where the NT authors explicitly claim to be eyewitnesses? Thanks in advance.

(Even if the author of Matthew’s gospel really was one of the 12 Apostles, he almost certainly wasn’t present for certain events, such as when Jesus was tempted in the desert or during his trial, among others).

Richard Bauckham wrote a book titled ‘Jesus and the Eyewitnesses: The Gospels as Eyewitness Testimony’ which lays out that the Gospels were based on testimony from eyewitnesses.

Video of Richard Bauckham speaking about his book

youtube.com/watch?v=292NTf1cCNw

 

[judynurse]

Please remember that the original OP was looking for HISTORICAL documents for proof of the existence of Jesus as a historical personage in order to give historical proof to a classmate who is no going to accept (apparently) the Bible as an “historical” document. I think those who cited historians and others, especially Josephus, which I have also recommended (and read) gave him what he needs to show to this classmate. Apparently the “kid” in his classes wants some “real, historical proof” that Jesus actually lived, not quotes from the eyewitnesses from the Bible, since this classmate apparently is ignoring the Bible, and has heard or been told that maybe Jesus didn’t really live in an historical sense. The historical references given should help our OP to provide that proof, THEN show said classmate the citations in the Gospels written (mainly) by Apostles (or passed down verbally, then written) by eyewitnesses in the Bible.

He is trying to give the classmate “historical proof” first, then lead him to the Bible!

Good luck OP! Hope this gets your classmate thinking, and perhaps checking out the Bible for himself. Get him a paperback copy of a modern language Catholic Bible, give it to him, after the historical data, and let him read them for himself. You may even convert this classmate!

 

[Randy_Carson]

Please remember that the original OP was looking for HISTORICAL documents for proof of the existence of Jesus as a historical personage in order to give historical proof to a classmate who is no going to accept (apparently) the Bible as an “historical” document. I think those who cited historians and others, especially Josephus, which I have also recommended (and read) gave him what he needs to show to this classmate. Apparently the “kid” in his classes wants some “real, historical proof” that Jesus actually lived, not quotes from the eyewitnesses from the Bible, since this classmate apparently is ignoring the Bible, and has heard or been told that maybe Jesus didn’t really live in an historical sense. The historical references given should help our OP to provide that proof, THEN show said classmate the citations in the Gospels written (mainly) by Apostles (or passed down verbally, then written) by eyewitnesses in the Bible.

He is trying to give the classmate “historical proof” first, then lead him to the Bible!

Good luck OP! Hope this gets your classmate thinking, and perhaps checking out the Bible for himself. Get him a paperback copy of a modern language Catholic Bible, give it to him, after the historical data, and let him read them for himself. You may even convert this classmate!

I gave Jimmy Akin’s article because it is an innovative way to prove the historicity of Jesus without actually finding him in historical documents. That is an amazing idea from an apologetics point of view.

Kinda like finding the fossilized footprints of a dinosaur in the rock. You don’t get to see him directly, but you know he was there!

 

[steve_b]

Could you please cite passages where the NT authors explicitly claim to be eyewitnesses? Thanks in advance.

1. 
   *]Luke 1:2
   
   *][2 Peter 1:16](http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=2 Peter+1:16&version=RSVCE)
   c:
   

   (Even if the author of Matthew’s gospel really was one of the 12 Apostles, he almost certainly wasn’t present for certain events, such as when Jesus was tempted in the desert or during his trial, among others).

   Jesus would have told His apostles about being tempted in the desert. Just as Mary would have told those around her about the birth of Jesus and His early years.

 

[_Abyssinia]

Please remember that the original OP was looking for HISTORICAL documents for proof of the existence of Jesus as a historical personage in order to give historical proof to a classmate who is no going to accept (apparently) the Bible as an “historical” document. I think those who cited historians and others, especially Josephus, which I have also recommended (and read) gave him what he needs to show to this classmate. Apparently the “kid” in his classes wants some “real, historical proof” that Jesus actually lived, not quotes from the eyewitnesses from the Bible, since this classmate apparently is ignoring the Bible, and has heard or been told that maybe Jesus didn’t really live in an historical sense. The historical references given should help our OP to provide that proof, THEN show said classmate the citations in the Gospels written (mainly) by Apostles (or passed down verbally, then written) by eyewitnesses in the Bible.

