Needs help responding-Facebook apologetics :)

[shannyk]

I’m hoping to get some help here from people who are better at this than I am.

Yesterday I posted this status line on my facebook page in honor of the feast day of St. Faustina…

True works of God always meet opposition and are marked by suffering.” St. Faustina ~ Feast day… TODAY

Ok, simple enough. But this is how one of my facebook friends responded. Keep in mind this man is an evangelical? (I guess you’d call it) non denom Christian and a former minister/pastor. Whenever I post something Catholic he ALWAYS has a response…I’m not exactly sure what he’s getting at here…and I want to respond, but don’t know how exactly so I’m hoping someone here can help. I’m just not good a forming my thoughts when it comes to things like this. Anyway, here is what he said

ALL KINDS OF PEOPLE SUFFER ALL THE TIME FOR ALL KINDS OF REASONS SO SUFFERING IN ITSELF IS NO SIGN. EVEN ATHEISTS SUFFER. FOR THE CHRISTIAN, PERSEVERANCE THROUGH SUFFERING BRINGS FORTH GLORY AND CHARACTER,THAT IS WE BECOME A LITTLE BIT MORE LIKE JESUS.
PAUL AND JOHN SUFFERED MORE THAN ANYONE MENTIONED BY NAME IN SCRIPTURE (OTHER THAN JESUS)., BUT THEY DIDN’T GLORIFY THEIR SUFFERINGS. THEY GLORIFIED JESUS AND HIS FINISHED WORK AT THE CROSS, THE ONE WHO DELIVERED THEM FROM SUFFERINGS AT THE HANDS OF WICKED AND IGNORANT MEN.
PAUL SAID “BUT THANKS BE UNTO GOD WHO GIVES US THE VICTORY THROUGH CHRIST JESUS OUR LORD.”
JOHN SAID, “GREATER IS HE THAT IS IN YOU THAN HE THAT IS IN THE WORLD.”

Any help in trying to understand where he’s coming from here and what I could say, is much appreciated.)

 

[Drawmack]

I’m hoping to get some help here from people who are better at this than I am.

Yesterday I posted this status line on my facebook page in honor of the feast day of St. Faustina…

Ok, simple enough. But this is how one of my facebook friends responded. Keep in mind this man is an evangelical? (I guess you’d call it) non denom Christian and a former minister/pastor. Whenever I post something Catholic he ALWAYS has a response…I’m not exactly sure what he’s getting at here…and I want to respond, but don’t know how exactly so I’m hoping someone here can help. I’m just not good a forming my thoughts when it comes to things like this. Anyway, here is what he said

Any help in trying to understand where he’s coming from here and what I could say, is much appreciated.)

Why don’t you ask him? Tell him that you’re not sure what his comments have to do with your post and could he please explain, more clearly, what his intent was.

 

[Tonks40]

Looks like he’s just trying to expound on your statement…in his own evangelical Christian non-denom type of way.

 

[shannyk]

Why don’t you ask him? Tell him that you’re not sure what his comments have to do with your post and could he please explain, more clearly, what his intent was.

I could do that, I suppose. I guess I am just feeling silly because every time I post something Catholic he responds with some…twist, it seems, and I don’t have anything to say. I don’t want to debate him on my facebook page is why, I guess, but I also don’t want to look like don’t know what to say, KWIM?

Looks like he’s just trying to expound on your statement…in his own evangelical Christian non-denom type of way.

That makes sense…I just wondered if he’s trying to get at something by saying ‘they didn’t glorify their suffering’ as if remembering saints or having them at all is a kind of glorification? It seemed to me he was trying to gingerly get at something deeper.

 

[Drawmack]

I could do that, I suppose. I guess I am just feeling silly because every time I post something Catholic he responds with some…twist, it seems, and I don’t have anything to say. I don’t want to debate him on my facebook page is why, I guess, but I also don’t want to look like don’t know what to say, KWIM?

Then why don’t you respond with that. Say something like, "If you’d like to debate me I’ll be more than happy to do so through e-mail or private messages but I see no reason, or need, to clutter up all of my friend’s feeds with this debate.

 

[Peggy_in_Burien]

I would just respond, “Amen, Brother”.

I didn’t see anything anti-Catholic in his response. Actually, I feel as if it is a very thoughtful response. Prehaps, since you know this person, you see him as using his reply to try to provoke you, but, you needn’t rise to that bait, if that is his intention.

Just my humble opinion.

 

[VivienneJ]

Then why don’t you respond with that. Say something like, "If you’d like to debate me I’ll be more than happy to do so through e-mail or private messages but I see no reason, or need, to clutter up all of my friend’s feeds with this debate.

My first thought was, “Excellent idea”, (I get really annoyed when my friends have serious conversations via Facebook status lines), but then I saw this:

I would just respond, “Amen, Brother”.

I didn’t see anything anti-Catholic in his response. Actually, I feel as if it is a very thoughtful response. Prehaps, since you know this person, you see him as using his reply to try to provoke you, but, you needn’t rise to that bait, if that is his intention.

Just my humble opinion.

Even better as a way of gently agreeing and bringing the whole “debate” to an end, then you can move it to a more private communication area if you feel it needs further discussion.

