New Australian Law Requires Priests to Break Seal of Confession to Report Admissions of Child Abuse

[Alex337]

Alex337:

When a person is murdered they cannot be saved.

Where did you come by this idea?

A priest. If that person who is murdered hasn’t had a chance to be cleansed of sin and accept Christ.

Alex337:

When a person is raped or tortured they often turn away from faith, especially if its found that a priest could have saved them and chose not to. So many people turn away from faith when a church isn’t willing to stop harm when they could.

One has to wonder if you are speaking from personal experience. I will pray for you, Alex.

Nope. I haven’t been harmed in any such way. I know it’s a popular opinion to believe anyone who turns away from Catholicism must do so out of hurt or whatnot, but not in my case.

Alex337:

I think confession is very important. I don’t think we should get rid of confession.

You will not find an opportunity for it in whatever ecclesial community you have chosen.

This is fine

 

[Alex337]

Nope, I understand; I just don’t agree. I’ve spoken with my local priest about the sacraments and been able to show clear understanding, and I’ll take their opinion on this over yours. I simply disagree with aspects.

 

[StephieNorthCo]

Alex, when you get a chance, could you update your profile? It currently states Roman Catholic.

Blessings,

 

[Alex337]

Alex337:

I hope you don’t mean to but you’re coming across as very patronising. If I believe someone is going to harm another I’ll report it.

Your statements seem to reflect a paucity of real life experience. I am not trying to be patronizing, just making an observation.

We should all be responsible for protecting those around us. Reporting is not always the most effective intervention, though.

I can safely assure you that you are wrong. I have plenty of life experience and understanding in these matters. So if you would kindly cease your condescension it would be appreciated.

Alex337:

One should still report things, if we don’t just because of some overwhelming pessimism then nothing gets done.

Some of us have experienced some overwhelming pessimism by reporting! You rightly observe that reporting often results in nothing getting done. What I am suggesting is that you do something more effective than “reporting”, which has limited effectiveness.

One should keep reporting these things. I’m a teacher and I’ve had to put in reports over the years of suspected child abuse and neglect. It can hurt to see seemingly nothing come of these reports but if we say nothing even less happens. If we report and keep reporting the chances for some intervention to occur rises.

Alex337:

Wow, still condescending.

There is nothing condescending about encouraging spiritual formation! At least you would know what you are rejecting, rather than “disagree” with something other than what the Church teaches.

There is plenty about suggesting basic classes and continually suggesting I am ignorant that is condescending. I’ve studied this a lot. I’ve studied theology and moral philosophy with my local priest, at university and with a few other denominations to come to my conclusion on how I view things. So, again, please stop with the condescension, it achieves nothing.

Alex337:

I did and I left it today

How can you tell? Is this also your opinion?

It is my opinion. I’ve thought on it for a while and while I did question the Church before today I still attempted to live within its bounds. I hope to organise a time with my local priest to speak on the matter, as it would be rude to just ghost him after all he’s done for me. But I think I can safely say I have converted.

Alex337:

No, it’s shown your assumptions time and again.

I can only go on what I have read, and your posts reflect an ignorance of Catholic faith, and a rebellious heart against the teaching authority given by Christ to His Church.

Disagreeing with how a thing works doesn’t mean one doesn’t understand it.

 

[mVitus]

Alex, when you get a chance, could you update your profile? It currently states Roman Catholic.

Blessings,

I understand the point you’re making, Stephie. In fairness though, I want to bring out the reminder the Church will still see Alex as one of our own and will be waiting with open arms should she decide to become practicing again.

 

[Alex337]

Alex, when you get a chance, could you update your profile? It currently states Roman Catholic.

Blessings,

Sorted! I have to admit I wasn’t 100% sure where the profile button was Thank you!

 

[Alex337]

StephieNorthCo:

Alex, when you get a chance, could you update your profile? It currently states Roman Catholic.

Blessings,

I understand the point you’re making, Stephie. In fairness though, I want to bring out the reminder the Church will still see Alex as one of our own and will be waiting with open arms should she decide to become practicing again.

Thank you. It’s much appreciated. And to be fair I wouldn’t want to accidentally mislead people, so I’m glad for the reminder.

 

[hmikell7]

And this thread has helped me decide to convert away from Catholicism

Seems my thread has resulted in someone leaving the faith. . . . . . . . . That was rather unexpected, I must admit.

My prayers will be with you Alex337

 

[guanophore]

If that person who is murdered hasn’t had a chance to be cleansed of sin and accept Christ.

Well that is a pretty big IF, is it not? Much to big to relate to your assertion that “a person who is murdered cannot be saved”. Such a leap of logic indicates reasoning problems.

If a person dies in a state of mortal sin, this is what prevents them from heaven, not getting murdered. People who die in this state have the same fate, murdered or not!

God gives every soul sufficient grace to be saved, so no one dies without a “chance”.

There is plenty about suggesting basic classes and continually suggesting I am ignorant that is condescending.

As a teacher, you surely realize that ignorance is not shameful in any way, and can be rectified by education.

I’ve studied theology and moral philosophy with my local priest, at university and with a few other denominations to come to my conclusion on how I view things.

But then, education alone is not always sufficient to form one in faith!

