Newlywed

[Mamebl]

I have been married for 9 months. This is my second marriage and I have 2 children from my first marriage. I guess my question is how do you know when you have married the person God has meant for you? I’m scared I have made another mistake. He is agnostic and I don’t really agree with alot of his beliefs and he doesn’t believe in my Catholic beliefs either. He is a good man who seems a little lost when it comes to religion but is very strong willed and closed minded. I want to be the wife that God wants me to be and submit to my husband but I just don’t know if I should. It didn’t work the first time. I know I should have been asking these questions before I married him but I can’t go back now. I have to live with my decision and feel I need guidance to be spiritually happy with him. Like I said, he is a good person deep down, loves me and my children, is a hard worker and good provider. But he tends to be racist sometimes and is often negative. He doesn’t take care of himself and is very unhealthy. Is this who God wants me to be with?

Mame

 

[cheese_sdc]

I’m sure there were good things about this person, otherwise you wouldn’t have picked him to marry. Focus on those.

If things are really bad, try counseling.

 

[cymonk]

A marriage… is a hard and complicated matter. It would be hard to share enough information through a posting like this to give you an informed advice. There are many questions about your first marriage and this marriage, which would need to be answered. You may or may not even be ‘officially’ married to your new spouse in the eyes of the church. I would recommend seeking out a priest to help you sort things out a little more.

As far as “How do you know”… This is something that is different for everyone. I can say after struggling for soooo many years searching for my “one”… I finally found her after I started sorting my faith out. And this would be my recommendation to you. Pursue your faith first and foremost… Grow closer to God…The answers will come.

I did want to share a side note:

When I had found the “one”, I realized a beautiful part of our Catholic faith. I realized that as I grew in my faith, and she grew in hers, that we grew closer together because it was the same faith. Instead of growing further apart, we became closer united. Not that my marriage is “perfect”, but there is a common faith at the core, with automatically trickles down into so many of our values.

I am being a little presumptuous, but it sounds like you may already be experiencing problems in this area. If you are to continue your marriage, you will have to find ways to adjusting to each other’s growth in ‘faith’. If you do seek a divorce, I strongly encourage you to seek out the church. Going through an “annulment” can be very revealing of what a true marriage is intended to be and can give a lot of direction if you should decide to marry again.

God Bless,
Cymonk

 

[mlldrl]

You may not be really married to him. Was your first marriage looked at for validity by the Church?

M

 

[kage_ar]

Were you married in the Church? Did these things not come up during your marriage prep/pre-cana/FOCUS?

 

[Mamebl]

I was not a practicing Catholic during my first marriage and was not married in the church. My current husband and I weren’t married in the church either. He didn’t want anything to do with it. He isn’t exactly just against Catholics, he just really doesn’t like organized religion.
Looking back I know I didn’t stand up for my beliefs and would probably do things differently now but do not want a divorce. He is a good person but is just really lost. The more that I re-learn about the religion the more I want to truely be a “practicing Catholic.” Can I get my marriage validated without my husband having to know?

Mame

 

[kage_ar]

Next week, call your local Parish and make an appointment with Father (holy week this week, it is CRAZY busy at every parish ).

He has assisted many people in your same situation, and will help you through this.

 

[whatevergirl]

I was not a practicing Catholic during my first marriage and was not married in the church. My current husband and I weren’t married in the church either. He didn’t want anything to do with it. He isn’t exactly just against Catholics, he just really doesn’t like organized religion.
Looking back I know I didn’t stand up for my beliefs and would probably do things differently now but do not want a divorce. He is a good person but is just really lost. The more that I re-learn about the religion the more I want to truely be a “practicing Catholic.” Can I get my marriage validated without my husband having to know?

Mame

*This could be a great opportunity to pull your husband up to the faith…and introduce him to things. Whatever you do, don’t compromise your values and faith for him. He comes second to God, actually, and if he was on your same page, he’d know that. But…BUT…there is always hope. You say he is a good man, then hopefully, he will open his mind, and learn to be more open about your faith. Good luck–you’re in my prayers.

Remember…don’t allow him to cause you to compromise your faith or values. *

 

[dhgray]

First of all … WELCOME to the forum.

