New International Version

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Starwarsfan2 said:
( Facepalm )

Faith alone == Antinomianism
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I could discuss this even more. But we are off topic.

Yes without faith it is impossible to please Him. But one must also Love him.
Satan does not, which is why he is in hell.
 
I heard this once and agree 100%

Look at Luke 1

Does it say,

Hail, full of grace

Or

Hail, thou that art highly favoured

Subtlety against Mary…

Then check for the missing seven OT books
 
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Starwarsfan2 said:
Nope , they use love , because charity is rarely used as agape love in modern English, the word love expresses the meaning accurately ( although it can mean other words as philos , Eros and storge ) , so that’s the one they used , it’s not an attack , what they are aiming for is clarity.

And seriously, we do support good works , (Edited) .
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It is really obvious to us so why is it not obvious to you?
 
All Catholic graduate students in theology are required to use “The New Oxford Annotated Bible - New Revised Standard Version with the Apocrypha” This is the bible for Catholic scripture scholars who study Marianology.

amazon.com/New-Oxford-Annotated-Bible-Apocrypha/dp/0195289609/ref=sr_1_fkmr0_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1453218740&sr=8-1-fkmr0&keywords=The+New+Oxford+Annotated+Bible±+New+Revised+Sstandard+Version+with+the+Apocrypha

The NIV version of the bible is not a scholarly translation but if it brings people into a relationship with Jesus Christ - it is being applied towards a positive end. As Catholics there are better translations but reading an NIV bible will not poison your faith. God can work through all means to teach people the truth of the gospel.
 
mattp0625 said:
I heard this once and agree 100%

Look at Luke 1

Does it say,

Hail, full of grace

Or

Hail, thou that art highly favoured

Subtlety against Mary…

Then check for the missing seven OT books
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This is hardly the litmus test for fidelity.

The NIV has its problems, and I cited a key one above. This is not one of them.

“Highly favoured” regardless of translation is NOT an attack against Mary.
 
porthos11 said:
This is hardly the litmus test for fidelity.

The NIV has its problems, and I cited a key one above. This is not one of them.

“Highly favoured” regardless of translation is NOT an attack against Mary.
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To me, full of grace means something much more.

This is especially true if you accept her immaculate conception.

Most Protestants believe that Mary was just any old woman chosen as a vessel and nothing more. They will argue that others were highly favored such as John the Baptist.

To me, in that context, it is significant.

I cannot imagine it is coincidence that the Douay Rheims bible, used for centuries by the RCC and based on the Latin Vulgate, says full of grace while Protestant or other modern versions do not.
 
mattp0625 said:
To me, full of grace means something much more.

This is especially true if you accept her immaculate conception.

Most Protestants believe that Mary was just any old woman chosen as a vessel and nothing more. They will argue that others were highly favored such as John the Baptist.

To me, in that context, it is significant.

I cannot imagine it is coincidence that the Douay Rheims bible, used for centuries by the RCC and based on the Latin Vulgate, says full of grace while Protestant or other modern versions do not.
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See what he is saying starwarsfan2?
 
mattp0625 said:
To me, full of grace means something much more.

This is especially true if you accept her immaculate conception.

Most Protestants believe that Mary was just any old woman chosen as a vessel and nothing more. They will argue that others were highly favored such as John the Baptist.

To me, in that context, it is significant.

I cannot imagine it is coincidence that the Douay Rheims bible, used for centuries by the RCC and based on the Latin Vulgate, says full of grace while Protestant or other modern versions do not.
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Ditto on everything.
 
mattp0625 said:
To me, full of grace means something much more.

This is especially true if you accept her immaculate conception.

Most Protestants believe that Mary was just any old woman chosen as a vessel and nothing more. They will argue that others were highly favored such as John the Baptist.

To me, in that context, it is significant.

I cannot imagine it is coincidence that the Douay Rheims bible, used for centuries by the RCC and based on the Latin Vulgate, says full of grace while Protestant or other modern versions do not.
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Not even close to the actual Reformation teaching on Mary , and the rendering highly favored is fine ( I prefer the full of grace rendering but still fine)
 
Starwarsfan2 said:
Not even close to the actual Reformation teaching on Mary , and the rendering highly favored is fine ( I prefer the full of grace rendering but still fine)
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Luther started out venerating Mary, but absolutely modified his beliefs. He later wrote against the intercession of saints/communion of saints, including Mary. The reformers followed suit. It then evolved into what is described above.
 
Starwarsfan2 said:
Not even close to the actual Reformation teaching on Mary , and the rendering highly favored is fine ( I prefer the full of grace rendering but still fine)
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Also the original text for John 18 has Jesus say,“I AM”. But the NIV has him say “I am he.”
 
It’s not an attack…
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You have to admit the Catholic scepticism is justified considering the “traditions of men” mantra that Catholics are subjected to. I’ll stick with my KJV with Apocrypha/Deuterocanonicals, awesome Bible:

2Th 3:6 Now we command you, brethren, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye withdraw yourselves from every brother that walketh disorderly, and not after the tradition which he received of us.

2Th 2:15 Therefore, brethren, stand fast, and hold the traditions which ye have been taught, whether by word, or our epistle.

Mike
 
slMike said:
You have to admit the Catholic scepticism is justified considering the “traditions of men” mantra that Catholics are subjected to. I’ll stick with my KJV with Apocrypha/Deuterocanonicals, awesome Bible:

2Th 3:6 Now we command you, brethren, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye withdraw yourselves from every brother that walketh disorderly, and not after the tradition which he received of us.

2Th 2:15 Therefore, brethren, stand fast, and hold the traditions which ye have been taught, whether by word, or our epistle.

Mike
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Luther was a man

His reformation, 95 theses, and five solas were the resulting traditions

Luther, removing the seven books by his own authority, is another.

Further traditions of men include altar calls, invisible church, the 30,000 denominations, once saved always saved, and many others which stem from the reformation.
 
mattp0625 said:
Luther was a man

His reformation, 95 theses, and five solas were the resulting traditions

Luther, removing the seven books by his own authority, is another.

Further traditions of men include altar calls, invisible church, the 30,000 denominations, once saved always saved, and many others which stem from the reformation.
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Execept Luther did not remove the 7 books. A Jewish council did in 90 A.D. Luther decided to go with the Hebrew canon.
 
JB_Brother_4446 said:
Execept Luther did not remove the 7 books. A Jewish council did in 90 A.D. Luther decided to go with the Hebrew canon.
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Except at that point, the Jewish canon was not a settled matter.

However, he did make this change 1,200 years after the councils of Hippo and Carthage.
 
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