New translation of the Mass coming your way!

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UKcatholicGuy

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you guys heard? there is a NEW translation of the English Mass coming to America! It’s much more reverent in its language and follows the original latin more closely. not sure when it’s due to be implemented, but you can view it, side-by-side with the current translation here:

canticanova.com/articles/liturgy/art9ac1.htm

God bless
 
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UKcatholicGuy:
you guys heard? there is a NEW translation of the English Mass coming to America! It’s much more reverent in its language and follows the original latin more closely. not sure when it’s due to be implemented, but you can view it, side-by-side with the current translation here:

canticanova.com/articles/liturgy/art9ac1.htm

God bless
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In the US however when it’s “Approved” and when it’s “Implemented” are usually many years apart!
 
This would be wonderful. I know you’re right Bro. Rich, but I hope you’re wrong.

Does anyone know if we will be required to include the the ‘I confess to Almighty God…’ prayer and if the priest will be required to say (out loud) the ‘Blessed are you, Lord God of all creation…’ part out loud?

I miss these in the Mass at our parish.
😦
 
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UKcatholicGuy:
you guys heard? there is a NEW translation of the English Mass coming to America! It’s much more reverent in its language and follows the original latin more closely. not sure when it’s due to be implemented, but you can view it, side-by-side with the current translation here:

canticanova.com/articles/liturgy/art9ac1.htm

God bless
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I would not hold my breath to see any changes at your local church for years to come.
I’m so sorry.
 
Hmmm…

More changes in the translation than I thought there would be, but not the one I thought there would be. Certain people will not be happy since one word hs not been changed.

PF
 
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WanderAimlessly:
Hmmm…

More changes in the translation than I thought there would be, but not the one I thought there would be. Certain people will not be happy since one word hs not been changed.

PF
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I haven’t had the chance to review the Liturgy of the Eucharist yet, but I really like the Liturgy of the Word. Of course, from an outsider’s point of view (not Latin Rite, not in commuion with Rome, not trying to pretend to be, lest anyone should think I am), I like that Et cum spirtu tuo has been translated And with your spirit. That will make my life easier as the Rite I celebrate uses that phraseology.

The Gloria struck me as something different, not really bad, but definately different. I don’t see a theological problem, but egad… I can just imagine now some of the patently AWFUL settings that will get developed by hippy-dippy composers for this text of the Gloria.

Rob+
 
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WanderAimlessly:
Hmmm…

More changes in the translation than I thought there would be, but not the one I thought there would be. Certain people will not be happy since one word hs not been changed.

PF
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I think that word won’t ever change. It would seem too much like a concession that the current wording is invalid (which it’s not).
 
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Elzee:
This would be wonderful. I know you’re right Bro. Rich, but I hope you’re wrong.

Does anyone know if we will be required to include the the ‘I confess to Almighty God…’ prayer and if the priest will be required to say (out loud) the ‘Blessed are you, Lord God of all creation…’ part out loud?

I miss these in the Mass at our parish.
😦
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:confused: We say those parts now in our parish and have been for years. No, make that for decades! Why doesn’t your parish say them? :confused:
 
Much nicer in many ways. Deals directly with the awkward “him” statements referring to God which many persons perceive as stating theologically that God is male. Doesn’t use statements which presume God’s mercy and avoids the semi-pelagian approach of rendering Jesus, who is the Christ, as just one of the guys. Also avoids obsessive Mariolatry positioning her as pointing to Christ and not to herself. I like it, but I’m afraid I will need a missal to follow along (a modern liturgical “no-no”) until I get the hang of committing it to rote memory.

I would like to see a Vatican liturgical directive that requires a priest to hear confessions at least one half hour before EVERY Mass. I believe this would encourage people to have a greater appreciation for the Sacrament of Reconciliation as well as the Body and Blood of Our Lord. Imagine what could happen if more Catholics were to be found in a state of sanctifying grace after they were sent forth from Mass. The collective transformation of the Church would naturally spill over into the communities in which Catholics lived.
 
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Elzee:
This would be wonderful. I know you’re right Bro. Rich, but I hope you’re wrong.