You can’t change him. You can only live the life God wants you to. By your actions, by your deeds, by your love Christ and the Church, you will help him see what is right and what is wrong.

Take on the roll of Godly wife and love, honor and respect him…and hang in there, God has plasn for him.

 

[agapewolf]

First of all, if you are a Catholic it is a serious sin to marry outside the church. Perhaps you didn’t know this, so you may not be culpable, but now you do. You are bound by canon law to participate in marriage the way the Catholic church deems fit.

2nd… if you civil “husband” is not baptized, this won’t be a sacramental marriage even if you were to have it validated. There will be no grace received. If you were to get your marriage convalidated, then you can return to the sacraments which will bring grace.

3rd…you said in your op that you are scared you made a mistake, but now you are wavering. Really? Is he the man that is going to get you to heaven and bring kids into this world and get them to heaven? It sounds as if you have to fight him every step of the way, and you even suggested getting your marriage validated without him knowing. How are you going to manage living up to your vows till death if he is unwilling to vow to that?

You need to do something here, soon. You need to figure out if this is indeed the person that will get you to heaven, and therefore you will marry in the church, or not. If so, then see a priest asap, go through the marriage prep stuff, and don’t hide anything. Perhaps in the middle of that you might see more clearly and change your mind, or be more convinced that this is good.

The bottom line here is that you are not married. Civil marriage and divorce has no bearing on the reality of a spiritual marriage. Quit thinking like you are married. That will open up some freedoms you have to make a FREE decision without reservation.

 

[ahollars]

I concur with agapewolf. You should have learned your lesson after the first one. In the eyes of the church you are not married, and you need to stop behaving as if you were.

Think about the terrible example you have on display for your children. How will you teach them right from wrong if you also teach them that the rules don’t apply to you?

You are holding on to something that isn’t there. You cannot save someone who doesn’t want to be saved. Trust me, I am speaking from experience.

I married my high school girlfriend. Big mistake. I wasn’t ready, and she had her own priorities. I divorced her without incident. We had no children. I wasn’t married in the church, so I was free to marry the right way.

Enter my current wife. I refused to marry her before she finished RCIA. We are now perfectly happy with each other :slapfight:. I was married before God and family, the way I should have been the first time.

I understand you think this man is good. But if his goodness has no consequence, then it will only last as long as it’s to his gain. You cannot lead him to the church. He must walk on his own feet. The only thing you can do is hold the light while he walks. If he refuses to walk towards you, then it’s time for you to walk away. I am sorry.

Also consider… You may want to hurry, before the one God does have for you finds you already married. Godspeed.:console:

 

[rolltidefan]

Mamebl…I am sorry to hear that you are having trouble. I myself have been there through divorce once and couldn’t imagine going through it again. I know for myself when I said “I do” the second time, it was with a whole other mind and alot of thought. I don’t understand living with someone agnostic, so I will not even try. I do know what it is like to live with someone that does not believe exactly the same. My husband is Catholic and I am protestant. The differences in just these two religions can be very trying at times but well worth the fight. This is just my personal thought and I am probably going to catch grief here for saying it, but in my opinion, if this is or would be your second divorce, I would highly recommend examing yourself. I am not saying a second, third or fourth or how many divorces makes anybody bad, but after a while, you have to examine yourself. I know for me I had to do that even after divorcing the first time. I had to quit taking pitty and being the victim of myself and examine myself. I think if I had not done this, it would probably affect my marriage now and probably myself would be looking at divorce #2. Because there are times when we argue about things and I think my goodness what have I done. But then I remember that I am not perfect either. I have also learned from a previous divorce that love is not ooey gooey feelings. You are not going to have those feelings all the time. Feelings will lead you in the wrong direction. Your mind will lead you in the wrong direction if you allow it. When I have bad thoughts or my mind or satan is wanting to temp me into thinking things could be better, I read 2 Corinthians 10:5. Just a quick reminder if you don’t know that verse, but it is talking about casting down imaginations that are not exalting to God. I do not believe divorce is very exalting at all to God. No matter who on here tells you that it is ok. No matter what man, church or anything gives you the “right” to justify that it is okay. I think if you can work it out that is the best thing. You probably knew he was agnostic before you married him right?? So why not be a light of Christ shining before him and win him over to the kingdom of God. You say he is a good man?? Work from there and look at the positive. If I were you I would also read 1 Corinthians 7:12-14. I am not a bible scholar, but I think that is pretty clear what it tells us as Christians to do when we are married to unbelievers. Just my thoughts. I hope everything works out for you. You seem to be a really sweet lady but just torn between feelings and thoughts which we all tackle in marriage, even in the most perfect of them.

