Needing some help with communion issue

[keepingfaith4]

i am a catechist for many years but now am in a new parish due to a recent move.AFTER preparing my older students(9 to 14) for first holy communion,the dre has told 2 of them they cannot receive two weeks before the sacraments are to be given because their caretakers missed getting them to the retreat(a half day event).i had to tell the families there is nothing i can do and to go speak to the spanish priest(i am not very fluent in spanish).this priest was not a part of this decision and seems to have little say in parish affairs.

on top of this i received a lecture from the pastor cause i asked for at least one spanish hymn to be played in the communion mass as 90% of the kids are hispanic—the head of the music liturgy was fine with this.

i am ready to leave this parish as a member and a catechist but regretfully cause i so like the hispanic families—any advice appreciated

 

[Pfaffenhoffen]

i am a catechist for many years but now am in a new parish due to a recent move.AFTER preparing my older students(9 to 14) for first holy communion,the dre has told 2 of them they cannot receive two weeks before the sacraments are to be given because their caretakers missed getting them to the retreat(a half day event).i had to tell the families there is nothing i can do and to go speak to the spanish priest(i am not very fluent in spanish).this priest was not a part of this decision and seems to have little say in parish affairs.

on top of this i received a lecture from the pastor cause i asked for at least one spanish hymn to be played in the communion mass as 90% of the kids are hispanic—the head of the music liturgy was fine with this.

i am ready to leave this parish as a member and a catechist but regretfully cause i so like the hispanic families—any advice appreciated

The priests are humans, make dumb decisions like everyone of us.
So of them are used to give orders and to dialogue little.
I think you should not move from the Parish.
Obedience is pretious at the eyes of God and you may teach a great lesson of obediecne to your kids.
But…do insist, insist, insist, insist. Never give up.
It seems your parish needs a brave person like you to change things…

 

[bmullins]

In the end he is responsible for the Parish and has chosen to run it a certain way. I don’t know the details so I’m not going to comment on his decision. I do know that we have to be there for each other. If we are truly there to serve God and our brothers and sisters, then small matters such as these won’t make us leave, but will make us instead work harder to make sure the gospel is being proclaimed. As Jesus said, “Do what they say, not what they do.”

 

[Neofight]

Perhaps, whether the priest is “right or wrong” is not the issue. If you are uncomfortable in your parish, to the point that it impacts on your spirtual well being, by all means look for another parish! Just don’t let your unhappiness or disagreement with a priest to drive a wedge of separation between you and God!

I’ll pray you find peace, whatever route you take!

Pax

 

[keepingfaith4]

Perhaps, whether the priest is “right or wrong” is not the issue. If you are uncomfortable in your parish, to the point that it impacts on your spirtual well being, by all means look for another parish! Just don’t let your unhappiness or disagreement with a priest to drive a wedge of separation between you and God!

I’ll pray you find peace, whatever route you take!

Pax

thank you so much for all your responses!–i do need your prayers and support–after mass today i was angrily informed by the dre that ALL communion masses will be in total english and it is too bad that not everyone can understand it—followed by–"they"live in america and they need to learn english!–All this over a request for one spanish song during the spanish children’s first holy communion mass-----i moved here from a church that offered masses towards spanish,vietnamese,polish parishoners and in latin too(and it was a smaller parish)
i keep thinking how CHRIST gave his disciples the power of other languages so they can go out and evangelize to many------this English only attitude to me is so unchristian and a lot of these families need the church in their lives desperately

i apologize for the length but this issue feels painful to me and so unchristianlike

 

[hannajomar]

That’s a tough decision you have, keepingfaith4. You obviously care a lot about these kids, Jesus, and the Church. It can be a difficult balance between simply obeying the pastor or other superiors and loving charity towards people. I wish I had some advice for you.

 

[sacredcow]

The actions of your pastor violate the directives of multiple church teachings. We are supposed to take into account things like age and culture. I myself have had to deal with an openly racist music director who despised hispanics and refused to let them play guitars in church. She forced her organ playing on them and treated them with contempt and hostility. The caucasian/Italian pastor supported her. The spanish choir had about 6 members as a result. Our new pastor was from a third world country and immmediately allowed the spanish to have their own instruments, now they have a 30 person choir and all kinds of beautiful instruments. Attendance at that mass is way up. If I had not seen myself what you are talking about I would have found it hard to believe.