Does anyone know if we will be required to include the the ‘I confess to Almighty God…’ prayer and if the priest will be required to say (out loud) the ‘Blessed are you, Lord God of all creation…’ part out loud?

I miss these in the Mass at our parish.
😦
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Isn’t that already required? My previous Parish and my current Parish always included those. I have been a member of my Church for over two years now and we always say “and with your spirit.” I have heard of these changes coming for 2 or 3 years. Bro. Rich is most likely right(I too hope he’s wrong on this one).
 
What is the ‘one word’ that is missing from the new translation.

As for what we do in my parish - I have no idea why we don’t say the “I confess to Almighty God…’. Is this required? I’ve been going here for 9 years and it has NEVER been said. Our priest does not ask us to ‘call to mind our sins’ either. We just go right into some general ‘prayers’ like ‘Lord God, you alone show us the mercy we do not deserve…etc’ and then we say the Lord Have Mercy, Christ have Mercy, Lord Have Mercy after each prayer. Then the priest says 'May Almighy God bless you forgive us our sins, etc…”

As for the ‘Blessed are you Lord God of all creation…’ - the preist says it, but to himself while we sing the rest of hte offertory song. I’m guessing it’s an attempt to cut 2 minutes off the Mass. geesh. Is this required to be heard? I think the words are beautiful and say them in my mind as he says them.
 
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Elzee:
What is the ‘one word’ that is missing from the new translation.
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Glad you asked.

In both thanslations the one word that won’t change is the word ALL
Take this, all of you, and drink from it,
for this is the cup of my Blood,
of the new and eternal covenant;
it will be poured out for you and for all …
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The latin is “pro multis” and it translates into “for many” however ICEL has translated it as “for all” and that has been the basis of the wedge driven between many traditionalist and the conciliarists.

Too bad that it didn’t get translated back to “for many” It might have settled a lot of disputes.

And just so everyone gets a little education, the discrepancy isn’t so much about the all or many in the meaning. EVERYONE knows that Jesus died for all. BUT and I don’t have time to look it up at the moment, a pope infallibly declared that the words of consecration were the only words of consecration. BUT he never specified language. So there is no problem of translating it to english, BUT the english must be a complete, total and literal translation of the latin. and “for all” doesn’t adhere to that. hence the contraversy.
 
I don’t like it.

I don’t like the Change in the Gloria, why change it? And I don’t like “And with your spirit.” I also dont like the change in the Creed.

Maybe I’m just a creature of habit. Or may I like that I’ve just now got everything memorized, and I like it the way it is.
 
4 marks:
I would like to see a Vatican liturgical directive that requires a priest to hear confessions at least one half hour before EVERY Mass. I believe this would encourage people to have a greater appreciation for the Sacrament of Reconciliation as well as the Body and Blood of Our Lord. Imagine what could happen if more Catholics were to be found in a state of sanctifying grace after they were sent forth from Mass. The collective transformation of the Church would naturally spill over into the communities in which Catholics lived.
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It’d be nice… problem is many parishes simply cannot do this. Those on both ends of the extremes would have the most difficulty: the large and the small.

In a large parish, masses are literally back-to-back on Sunday. At my parish sometimes it’s tough to get into the parking lot, because the crowd is still exiting from the previous mass.

Further, in a small parish (as in one I visited in my dad’s little town in Missouri), the priest travels to several parishes on Sunday to do mass. In this case, he arrives just in time for mass and literally cannot arrive a moment earlier. He begins masses at 8am and continues traveling all morning long throughout that part of the state. Making a mandatory reconciliation 30 minutes before each mass would likely mean some towns would no longer get a mass AT ALL… That’s not right.

So… While this would be great in an ideal world of medium-size parishes with live-in priests, it isn’t our world at this time.

-Michael
 
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Elzee:
What is the ‘one word’ that is missing from the new translation.

