New Franciscan branches!

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chryso

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Ave maria everyone!
Pls i want to know why franciscans of the immaculate take solemn vows,I know that all of the new branches of the franciscan family e.g franciscans of the renewal,franciscans of life,franciscans of the immaculate,e.t.c are not an order, they are congregations,and as such can not be graced with solemn vows but franciscans of the immaculate takes solemn vows,why? Pls i need answers urgently and pls i can be corrected if need be.
AVE MARIA!
 
chryso said:
Ave maria everyone!
Pls i want to know why franciscans of the immaculate take solemn vows,I know that all of the new branches of the franciscan family e.g franciscans of the renewal,franciscans of life,franciscans of the immaculate,e.t.c are not an order, they are congregations,and as such can not be graced with solemn vows but franciscans of the immaculate takes solemn vows,why? Pls i need answers urgently and pls i can be corrected if need be.
AVE MARIA!
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Ave Maria!

The Franciscans of the Immaculate are an institute of Pontifical right, but I don’t know if that’s why they have solemn vows and others don’t. Maybe this can help - Code of Canon Law 1192.2:

§2. A vow is solemn if the Church has recognized it as such; otherwise, it is simple.
 
chryso said:
Ave maria everyone!
Pls i want to know why franciscans of the immaculate take solemn vows,I know that all of the new branches of the franciscan family e.g franciscans of the renewal,franciscans of life,franciscans of the immaculate,e.t.c are not an order, they are congregations,and as such can not be graced with solemn vows but franciscans of the immaculate takes solemn vows,why? Pls i need answers urgently and pls i can be corrected if need be.
AVE MARIA!
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… Franciscan confraternities.
 
Answering the question requires direct knowledge of the group that most people on here (including me) don’t have.

An example of how a new group could continue to have solemn vows. Say you are a member of OFM Conventual. You and a few of the other members decide to split off and form the Co-Fraternity of Assisting the Poor. Depending on how you did the split off, through which channels, etc. your new group COULD be allowed to still do solemn vows. This would all depend on how things were set up by the local Bishop and the higher ups within the original group. It is also possible the Vatican itself allows for it. Only people with direct knowledge of the Franciscans of the Immaculate can really give you an honest and true answer. In most cases people that are now taking vows are simple vows unless they are directly joining one of the primary “older” religious orders. O
 
FFI_Griswold said:
Ave Maria!

The Franciscans of the Immaculate are an institute of Pontifical right, but I don’t know if that’s why they have solemn vows and others don’t. Maybe this can help - Code of Canon Law 1192.2:

§2. A vow is solemn if the Church has recognized it as such; otherwise, it is simple.
Click to expand...
Thanks FFI Griswold,
I will be starting my aspirancy on the 5th of august,FI,i also read ur blog with the name johny…?and i learnt from it, u started urs 2009 and was simply professed 2012,u also observed in 2009,wow! All this i read from the blog,well more greese to ur elbow.pls i will appreciate if u share some of ur experiences so that i can learn from them and be prepared b4 starting my initial formation.
Thanks and God bless.

AVE MARIA!
 
FFI_Griswold said:
Ave Maria!

The Franciscans of the Immaculate are an institute of Pontifical right, but I don’t know if that’s why they have solemn vows and others don’t. Maybe this can help - Code of Canon Law 1192.2:

§2. A vow is solemn if the Church has recognized it as such; otherwise, it is simple.
Click to expand...
AVE MARIA!
Thanks FFI Griswold,
I will be starting my aspirancy on the 5th of august,FI,i also read ur blog with the name johny…?and i learnt from it, u started urs 2009 and was simply professed 2012,u also observed in 2009,wow! All this i read from the blog,well more greese to ur elbow.pls i will appreciate if u share some of ur experiences so that i can learn from them and be prepared b4 starting my initial formation.
Thanks and God bless.

AVE MARIA!
 
chryso said:
AVE MARIA!
Thanks FFI Griswold,
I will be starting my aspirancy on the 5th of august,FI,i also read ur blog with the name johny…?and i learnt from it, u started urs 2009 and was simply professed 2012,u also observed in 2009,wow! All this i read from the blog,well more greese to ur elbow.pls i will appreciate if u share some of ur experiences so that i can learn from them and be prepared b4 starting my initial formation.
Thanks and God bless.