But I think I can safely say I have converted.

You may not realize this, Alex, because you seem to have an insufficient faith formation, but once a Catholic, always a Catholic. Even rejecting the Church teaching will not exempt you from canon law, and there is nothing you can do that will undo your sacramental participation. You are permanently sealed in baptism and have tasted of the heavenly gift in Eucharist.

You are now, and will always be, part of the flock that Jesus placed under Peter to care for and to feed. Thus, you will always be in the flock for whom the Pope prays every day, and for whom he labors to feed and guide into heaven.

 

[guanophore]

Seems my thread has resulted in someone leaving the faith. . . . . . . . . That was rather unexpected, I must admit.

I don’t think so. It seems clear that this drifting away from the faith has been going on for months, maybe more. Perhaps this thread brought it to a head, but this was important to happen. Without a clear trumpet of Truth, those who are in error will not realize that they are.

 

[Alex337]

Alex337:

There is plenty about suggesting basic classes and continually suggesting I am ignorant that is condescending.

As a teacher, you surely realize that ignorance is not shameful in any way, and can be rectified by education.

But assuming ignorance in others is exceedingly insulting. So please stop. I’ve asked politely a fair few times.

Alex337:

I’ve studied theology and moral philosophy with my local priest, at university and with a few other denominations to come to my conclusion on how I view things.

But then, education alone is not always sufficient to form one in faith!

I’ve also explained before that I have life experience, prayed, and had spiritual experiences. I am quite happy in my faith now.

Alex337:

But I think I can safely say I have converted.

You may not realize this, Alex, because you seem to have an insufficient faith formation, but once a Catholic, always a Catholic. Even rejecting the Church teaching will not exempt you from canon law, and there is nothing you can do that will undo your sacramental participation. You are permanently sealed in baptism and have tasted of the heavenly gift in Eucharist.

Cool. The Church can believe that all it wants. I don’t. And it doesn’t matter to me what other folk believe, if it brings you comfort to think that then go for it. It’s cool.

 

[Prodigal_Son]

I hope you don’t mean to but you’re coming across as very patronising.

I agree. I don’t understand why people claim that someone who disagrees with Catholic teaching is immature, or why they assume this person’s motives must be personal (e.g. they were abused). Someone could turn the tables and make the same claim about the orthodox Catholics in the conversation. And that, too, would accomplish nothing.

 

[TheLittleLady]

The good news, you are not called to a priestly vocation. Your priest will always keep every sin you commit in the strictest confidence, as my priest will with mine.

 

[TheLittleLady]

I’m trying to understand peoples opinions.

This is not about opinion. It is about doctrine, truth. What you believe is a lie. You are pushing the idea of the noble sin and the noble lie. These are anti-Christian, anti-Catholic views. You cannot have it both ways with the Church. When it comes to divine law you believe or reject, you are in a state of Grace or you are out.

 

[TheLittleLady]

Yup. Today is my first official day no longer being Catholic.

You will be Catholic forever. Like the prodigal son you may be a Catholic who seeks earthly pleasure and desires to run away from your Fathher, in the end he lives in darkness and sin.

YET there is hope. The Father watches and waits for the prodigal to return!

 

[Alex337]

Alex337:

Yup. Today is my first official day no longer being Catholic.

You will be Catholic forever. Like the prodigal son you may be a Catholic who seeks earthly pleasure and desires to run away from your Fathher, in the end he lives in darkness and sin.

YET there is hope. The Father watches and waits for the prodigal to return!

Cool. I’m not dashing off for earthly pleasures or anything so melodramatic though. I’m following where God led me.

 

[Alex337]

Alex337:

I’m trying to understand peoples opinions.

This is not about opinion. It is about doctrine, truth. What you believe is a lie. You are pushing the idea of the noble sin and the noble lie. These are anti-Christian, anti-Catholic views. You cannot have it both ways with the Church. When it comes to divine law you believe or reject, you are in a state of Grace or you are out.

Actually I was, as I said interested in peoples opinion on the dogma. Which is what was discussed

I also don’t recall saying anything about noble lies? Nor, for that matter, have I pushed my belief as right. I’ve said what it is, I believe it is correct. I also don’t mind if other folks disagree as it was never my goal to convince others of my opinion, only to hear and understand theirs.

 

[margaret42]

You know, it occurred to me that maybe some of the silence of the “sex abuse” is because priests could have confessed these actions to other priest-who can’t report! It’s just a thought.

 

[JimG]

I guess it’s a new day for the Church in Australia. Now, all priests are government informants.

Anyway, I stopped beleiving in the good faith of prosecutors after reading this book.

No Crueler Tyrannies

In No Crueler Tyrannies, Pulitzer Prize-winning journalist Dorothy Rabinowitz re-frames the facts, reconsiders the evidence, and demystifies the proceedings of some of America's most harrowing cases of failed justice. Recalling the hysteria that accompanied the child sex-abuse witch-hunts of the...

books.google.com

 

[Prodigal_Son]

You know, it occurred to me that maybe some of the silence of the “sex abuse” is because priests could have confessed these actions to other priest-who can’t report! It’s just a thought.

This surely happened, but there are tons of well-known cases where Catholic authorities knew what was going on because of evidence outside the confessional.