 

[MercyMia]

Um, the all caps of his response really wasn’t necessary now was it
It looks like he is being hostile…but to what end? His comments aren’t in opposition to Catholic teaching, but I suspect he thinks they are and he is trying to one up you? He obviously has no idea about Faustina and the concept of Divine Mercy. Gosh. Just ignore the man in charity. Maybe you can just put another post below his comment to the affect of…“I am glad my posts are bringing people’s minds to Christ this morning”!

 

[Nita]

…
Ok, simple enough. But this is how one of my facebook friends responded. Keep in mind this man is an evangelical? (I guess you’d call it) non denom Christian and a former minister/pastor. Whenever I post something Catholic he ALWAYS has a response…I’m not exactly sure what he’s getting at here…and I want to respond, but don’t know how exactly so I’m hoping someone here can help. I’m just not good a forming my thoughts when it comes to things like this. Anyway, here is what he said

ALL KINDS OF PEOPLE SUFFER ALL THE TIME FOR ALL KINDS OF REASONS SO SUFFERING IN ITSELF IS NO SIGN. EVEN ATHEISTS SUFFER. FOR THE CHRISTIAN, PERSEVERANCE THROUGH SUFFERING BRINGS FORTH GLORY AND CHARACTER,THAT IS WE BECOME A LITTLE BIT MORE LIKE JESUS.
PAUL AND JOHN SUFFERED MORE THAN ANYONE MENTIONED BY NAME IN SCRIPTURE (OTHER THAN JESUS)., BUT THEY DIDN’T GLORIFY THEIR SUFFERINGS. THEY GLORIFIED JESUS AND HIS FINISHED WORK AT THE CROSS, THE ONE WHO DELIVERED THEM FROM SUFFERINGS AT THE HANDS OF WICKED AND IGNORANT MEN.

Except for the underlined sentence, I’d agree with him and thank him for his (name removed by moderator)ut. Then I’d ask him to clarify what he means when he says Jesus “delivered” Paul and John “from suffering at the hands of wicked and ignorant men” - especially as he had just stated that they (Paul and John) had suffered.

I don’t know about you, but I don’t understand what he means in the bolded underlined section. Because of Jesus redemptive suffering there is forgiveness, grace…, and we do not have to suffer eternal damnation - but the suffering of eternal damnation was/is not something that comes from the “hands of wicked and ignorant men”.

 

[shannyk]

Um, the all caps of his response really wasn’t necessary now was it
It looks like he is being hostile…but to what end? His comments aren’t in opposition to Catholic teaching, but I suspect he thinks they are and he is trying to one up you? He obviously has no idea about Faustina and the concept of Divine Mercy. Gosh. Just ignore the man in charity. Maybe you can just put another post below his comment to the affect of…“I am glad my posts are bringing people’s minds to Christ this morning”!

That’s a good response thank you. I think he’s trying to say…something, but doesn’t want to be too off putting so he’s careful. I say that not out of some paranoia but because he never posts on my page ever unless it’s something regarding Catholicism and it always seems to be a “but” kind of thing. I like what you suggest as a response very much. Yes, he always types in all CAPS!!! Lol

Except for the underlined sentence, I’d agree with him and thank him for his (name removed by moderator)ut. Then I’d ask him to clarify what he means when he says Jesus “delivered” Paul and John “from suffering at the hands of wicked and ignorant men” - especially as he had just stated that they (Paul and John) had suffered.

I don’t know about you, but I don’t understand what he means in the bolded underlined section. Because of Jesus redemptive suffering there is forgiveness, grace…, and we do not have to suffer eternal damnation - but the suffering of eternal damnation was/is not something that comes from the “hands of wicked and ignorant men”.

Yes I was puzzled by that part as well I tend to think his reference to ‘glorifying their suffering’ is a well couched dig at the idea of Saints…and remembering them and/ or asking for their intercession. To him I think that it take away the glory that is Jesus’. He has mentioned it before. I don’t want to get into a whole thing on my page with him, but I have many Catholic friends to whom I don’t want to look like a dolt who doesn’t know here faith…I think I will message him privately.

thanks for the (name removed by moderator)ut!

 

[DOShea]

As I read the comments it appears your friend takes objection to St. Faustina in that she is somehow “glorifying” suffering. As another poster stated, he probably has no idea who she is or what she did, and is probably operating under the assumption that 1)she suffered somehow, and 2)just because of that the CC made her a Saint. If that is his belief, it is understandable why he might compare that to Paul, but I’m not sure why John gets dragged into this. Paul died a martyr’s death… but John did not. Maybe he had Peter in mind.

Whatever the case, Facebook isn’t a good forum to discuss religious or faith beliefs. It always seems to turn into a zoo whenever anyone does.

 

[Nathan_Wagar]

Yeah why don’t you point him to Colossians 1:24 where Paul says that he REJOICES in his sufferings.

 

[imkingdad]

Yeah why don’t you point him to Colossians 1:24 where Paul says that he REJOICES in his sufferings.

Thank you, I was looking that up, You beat me to it but it is a great reply.

 

[shannyk]

Yeah why don’t you point him to Colossians 1:24 where Paul says that he REJOICES in his sufferings.

THANK you I needed that.

he actually messaged ME privately about the whole thing…ug.

 

[JMJ_coder]

It seems like he is making a logic error.

The fact “true works of God always meet opposition and are marked by suffering” does not imply “meeting opposition and suffering always indicate a true work of God”. It is not an equivalence, it is only a one way implication.