As for what we do in my parish - I have no idea why we don’t say the “I confess to Almighty God…’. Is this required? I’ve been going here for 9 years and it has NEVER been said. Our priest does not ask us to ‘call to mind our sins’ either. We just go right into some general ‘prayers’ like ‘Lord God, you alone show us the mercy we do not deserve…etc’ and then we say the Lord Have Mercy, Christ have Mercy, Lord Have Mercy after each prayer. Then the priest says 'May Almighy God bless you forgive us our sins, etc…”

As for the ‘Blessed are you Lord God of all creation…’ - the preist says it, but to himself while we sing the rest of hte offertory song. I’m guessing it’s an attempt to cut 2 minutes off the Mass. geesh. Is this required to be heard? I think the words are beautiful and say them in my mind as he says them.
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In the Roman Missal there are three options for the Penitential Rite. If your priest consistently chooses B or C then you won’t hear A (I confess…). As for the prayers of preparation (Blessed are you… R. Blessed be God Forever) the priests always has the option to recite these prayers silently. And these aren’t the only silent prayers he says but many aren’t aware of the other prayers.

Pax,
Keith
 
He also says ‘wash away my iniquity and cleanse me from my sin’ quietly. I miss hearing this too.
But, on the brighter side - thank goodness we don’t (yet) have liturgical dancers!

I’ve learned a lot on this thread - I never knew about the controversy of the ‘all’, and some other points made on the Gloria.
 
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mommy:
I don’t like it.

I don’t like the Change in the Gloria, why change it? And I don’t like “And with your spirit.” I also dont like the change in the Creed.

Maybe I’m just a creature of habit. Or may I like that I’ve just now got everything memorized, and I like it the way it is.
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They are horribly translated. Then again, if they in Rome would get their little fingers off this ordo and go back before this mass confusion started where we are currently arguing about what the meaning of “is” is, then we would be in better shape.
 
I will miss “Christ has died, Christ has risen, Christ will come again.” To me, that was the most profound and simple way to “say” the Mystery of Faith.

I dislike “and with your spirit.” It sound awkward. Better to go all the way and say “and with thy spirit.” I think “thees” and “thys” would sound beautiful, but then I’m sure I’m in the 0.000000000001 portion of the Church who feels that way.

I’m glad of the “go, the Mass is ended.” Too many celebrants dink around with it.
 
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EddieArent:
They are horribly translated. Then again, if they in Rome would get their little fingers off this ordo and go back before this mass confusion started where we are currently arguing about what the meaning of “is” is, then we would be in better shape.
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In revisiting this from earlier, I have to revise some of my thoughts…

I realize that Latin and English are separate languages, but the Gloria translation really goes to show where being overly literalistic can get one into trouble. The current Gloria text, when sung solemnly, is gorgeous.

The Creed has some serious problems - specifically surrounding the phraseology concerning the nature of the term begotten, born, and other thing surrounding the Incarnation.

As for some other comments on “And with your spirit”, having used this formulary now for several years, I can tell you that people are very comfortable with it after some initial confusion. I can always tell if a Lutheran, Episcopalian, or Latin-rite Catholic in communion with Rome has shown up at Divine Liturgy because when everyone else is saying “And with your Spirit” they blurt out “And also with you”. (Side note, it makes it useful to me so that I can make an announcement concerning non-communicant attendence at Divine Liturgy - it’s easy to tell if a Protestant has come to Liturgy - they stay seated at odd times, they don’t cross themselves, etc… but the only tipoff about Catholics in communion with Rome being in attendence is the “with you/ your spirit” difference.

At any rate, I will be interested to see the remainder of the Liturgy later tonight when I get some time.

Rob+
 
My Schola director served on several advisory comittees to the USCCB. When I asked about how soon the new Missale would be promulgated, he said “Maybe 2006. If we’re lucky.” That was before the death of His Holiness and the subsequent changes that will be made to the various Congregations.

So far, the Vatican has liked the proposals that have been sent to Rome. The hangup comes in the final vote here in the US. After being sent to Rome, the drafts are reviewed and recommendations from the Vatican are made. Unfortunately, the heterodox bishops of the USCCB have been fighting the recommended changes from the Vatican while the orthodox bishops are fighting to keep the changes. The whole thing is at a standstill at the moment. Pray that we have a pontiff who will revise canon law in such a way that the Vatican could directly intervene when a dispute like this arises in a particular country.
 
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