AVE MARIA!
Click to expand...
Ave Maria!

Thanks be to God, that’s wonderful news! We have extended adoration every Thursday evening for vocations, and have recently begun a “10,000 Rosary Crusade for Vocations” (currently at about 1,500), so rest assured that you are in the prayers and penances of the friars.

Entrust everything to Our Lady. Ask Her to protect your vocation during this important time before entry, to set everything in your life in order, and to prepare you for the great adventure you are about to begin. And don’t forget to ask Her to join you in giving endless thanks to Her Son for calling you to receive the greatest grace, after baptism, given to mankind: religious life (St. Alphonsus).

Perhaps if you want to talk more about details and experiences it would be better to start a separate thread? God bless, and have a blessed octave of Pentecost!

In the Sacred Hearts of Jesus and Mary,

fra John Paul
 
FFI_Griswold said:
Ave Maria!

Thanks be to God, that’s wonderful news! We have extended adoration every Thursday evening for vocations, and have recently begun a “10,000 Rosary Crusade for Vocations” (currently at about 1,500), so rest assured that you are in the prayers and penances of the friars.

Entrust everything to Our Lady. Ask Her to protect your vocation during this important time before entry, to set everything in your life in order, and to prepare you for the great adventure you are about to begin. And don’t forget to ask Her to join you in giving endless thanks to Her Son for calling you to receive the greatest grace, after baptism, given to mankind: religious life (St. Alphonsus).

Perhaps if you want to talk more about details and experiences it would be better to start a separate thread? God bless, and have a blessed octave of Pentecost!

In the Sacred Hearts of Jesus and Mary,

fra John Paul
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Ave maria!
Thanks fra john paul,well,with God’s grace i ve been praying to God through the Immaculate concerning my vocation.
Concerning the ‘experiences’ I will start a new thread.Thanks once again and God bless you.

Ave maria!
 
Marauder said:
Answering the question requires direct knowledge of the group that most people on here (including me) don’t have.

An example of how a new group could continue to have solemn vows. Say you are a member of OFM Conventual. You and a few of the other members decide to split off and form the Co-Fraternity of Assisting the Poor. Depending on how you did the split off, through which channels, etc. your new group COULD be allowed to still do solemn vows. This would all depend on how things were set up by the local Bishop and the higher ups within the original group. It is also possible the Vatican itself allows for it. Only people with direct knowledge of the Franciscans of the Immaculate can really give you an honest and true answer. In most cases people that are now taking vows are simple vows unless they are directly joining one of the primary “older” religious orders. O
Click to expand...
Ave maria!

Thanks Marauder,for being sincere but pls can it be that an institute can take solemn profession just because it originates/came out from an institute with solemn vows.
 
chryso said:
Ave maria!

Thanks Marauder,for being sincere but pls can it be that an institute can take solemn profession just because it originates/came out from an institute with solemn vows.
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I think you are misunderstanding what I am saying about it. I am not saying a group would take solemn vows just because it came out of a group that had them. It would all depend on how and why the group was formed. Examples of things to consider, was the split considered friendly? Was the split with full consent of the parent organization?
Where all the proper procedures followed? Was permission requested and granted from higher in the chain? Is the purpose of the new group just supposed to be an extension of the original group or something totally different? An example of a split where permission was granted was the splits that formed both OFM Cap and the one that formed OFM Conv. Both groups as far as I know permit solemn vows.
 
I saw innovations from FOR at a Mass, which put me off. I like the F.I. I stayed there a week, but I have no luck following breviaries. The Franciscans of the Primitive Observance sounds very worthwhile, also. I don’t know of any obedient male traditional communities of Franciscans.
 
chryso said:
Thanks djames99,
but i dont get it;i dont understand.
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There are Franciscan confraternities who play a very important niche in doing the work of charity in this troubled world.

From: fssp.org/en/confratalloc.htm

Confraternities are not, however, simple societies of mutual assistance or philanthropic associations, but a union of brethren who, wanting to live the Gospel in the awareness of putting into practice the commandment of love, are urged to open their hearts to others, especially those in difficulty.