I would respectfully bring your concerns to the Bishop in your diocese. This is your privilege and is not being disobedient. By not providing music suitable to the age and culture of his parishioners, the Pastor is missing a great opportunity. Again, I understand and empathize with you completely.

 

[Irishgal49]

The priests are humans, make dumb decisions like everyone of us.
So of them are used to give orders and to dialogue little.
I think you should not move from the Parish.
Obedience is pretious at the eyes of God and you may teach a great lesson of obediecne to your kids.
But…do insist, insist, insist, insist. Never give up.
It seems your parish needs a brave person like you to change things…

I say move. I spent years being hit over the head with “obedience” and made no progress in my spiritual growth. Once I did, I took off like a rocket and really improved my relationship with God. The beauty of the faith is there are tons of Churches. Now if you’re moving every other year or having massive problems in multiple parishes, then you might want to get a spiritual director to see what is wrong.

 

[keepingfaith4]

I say move. I spent years being hit over the head with “obedience” and made no progress in my spiritual growth. Once I did, I took off like a rocket and really improved my relationship with God. The beauty of the faith is there are tons of Churches. Now if you’re moving every other year or having massive problems in multiple parishes, then you might want to get a spiritual director to see what is wrong.

this is my first move to a new home and a new church in twenty years-–so i gave this church a chance for the entire two years i have been in this area and things are getting worse.My first class of FIRST HOLY COMMUNION STUDENTS received saturday and my second class of primarily 99% hispanic children are receiving this saturday may 12th and for the first time i got to see how hatefully these wonderful hispanic parishoners are treated—one quote thrown at me"there will never be spanish spoken at first communion mass"they" need to learn english if “they” want to hear this mass and sing(referring to the FIRST COMMUNION MASS entirely controlled by the dre and pastor

this past week had only a 40%hispanic group with no instructions in spanish before the mass started so my daughter and i went around to as many families as we could in our poor spanish to direct them to photographers and changing rooms and whatever we could

the dre and his helpers went around with sour faces complaining about too many people and etc—**a very very unjoyous atmosphere on what should be a joyful occasion—we are both disheartened **
my dilemma—if i leave will the next person treat the kids well and reach out to the families or do i stay and try harder to improve things by bringing this to diocesan attention

 

[anonymous_in_fl]

That attitude wouldn’t last long in south Florida where everything has to be done in 3 languages: english, spanish, and creole.

If there is a large minority population in any parish, they should at least be given some pastoral care in their native language if it is at all possible. Songs/music in spanish is one example; trying to incorporate mass responses in spanish is another.

Thank you for trying to help the spanish-speaking members of your parish.

 

[jmcrae]

i am a catechist for many years but now am in a new parish due to a recent move.AFTER preparing my older students(9 to 14) for first holy communion,the dre has told 2 of them they cannot receive two weeks before the sacraments are to be given because their caretakers missed getting them to the retreat(a half day event).

It is allowed for the pastor to require that the participants attend the lessons and the Retreat. This isn’t “extra” - it’s part of the preparation process.

It would be important to review the communication process - if people thought that the Retreat was optional when in fact it was required, then it signifies that there is a communication break-down somewhere along the line.

 

[agnes_therese]

**
my dilemma—if i leave will the next person treat the kids well and reach out to the families or do i stay and try harder to improve things by bringing this to diocesan attention**

I think you should stay, and try to bring this to your bishop’s attention. If you leave without trying, you’ll always wonder if you could have improved the situation.

 

[Pfaffenhoffen]

I say move. I spent years being hit over the head with “obedience” and made no progress in my spiritual growth. Once I did, I took off like a rocket and really improved my relationship with God. The beauty of the faith is there are tons of Churches. Now if you’re moving every other year or having massive problems in multiple parishes, then you might want to get a spiritual director to see what is wrong.

I would say “stay”.
Obedience is not all.
I would follow Ghandi and King with their silent or peaceful revolution. Peaceful BUT revolution.

