New Church--there is hope!

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Ahh, I see. So the practice of having the tabernacle away from the altar but still in a place of prominence is a clear way of showing this distinction without obscuring one or the other.

Actually, now that I read it a bit more closely, I see what it was really trying to say - that the tabernacle shouldn’t be on the altar the Mass is being celebrated on. I read it at first as saying that the tabernacle shouldn’t be behind the altar, either, which made me wonder if the many churches with tabernacles in reredos behind the altar were technically in noncompliance. Now that I read it, because the reredos is separate, it would be OK.


That tabernacle is “seemingly” behind the alter cause yet another church failed to construct a fitting edifice in honor of our lord by giving into modern stardards.
Why is it that having the altar pushed up close to the reredos and having the priest facing away from the people the “right” or “real” way? Is it because that was the way it was when you were a kid, or that’s the way it was forty years ago?

I am unable to think of any reason why we should go back to celebrating the Mass exclusively ad orientem and having the same ornate style of sanctuary. As far as I can tell, the drop in vocations has been due to ****** catechesis, not having the priest facing the people.
Would you have a busdriver face you? /strightface
I happen to like having the Mass celebrated facing the people, because it makes it easier to see. I’m a visual person, and me being able to clearly see the goings-on at the altar actually does enhance the sacrifice of the Mass for me - I’ve seen several TLM’s on YouTube and the like(yes, I’m fully aware that its not the same thing), and I find myself distracted because all I can see when the camera looks towards the altar is the priest’s back.
And in that spirit that allowed the “new” way to come in and allowed those with less devotion to change the mass to make it more watered down. I can understand that this doesn’t apply to you but aloowing the priest to turn around in the first place is opening the flood gate.
However, I am not going to say “Well, the sanctuary should only be set up in this particular manner, and Mass should only be said facing the people.” I am not going to say “The only “real” sanctuary setup is having a freestanding altar and a simple/no reredos.” That’s not my call to make, and both styles can lend themselves to beautiful places of worship, and both are equally conducive to worship.
I’d agree with you to a point.
Therefore, I fail to see why we should consider an old and certainly beautiful style and setup of sanctuary the only “real” style and setup. Having too many options can certainly be an issue(see the number of abuses in many OF parishes), but I see no reason why this should be an area where the option should not exist.
Again opening the floodgate here.

Traditionally the trabrenacle WAS the alter itself hence this confustion.
 
Why is it that having the altar pushed up close to the reredos and having the priest facing away from the people the “right” or “real” way? Is it because that was the way it was when you were a kid, or that’s the way it was forty years ago?
First off, the altar itself does not have to be pushed against the wall, and a reredos is not really required either, although they are beautiful and do a great deal to aid in the celebration of the liturgy.

Secondly, you seem to say “Is it because that was the way it was…forty years ago?” with a touch of disdain. In reality, that is a PERFECT reason to do something. Because not only was that the way it was done forty years ago, as you said, but more accurately: thats the way it was done UNTIL forty years ago. We are Catholics. Our Church is founded in Sacred Tradition, and worship ad orientem is an example of this. The fact that changing this tradition removes us from continuity with our tradition SHOULD be a major concern for all Catholics.
I am unable to think of any reason why we should go back to celebrating the Mass exclusively ad orientem and having the same ornate style of sanctuary. As far as I can tell, the drop in vocations has been due to ****** catechesis, not having the priest facing the people.
Indeed, poor catechesis has influenced the drop in vocations. But remember, catechesis starts first and foremost in the Mass. The way we celebrate the mass is the most important statement of our Catholic faith. It is the most visible and readily experienced aspect of Catholicism, to both Catholics and non-Catholics. Therefore the way we celebrate mass IS IN ITSELF catechesis.

With that said, worshipping ad orientem is such a powerful statement, such good catechesis, that this alone should be a good reason for us to end this experiment with the Priest facing the people. It emphasizes that the Priest and the people are worshipping together, facing Jesus. It emphasizes that we are all called to worship Jesus a sa Christian community, awaiting his return (which will come from the east, the reason we face “liturgical” east).