He is trying to give the classmate “historical proof” first, then lead him to the Bible!

Good luck OP! Hope this gets your classmate thinking, and perhaps checking out the Bible for himself. Get him a paperback copy of a modern language Catholic Bible, give it to him, after the historical data, and let him read them for himself. You may even convert this classmate!

He should try and convince the classmate not to ignore the synoptic Gospels as a historical source for Jesus, as it consists of the primary sources for Jesus, and non Biblical sources that mention Jesus are secondary sources I think. The’s historicity of the Gospel is well attested by archeology, and secondary sources so the synoptic Gospels should be trusted as historically truthful when it comes to Jesus.

 

[TimothyH]

Could you please cite passages where the NT authors explicitly claim to be eyewitnesses? Thanks in advance.

(Even if the author of Matthew’s gospel really was one of the 12 Apostles, he almost certainly wasn’t present for certain events, such as when Jesus was tempted in the desert or during his trial, among others).

Peter and John were first-hand witnesses.

***So I exhort the elders among you, as a fellow elder and a witness of the sufferings of Christ *as well as a partaker in the glory that is to be revealed. (1 Peter 5:1)

*For we did not follow cleverly devised myths when we made known to you the power and coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, but we were eyewitnesses of his majesty. (2 Peter 1:16)

That which was from the beginning, which we have heard, which we have seen with our eyes, which we have looked upon and touched with our hands, concerning the word of life – the life was made manifest, and we saw it, and testify to it, and proclaim to you the eternal life which was with the Father and was made manifest to us – that which we have seen and heard we proclaim also to you, so that you may have fellowship with us; and our fellowship is with the Father and with his Son Jesus Christ. And we are writing this that our joy may be complete. This is the message we have heard from him and proclaim to you, that God is light and in him is no darkness at all. (1 John 1:1-5)*

Peter says that he and John personally witnessed the cry for Jesus’ death by the crowd.

While he clung to Peter and John, all the people ran together to them in the portico called Solomon’s, astounded. And when Peter saw it he addressed the people, "Men of Israel, why do you wonder at this, or why do you stare at us, as though by our own power or piety we had made him walk? The God of Abraham and of Isaac and of Jacob, the God of our fathers, glorified his servant Jesus, whom you delivered up and denied in the presence of Pilate, when he had decided to release him. But you denied the Holy and Righteous One, and asked for a murderer to be granted to you, and killed the Author of life, whom God raised from the dead. To this we are witnesses. (Acts 3:11:15)

Peter says that he personally witnessed all that Jesus did and that many others were eyewitnesses to the risen Christ and ate with Jesus after the resurrection.

This Jesus God raised up, and of that we all are witnesses. (Acts 2:32)

And we are witnesses to all that he did both in the country of the Jews and in Jerusalem. They put him to death by hanging him on a tree; but God raised him on the third day and made him manifest; not to all the people but to us who were chosen by God as witnesses, who ate and drank with him after he rose from the dead. (Acts 13:39-41)

Peter says that the Apostles were with Jesus the whole time and that Jospeh and Matthias were also eye-witnesses to Jesus’ entire ministry.

So one of the men who have accompanied us during all the time that the Lord Jesus went in and out among us, beginning from the baptism of John until the day when he was taken up from us – one of these men must become with us a witness to his resurrection." And they put forward two, Joseph called Barsab’bas, who was surnamed Justus, and Matthi’as. (Luke 2:21-23)

Luke had the story delivered him by first-hand witnesses who were with Jesus from the beginning.

Inasmuch as many have undertaken to compile a narrative of the things which have been accomplished among us, just as they were delivered to us by those who from the beginning were eyewitnesses and ministers of the word, (Luke 1:1-2)

As an aside, the word martyr means witness.

-Tim-

 

[fisherman_carl]

This is probably one of the best I’ve heard on youtube. It’s an interview with Dr. Craig

youtube.com/watch?v=xUKW2Bm5P2k

Here’s another more recent one that looks good by the same person

youtube.com/watch?v=xUKW2Bm5P2k