As we read from that site, confraternities may be born in unique situations and are indeed seen for their contribution in the Church. The Confraternity of St. Peter has a sacrificial and prayerful charism, and fullfils it’s raison d’etre. (of which I am a proud member. :o)

Of one case I know, this humble Franciscan group is in the process of obtaining permission from a diocese to form a confraternity. All indicators so far are is that it will become a reality thanks to the Holy Spirit.

Two issues needed to be surmounted, one was that there were no canonically professed members under the new constitution who could bring to form their existing fraternity, and to a lessor reason, there were enough local groups already established. (In fact this group preceded one Nova group by a number of years.). A hindrance also was that these wish to follow the lead of the Seraphic Father as they have always done under the old rule of Pope Leo. This group is also an old established group who hold their meetings at a renowned parish in our city, and who’s members are devout Catholics, are active in their Church, and who feel the need to express their charity through prayer and charitable works. The pastor who is their representative feels the best fit would be simply to establish a Franciscan confraternity, and they are happy for this small gesture of canonical recognition from the Bishop. The established canonical Fraternities share their joy and prayers for this group.

The feeling of joy overtakes us, when we see played out every day the Church’s instant recognition of the good works of these Catholic crusaders who express a unique charism.
 
What’s the name of tje community that might get approved? I would like to follow up on them.
 
foolishmortal said:
What’s the name of tje community that might get approved? I would like to follow up on them.
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I don’t know if it is appropriate at this time, as much is being done quietly, but I intend to announce it eventually as things develop. They already have a site waiting to make it’s entry when it becomes official. I’m anxious to let everyone know when the news comes out.
 
Ave Maria!

a little bit of digging from a commentary on Canon Law (p.43) mentions which organizations have the vows:
  1. Ordo denotes a religious organization in which solemn vows are taken; Congregatio monastica is a combination of several independent monasteries of monks under one superior; Religio exempta means a religious organization, of either solemn or simple vows, that has been withdrawn from the jurisdiction of the Ordinary of the diocese; Congregatio religiosa, or simply Congregatio, signifies a religious body in which only
    simple vows are taken, which vows may be either perpetual or temporary.
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another commentary (p.1417):
“The chief juridical difference between the two is that religious who profess a solemn vow of poverty renounce ownership of all their temporal goods (c.668.4-5)”
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and someone posted a summary on EWTN
Like solemn vows, simple vows are taken publicly, i.e., received by the superior in the name of the Church. They may be temporary or perpetual. Simple vows permit ownership of property, solemn vows do not. Acts contrary to simple vows, e.g., getting married, would be illicit, but valid. A religious society of simple vows is a congregation, and religious women in simple vows are called sisters (examples, Lazarists, Redemptorists, Marists, Rosminians). Nuns, strictly speaking, are religious women who have taken solemn vows (examples, Benedictines, Franciscans, Dominicans, Servites).
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Solemn vows are perpetual, and contrary acts, like getting married, are not only illicit but invalid. Religious in solemn vows cannot own property. A religious society of solemn vows is called an order, and its members are regulars, called nuns.
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Secularization requires a papal indult except from purely diocesan societies (those established by a bishop with approval from the Holy See). Likewise, a papal indult is necessary for readmission to an order or congregation, with the requirement that they begin again in the novitiate and make a new profession.
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Hope this helps, and happy feast of Corpus Christi!

Ave Maria!

fra John Paul
 
FFI_Griswold said:
Ave Maria!

a little bit of digging from a commentary on Canon Law (p.43) mentions which organizations have the vows:

another commentary (p.1417):

and someone posted a summary on EWTN

Hope this helps, and happy feast of Corpus Christi!

Ave Maria!

fra John Paul
Click to expand...
Ave maria!

Thanks fra John Paul,
since the new code of canon law(1983)only assert the juridical distinction you stated above,how about the spiritual benefits ofthe solemn vow such as being the extension of baptisimal graces or baptism, does a perpetually professed simple vow carry the same spiritual benefits,as in also being the extension of baptism or baptisimal graces?
I will appreciate your answer,thanks.

Ave maria!
 
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