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Megwalters2288
Guest
This sounds like a big mess causing a lot of worry for a lot of people.
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This sounds like a big mess causing a lot of worry for a lot of people.
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umamibella
Guest
In June the congregation, which deals with doctrinal issues, ruled that a baptism was invalid if the minister said, “We baptize” instead of “I baptize.…”
This did not cause chaos. ‘We ’ dont baptize. The Ordained Clergy and Jesus do not baptise together. During baptism the Ordained clergy is acting ‘in persona Christi’ in the person of Christ’
Christ baptises , the priest acts in the person of Christ, hence I baptise, not ‘we’
The Vatican is not in error.
This did not cause chaos. ‘We ’ dont baptize. The Ordained Clergy and Jesus do not baptise together. During baptism the Ordained clergy is acting ‘in persona Christi’ in the person of Christ’
Christ baptises , the priest acts in the person of Christ, hence I baptise, not ‘we’
The Vatican is not in error.
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Tis_Bearself
Patron
The publication you posted, the National Catholic Reporter, is not held in great esteem on this forum as it tends to constantly criticize the Church and support various topics that are against Church teaching.
Its nickname on here is “the Distorter”.
I would suggest taking its articles with a large grain of salt.
In addition, the Vatican didn’t “invalidate a baptism formula”, rather it confirmed that the baptism formulat used was supposed to be the one approved by the Church, not some formula that the priest or deacon or non-Catholic minister baptizing thought was better. We’ve also had multiple threads about the Vatican’s decision and its effects on at least two priests and two of the posters on this forum who had to be rebaptized.
All I see here is more biased Church-bashing by the Distorter.
Its nickname on here is “the Distorter”.
I would suggest taking its articles with a large grain of salt.
In addition, the Vatican didn’t “invalidate a baptism formula”, rather it confirmed that the baptism formulat used was supposed to be the one approved by the Church, not some formula that the priest or deacon or non-Catholic minister baptizing thought was better. We’ve also had multiple threads about the Vatican’s decision and its effects on at least two priests and two of the posters on this forum who had to be rebaptized.
All I see here is more biased Church-bashing by the Distorter.
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umamibella
Guest
That and pope bashing seem a popular past time here at the moment. Some must see a free voice on CAF to tell us Catholics all about what is so wrong about us.All I see here is more biased Church-bashing by the Distorter.
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Megwalters2288
Guest
I can see this causing a lot of worry for people. There could be a lot of people without a valid baptism in the Church. What if there are some who are unaware that their baptism isnt valid?
Tis_Bearself
Patron
Baptisms are presumed valid unless there is actual evidence that the wrong words were used.
Evidence would be something like the baptism rite of certain Protestant churches often or usually uses the wrong words, or someone has a video recording of a baptism where the priest or deacon is using the wrong words. In the cases where a Catholic clergyman has been found to have used the wrong words, the dioceses try to reach out to everyone who was baptized by him out of an abundance of caution.
Yes, it’s a bit of a frustrating situation, especially since (as discussed on the other threads) there was a common belief among many otherwise very orthodox Catholic clergy that the use of the word “We” might be okay, even though orthodox Catholic clergy would caution that it is always better to use the EXACT words prescribed by the Church so as to avoid all doubt. But in the absence of evidence, we presume validity and trust in the Lord to provide whatever might be missing through no fault of our own.
Evidence would be something like the baptism rite of certain Protestant churches often or usually uses the wrong words, or someone has a video recording of a baptism where the priest or deacon is using the wrong words. In the cases where a Catholic clergyman has been found to have used the wrong words, the dioceses try to reach out to everyone who was baptized by him out of an abundance of caution.
Yes, it’s a bit of a frustrating situation, especially since (as discussed on the other threads) there was a common belief among many otherwise very orthodox Catholic clergy that the use of the word “We” might be okay, even though orthodox Catholic clergy would caution that it is always better to use the EXACT words prescribed by the Church so as to avoid all doubt. But in the absence of evidence, we presume validity and trust in the Lord to provide whatever might be missing through no fault of our own.
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Genesis315
Guest
“Vatican causes chaos by invalidating Baptisms”
Fake news. Loosey goosey clergy making unauthorized changes to the rite cause chaos by invalidly baptizing.
Fake news. Loosey goosey clergy making unauthorized changes to the rite cause chaos by invalidly baptizing.
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