 

[Pfaffenhoffen]

this is my first move to a new home and a new church in twenty years-–so i gave this church a chance for the entire two years i have been in this area and things are getting worse.My first class of FIRST HOLY COMMUNION STUDENTS received saturday and my second class of primarily 99% hispanic children are receiving this saturday may 12th and for the first time i got to see how hatefully these wonderful hispanic parishoners are treated—one quote thrown at me"there will never be spanish spoken at first communion mass"they" need to learn english if “they” want to hear this mass and sing(referring to the FIRST COMMUNION MASS entirely controlled by the dre and pastor

this past week had only a 40%hispanic group with no instructions in spanish before the mass started so my daughter and i went around to as many families as we could in our poor spanish to direct them to photographers and changing rooms and whatever we could

the dre and his helpers went around with sour faces complaining about too many people and etc—**a very very unjoyous atmosphere on what should be a joyful occasion—we are both disheartened **
my dilemma—if i leave will the next person treat the kids well and reach out to the families or do i stay and try harder to improve things by bringing this to diocesan attention

Again, remember Luther King and what he did?
He was is a worse situation and did it!
That priest needs help so that someone may open his blind eyes. If you are brave enough, do it! One step at a time! Speak softly but with assertiveness. Repeat what you want 10 times. Softy. Never lower your eyes.
2 times you lose, 1 you win. You are going forward.
I am giving you the steps that are better.
I would not have the guts to do it. I would explode! But I think my way would not be the best way !!!
Ghandi and Luther King came and gave us the way adapted to our times of a Christian way of bein in society. Not violent revolution. No passive obedience.
But non-violent revolution.
You will know what the best way is for you.
I am just thinking aloud and trying to help.

 

[keepingfaith4]

Again, remember Luther King and what he did?
He was is a worse situation and did it!
That priest needs help so that someone may open his blind eyes. If you are brave enough, do it! One step at a time! Speak softly but with assertiveness. Repeat what you want 10 times. Softy. Never lower your eyes.
2 times you lose, 1 you win. You are going forward.
I am giving you the steps that are better.
I would not have the guts to do it. I would explode! But I think my way would not be the best way !!!
Ghandi and Luther King came and gave us the way adapted to our times of a Christian way of bein in society. Not violent revolution. No passive obedience.
But non-violent revolution.
You will know what the best way is for you.
I am just thinking aloud and trying to help.

i love your advice–my timidity comes from the fact that both the pastor and the dre has exploded in rage even last week at a 7 year old with adhd for not reading along with the prayer(child has learning difficulties)–my gut response was to smack him(the dre)—so this is my dilemma—time to go back to the rosary daily for strength in this

i feel i need to continue to reach kids and families to return to GOD but obedience to rules and behaviors that turn people away from God and CATHOLICISM(as interpreted by these misguided individuals)are leading some of these families to non traditional and cultish type of groups:bigyikes:

 

[anp1215]

I feel that you should stay and continue to advocate for these parishioners who seem to have no voice in their own parish. It sounds to me like maybe God sent you to this parish for a reason.

The situation you describe truly saddens me! All this will do is alienate and push these Hispanics into the arms of the welcoming Protestant church down the street that offers services in their language.

I get really angry and annoyed when I hear the “Welcome to America, learn to speak English immediately” attitude. I fully and 100% believe that immigrants should make every effort to learn the language of their new country, but that is easier said than done. For one, this DRE has no idea how long many of the Hispanic people have been here. For all she knows, some of these kids moved here a few months ago with their families. It takes time to learn a new language. Where do all of these people work? If they work in the home, learning English is going to be even more difficult. A stay at home mom might not leave the house often enough to pick up much English. She might not be able to afford English classes (this is why I want to start a ministry at my parish that offers free English classes to immigrants).

Also, nowhere did you even say that these people can’t understand English. I bet many of them can. So where did the “they live in America they need to speak English” comment from the DRE even come from? Just because you can speak English doesn’t mean you can never hear/speak Spanish ever again.

I’d like to see this DRE move to the Netherlands and immediately learn to speak Dutch. And even if she lived there for a long time and did learn the language, does that mean that she wouldn’t appreciate the comfort of hearing her native language in church? That’s what a native language is to me, a comfort. What harm would it do to allow these people the small comfort of hearing a single song in their language?

 

[keepingfaith4]

I feel that you should stay and continue to advocate for these parishioners who seem to have no voice in their own parish. It sounds to me like maybe God sent you to this parish for a reason.

The situation you describe truly saddens me! All this will do is alienate and push these Hispanics into the arms of the welcoming Protestant church down the street that offers services in their language.

I get really angry and annoyed when I hear the “Welcome to America, learn to speak English immediately” attitude. I fully and 100% believe that immigrants should make every effort to learn the language of their new country, but that is easier said than done. For one, this DRE has no idea how long many of the Hispanic people have been here. For all she knows, some of these kids moved here a few months ago with their families. It takes time to learn a new language. Where do all of these people work? If they work in the home, learning English is going to be even more difficult. A stay at home mom might not leave the house often enough to pick up much English. She might not be able to afford English classes (this is why I want to start a ministry at my parish that offers free English classes to immigrants).