Also, I would speak to someone that I really trusted about this. I have seen more than once on these forums of people asking questions like this and they are told really quick that it is just okay to leave without reservations. This actually makes me very ill and sick! That is easier said than done. I would not put a lot of faith into a site and where most people don’t care about my family or even about me. I am not saying that all here are like that, because there are some really good people here, but not all is very compassionate or care about you. Anyway, I would take what most say with a grain of salt and seek out someone that I trusted and cares about you and your husband as people and a family. If he thinks there is a problem, I would seek out counseling. Even if that meant me finding someone that didn’t preach a particular religion but just wanted to see my marriage not become statistic. God Bless You.

 

[sheilathebard]

I actually agree with the previous poster … even though you were not married in the Church, you made a commitment to him with the intention to stay with him for life, right? And he took you at your word, right – he is planning to spend his life with you? What’s changed now? Even if you could have done better, this is the man you chose to be with. The decision to leave him can’t be made lightly, or as if you never committed to him at all.

Now, I don’t believe you can (or should, even if you could!) get your marriage convalidated without his consent. Talk to a priest, and talk to your husband. Tell him that this is extremely important to you, and that you would be unhappy in a relationship that didn’t leave room for God. You aren’t requiring him to convert, but you need respect for your own beliefs.

 

[agapewolf]

If one goes into the convalidation feeling as if they “have” to because they married civilly, then this is not freely given without reservation.

 

[rolltidefan]

If one goes into the convalidation feeling as if they “have” to because they married civilly, then this is not freely given without reservation.

Do you think that we always give freely without reservation?? I think if you are human there are times that you do this. I think that is why we have the saying in marriage, you give some and take some. Although it should be always us both giving 100% and not just 50%. But we as humans just don’t do that all the time. It doesn’t make us bad people but it sure don’t give us the right to leave our partner either. If this were the case and people could use this as an excuse, we would all have a reason to divorce and feel fine about it. If you are human and especially if you are married, you have failed at this more than once. If I am understanding you correctly. Forgive me if I misunderstood.

 

[agapewolf]

Do you think that we always give freely without reservation?? I think if you are human there are times that you do this. I think that is why we have the saying in marriage, you give some and take some. Although it should be always us both giving 100% and not just 50%. But we as humans just don’t do that all the time. It doesn’t make us bad people but it sure don’t give us the right to leave our partner either. If this were the case and people could use this as an excuse, we would all have a reason to divorce and feel fine about it. If you are human and especially if you are married, you have failed at this more than once. If I am understanding you correctly. Forgive me if I misunderstood.

You are not understanding me correctly. I’m talking about the marriage vows. At the time that marriage vows are said, one must be completely free to enter the vows without reservation. This is the assent that the couples give at a Catholic wedding. If someone is already “civilly” married (which is NOT a real marriage if a Catholic is involved) and thinks they should stick it out because of that, that is not freedom.

 

[Salonika]

Dear Mame

I’m sorry things aren’t going well with your new marriage to the extent that you are now wondering (and worrying) whether it is a mistake.

Your husband is like nearly everyone else in that he has some very good qualities in his case he loves you and your children, is a hard worker and good provider but has some qualities you don’t like his occasional racism, being negative, not taking care of himself and not being a Catholic.

The worst thing you could do is ignore your doubts and your feelings. They are real and need to be sorted out. Counselling comes to mind to help you do this in a systematic and safe way. And I think that needs to happen whatever the status of your marriage in the eyes of Catholic Church and whether you wish to continue with it or not.

If your current marriage is to end then it needs to occur in as less damaging way to all involved including, and maybe especially, your children. Children learn about what marriage is like from their parent’s marriage – and for some this encourages them to marry in due course and for others it makes us very, very reluctant to even consider it.
mabelbl:

My current husband and I weren’t married in the church either. He didn’t want anything to do with it. He isn’t exactly just against Catholics, he just really doesn’t like organized religion… He is a good person but is just really lost

I think you are unwise to make any assumption about where your husband may end up religiously in the same way it is unwise to assume that people will change or not change in other ways. He may ultimately come to the same conclusion as you but he may not.
mabelbl:

Can I get my marriage validated without my husband having to know?

There are two in a marriage so even if this were possible it would not be a good idea in this or other important matters. How would you fell if he “went before your back” in an important aspect.

whatevergirl:

Remember…don’t allow him to cause you to compromise your faith or values.

And don’t force him to do so either.

sheilathebard:

… even though you were not married in the Church, you made a commitment to him with the intention to stay with him for life, right? And he took you at your word, right – he is planning to spend his life with you? What’s changed now? …… The decision to leave him can’t be made lightly, or as if you never committed to him at all.

Agree with Sheila and think that your husband may be confused at the situation. I would be in his situation. If things were okay eg re religion before I married and then I am told that they are not afterwards and I am expected to convert, I would be surprised.

 

[rolltidefan]

You are not understanding me correctly. I’m talking about the marriage vows. At the time that marriage vows are said, one must be completely free to enter the vows without reservation. This is the assent that the couples give at a Catholic wedding. If someone is already “civilly” married (which is NOT a real marriage if a Catholic is involved) and thinks they should stick it out because of that, that is not freedom.

Thank you for explaining that to me. I am sorry I misundestood you. However, I need to ask a question here…so you are saying that if a Catholic marrys someone say not Catholic and it was not done “as the Catholic should have”, then that gives the Catholic free reign to just get out of the marriage (of course also if I understand correctly, to a Catholic it really isn’t considered an actual marriage), when something doesn’t go their way and they don’t like it?? Just assuming your answer will be yes, does that not just seem like a lie on the Catholics part to the person they are still in my book making a vow to?? I ask these things sincerely.

 

[agapewolf]

Thank you for explaining that to me. I am sorry I misundestood you. However, I need to ask a question here…so you are saying that if a Catholic marrys someone say not Catholic and it was not done “as the Catholic should have”, then that gives the Catholic free reign to just get out of the marriage (of course also if I understand correctly, to a Catholic it really isn’t considered an actual marriage), when something doesn’t go their way and they don’t like it?? Just assuming your answer will be yes, does that not just seem like a lie on the Catholics part to the person they are still in my book making a vow to?? I ask these things sincerely.

You are putting weight on “vows” that don’t have any. Any “marriage” vows a Catholic makes outside of the canons of the Church (this means without the necessary approvals, etc, etc), don’t mean anything, regarding the sacrament.(They may be sincere at the time, but it does not bring grace) A catholic is bound by canon law. Just because you throw a birthday party for someone, doesn’t mean its their birthday, no matter how big a cake you have. The “wedding” outside of the canons of the church for a Catholic can’t MAKE a marriage happen. That isn’t what makes the marriage.

You are also forgetting the sacramental aspect of the whole thing. A sacramental marriage brings grace. A catholic marrying outside of the norms of the church is not in a sacrament…therefore, no grace. It isn’t about “free reign” just if something doesn’t go their way. Something is actually seriously wrong and the lack of grace will affect the “marriage”.

 

[kage_ar]

Citizens of Spain are required to be married according to the laws of Spain if they wish the marriage to be considered valid in Spain. These laws are binding EVEN IF the Spanish citizen was unaware of the laws.

Citizens of Jamacia are required to be married according to the laws of Jamacia if they wish the marriage to be considered valid in Jamacia. These laws are binding EVEN IF the Jamacian citizen is unaware of the laws.

Catholics are required to be married according to the laws of the Church if they wish the marriage to be considered vaild in the Church.

So, if a Catholic decides to get married outside the laws of the Church, EVEN IF they are unaware of those laws, the marriage is not valid in the eyes of the Church. Should the couple have problems and the Catholic party wish to leave the situation, they would be - in the eyes of the Church - leaving a cohabitation. A Catholic counselor would likely advise the party to work towared reconcilliation first with the Church then with the partner (assuming there is no abuse).