On the other side, when the Priest faces the people, it protestantizes the Mass and makes it a celebration for the people rather than an act of communal worship. It injects too much of the priest’s personality into the service. The Mass becomes more about the Priest celebrating it than about our glorious Lord, who is depicted in the Crucifix on the altar.
I happen to like having the Mass celebrated facing the people, because it makes it easier to see. I’m a visual person, and me being able to clearly see the goings-on at the altar actually does enhance the sacrifice of the Mass for me - I’ve seen several TLM’s on YouTube and the like(yes, I’m fully aware that its not the same thing), and I find myself distracted because all I can see when the camera looks towards the altar is the priest’s back.
I dont really see how, with all the visual and ritual splendor of the TLM, one can be “distracted” by the priest’s back. Indeed, wouldnt seeing everything he is doing, which isnt even really necessary, be MORE distracting?
However, I am not going to say “Well, the sanctuary should only be set up in this particular manner, and Mass should only be said facing the people.” I am not going to say “The only “real” sanctuary setup is having a freestanding altar and a simple/no reredos.” That’s not my call to make, and both styles can lend themselves to beautiful places of worship, and both are equally conducive to worship.

Therefore, I fail to see why we should consider an old and certainly beautiful style and setup of sanctuary the only “real” style and setup. Having too many options can certainly be an issue(see the number of abuses in many OF parishes), but I see no reason why this should be an area where the option should not exist.
Remember, even the reformers and modernists who threw to the wayside our beautiful traditions in favor of the banality of the Novus Ordo (to quote Pope Benedict XVI) didn’t intend for it to be celebrated facing the people. That was added later. I find myself in agreement with Father Z: the most damaging element of the innovations following Vatican II was turning the altar around and letting the priest face the people.

It is for all these reasons that i believe truly Catholic worship must be done with the priest facing, with his people, Jesus Christ.
 
The Tridentine Mass is actually very, very easy to follow…there are certain things that take place and certain things the Priest says or does during Mass, which enable you to follow what is taking place during the Mass…the Latin-English Missal explains this in complete detail…You may be confused the first one or two times you go…but trust me, you soon follow along just as easily as a Novus Ordo Mass
Why is it that having the altar pushed up close to the reredos and having the priest facing away from the people the “right” or “real” way? Is it because that was the way it was when you were a kid, or that’s the way it was forty years ago?

I am unable to think of any reason why we should go back to celebrating the Mass exclusively ad orientem and having the same ornate style of sanctuary. As far as I can tell, the drop in vocations has been due to ****** catechesis, not having the priest facing the people.

I happen to like having the Mass celebrated facing the people, because it makes it easier to see. I’m a visual person, and me being able to clearly see the goings-on at the altar actually does enhance the sacrifice of the Mass for me - I’ve seen several TLM’s on YouTube and the like(yes, I’m fully aware that its not the same thing), and I find myself distracted because all I can see when the camera looks towards the altar is the priest’s back.

However, I am not going to say “Well, the sanctuary should only be set up in this particular manner, and Mass should only be said facing the people.” I am not going to say “The only “real” sanctuary setup is having a freestanding altar and a simple/no reredos.” That’s not my call to make, and both styles can lend themselves to beautiful places of worship, and both are equally conducive to worship.

Therefore, I fail to see why we should consider an old and certainly beautiful style and setup of sanctuary the only “real” style and setup. Having too many options can certainly be an issue(see the number of abuses in many OF parishes), but I see no reason why this should be an area where the option should not exist.
 
Please stay on topic, everyone. Take side discussions to new or existing threads. Thank you.
 
I do not believe there is an equivalent prayer in the Ordinary Form of the Roman Rite but a prayer from the Extraordinary Form comes to mind:

**Take away from us our iniquities, we beseech Thee, O Lord, that we may be worthy to enter with pure minds into the Holy of Holies. Through Christ our Lord. Amen.

**James
It seems familiar…but I have no idea where from. Maybe from one of the entrance prayers?:confused:
 
Please stay on topic, everyone. Take side discussions to new or existing threads. Thank you.
How about you guys PM us or let us know if our posts are going to keep getting moved or deleted.

And quite honestly, mine were quite a bit more on topic than some of the others on this thread. Biased much?
 
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