Also, nowhere did you even say that these people can’t understand English. I bet many of them can. So where did the “they live in America they need to speak English” comment from the DRE even come from? Just because you can speak English doesn’t mean you can never hear/speak Spanish ever again.

I’d like to see this DRE move to the Netherlands and immediately learn to speak Dutch. And even if she lived there for a long time and did learn the language, does that mean that she wouldn’t appreciate the comfort of hearing her native language in church? That’s what a native language is to me, a comfort. What harm would it do to allow these people the small comfort of hearing a single song in their language?

you have said exactly what i am feeling but am still not sure about staying as the man who is the dre has quite a temper,carries grudges and has been in the diocese as an educator for many years.Along with this,he wields much power**.these families are already beginning to leave this catholic church and are joining more hispanic non catholic organizations **

this dre comes from a small town with small town ideas and finds honoring others cultural backgrounds unacceptable.Despite having a fairly rapidly growing african-american-and hispanic community within 2 miles of this church there are NO outreach ministries.
I will continue to pray over this and hope this next communion mass this week has a much happier tone from the dre and his helpers.I intend to NOT take a backseat this mass and will work hard to keep the joy in this special occasion as it should be

 

[anp1215]

you have said exactly what i am feeling but am still not sure about staying as the man who is the dre has quite a temper,carries grudges and has been in the diocese as an educator for many years.Along with this,he wields much power**.these families are already beginning to leave this catholic church and are joining more hispanic non catholic organizations **

this dre comes from a small town with small town ideas and finds honoring others cultural backgrounds unacceptable.Despite having a fairly rapidly growing african-american-and hispanic community within 2 miles of this church there are NO outreach ministries.
I will continue to pray over this and hope this next communion mass this week has a much happier tone from the dre and his helpers.I intend to NOT take a backseat this mass and will work hard to keep the joy in this special occasion as it should be

I hope so too. What a nasty and unfortunate attitude to have. Maybe you should remind him that without Hispanics, the Church in America would be SHRINKING.

Bring this to prayer. Ask God what He wants you to do.

 

[Irishgal49]

Again, remember Luther King and what he did?
He was is a worse situation and did it!
That priest needs help so that someone may open his blind eyes. If you are brave enough, do it! One step at a time! Speak softly but with assertiveness. Repeat what you want 10 times. Softy. Never lower your eyes.
2 times you lose, 1 you win. You are going forward.
I am giving you the steps that are better.
I would not have the guts to do it. I would explode! But I think my way would not be the best way !!!
Ghandi and Luther King came and gave us the way adapted to our times of a Christian way of bein in society. Not violent revolution. No passive obedience.
But non-violent revolution.
You will know what the best way is for you.
I am just thinking aloud and trying to help.

It’s not the parishioners job to “convert” the priest and the parish. I do think IF you choose to stay I would inform the Bishop. He needs to know what’s going on in that parish. Especially since you indicated there is a Spanish speaking priest there, no excuse for what’s happening at all.

 

[keepingfaith4]

yesterday was the second and last of the first communion classes to recieve.God truly stepped in for the timid spanish priest stood up and two days ago finished the requirements the 3 children that were going to be excluded by the dre and pastor and insisted they join their class in receiving.

Then with the backup of the music director DID include a spanish hymn during communion

the dre was furious.He came 10 minutes before mass was to start and he had all the seat arrangements and programs,so we 3 helpers had to hurry.
On top of this,the servers never showed,so one of the teacher helpers pinched in(a mystery as to why they did not come)
the lector helper also did not show----so we 3 banded together and insisted the dre do it since he surprisingly had all this person’s liturgy parts for the children to do.
I was ignored by the dre and pastor and banished to the music area by his helper.
The dre had a scowl on the entire time(twill be on the video)
The spanish priest did the homily and part of the consecration in spanish.
the videographer asked the dre why he was so angry afterwards—he said to him—it’s not the kids that infuriate me–it’s the adults here and walked away.
Bottom line—the kids were happy and the parents were thrilled despite the glitches.The weather was gorgeous.The spanish priest for the first time stayed after mass to greet families,take pictures,bless rosaries,etc

God smiled on us and i am thankful!:heaven: