NFP after baby, frustrated

[Kelfa28]

So despite breastfeeding my daughter exclusively and following most of the rules I still got my period 5 weeks PP.

Now I’m even more confused and frustrated. I have absolutely no idea what is going on with my body.

According to my chart I’ve had continuously fertile mucus (really fertile mucus) for the past 10 days as well as a cervix that is open and soft this whole time. No temp rise and I’ve been in phase 2 for about 2.5 weeks.

We have no PP classes for STM within over 100 miles. Plus no other methods available within 100 miles. I took STM home course…which was fabulous for regular cycles but not this. There only advice about PP charting is to breast feed and that your cycles shouldn’t come back if you do breast feed.

Yeah, okay. Apparently I’m in the 3% of all women this doesn’t apply too.

We have serious reasons not to have another baby. Hubby and I have been abstaining this entire time. It’s stressful and not something I planned on doing for such an extended period of time.

Does anyone know what an anovulatory chart would look like? Has anyone else been in this situation where they’ve tried to chart PP and have been just confused. Are there any books anyone could recommend?

 

[Burt_Macklin]

Yes, my wife and I had a similar experience using NFP pp for all 5 of our children. The only thing that worked is abstaining for 4 months after the end of breast feeding to allow wife’s cycles to return. You can also usually confirm ovulation and phase 3 with opk strips to give you a few days of more certainty than normal. Having said that, we did conceive using OPK strips to confirm phase 3. OPK strips can give a false positive followed by ovulation a few days later.

Pardon my schadenfreude, but it is really good to hear that we are not the only ones who struggle to get any of this to work.

 

[Xantippe]

Breastfeeding is very confusing. I have a much longer amenorrhea than you have, but once baby started eating substantial amounts of solids, we were nervous enough about it that we wound up taking off 5 months until fertility resumed for real (from about 9 months to 14). I believe I had about a year of amenorrhea and then two anovulatory cycles, which was very irritating. I was barely breastfeeding at all toward the end (just a few minutes at a time), but it was still suppressing my fertility quite a bit.

Ironically, being kinda fertile/kinda infertile is really the worst of all worlds. If it gets to be too much for you and your husband, just quit breastfeeding and you should reset within a month or two. If you make the offer to your husband, he may feel better about the abstinence, because if he says no to you quitting, it’s something that he’s choosing, rather than something imposed on him.

If you were to continue breastfeeding but have regular cycles, that would be the best of all worlds, but I suspect you are in for a lot of weirdness as long as you breastfeed–long cycles, anovulatory cycles, etc. My personal least favorite is the hormonal phase where the body is trying to ovulate, but not quite succeeding–it’s like PMS that goes on and on.

 

[becca77345]

Check out “the Billings Method” by Evelyn Billings and Ann Westmore. There is a whole chapter on breast feeding which helped me out when I was bf and unsure of mucous signs. You may not be into Billings and it may well be too basic for what you need but I found this method the least confusing during bf and it might be worth looking in to. Good luck and congratulations on your new arrival too.

 

[gardenswithkids]

You might check out a book called “Fertility, Cycles and Nutrition” by Marilyn Shannon and perhaps discuss it with a good doctor familiar with n.f.p. and nutrition. The book has has some potentionally questionable nutrition advise but it does address how various nutrients can affect fertility.

I didn’t get my period for a long time when breastfeeding feeding my babies, but my return of fertility signs came and went, making n.f.p. extremely difficult and requiring extended abstinence to avoid pregnancy. Looking back, I realize my variable intake of plant estrogen (ie from soy) may have made a difficult situation even more difficult. In any case, I am now quite happy with the outcome. After much struggle and even facing the temptation to neglect Church teachings, we decided to stop worrying about pregnancy one way or the other. Wow! That was freedom! We were rewarded by trusting God to plan our family with a few more pregnancies and children than we thought we could handle, yet we are doing fine–in fact far better than we could have predicted at the time!

You may certainly have serious reason for avoiding another pregnancy. A couple of priests told my husband and me that we had good reason and I don’t doubt that we did. Remember that just because we can use something doesn’t mean that we must use it. Whatever you do, I encourage you to follow Church teachings. God is good!

 

[jilly4ski]

How long have you been charting postpartum? I ask because postpartum charting can be crazy especially if it is your first time charting postpartum. You are still on your first cycle. It is going to take a while to get used to (just like charting for the first time ever). You cycles will be different and even you symptoms will be different. While breast feeding it is very normal for there to always be some quantity of mucus, and now that you have had a baby, your cervix is likely softer and more open than it was while you were pregnant or before.

My mother got her cycles back at 6 weeks postpartum after every pregnancy, despite breastfeeding. Mine were longer, but with my last baby, I got a period at 5.5 months, but then did not bleed again for over 100 days. After my first baby, I know I was freaked out about all the mucus, and we abstained for almost 3 months while I figured out that it wasn’t fertile mucus, but the new normal for my postpartum breastfeeding.

Keep charting, keep checking, you will soon learn what a real change feels/looks like and what is your new “normal.” I know it is frustrating until then.

 

[FRLBJ]

If you are breastfeeding ecologically, that is the baby is with you most of the time except for short streches of time, your abstinence is kind of built in. Also don’t use pacifiers. Allow the baby to nurse whenever and also for pacification. Does the baby sleep with you for example? There is a time and a place for the marital embrace, maybe not now IF avoiding pregnancy is so seriously needed.
The baby needs your attention anyway in this most needy of times- postpartum. Hubby needs to realise that this is part of married life. Marriage is not about self-gratification. Instead it is about sacrificial love. It is time to grow up and become an adult. We adults have to do things for others whether it is convenient or pleasing to us out of love. Changing the baby’s diaper at 3:00 am is not convenient or pleasant, but we do it out of love. Allowing the baby to nurse on demand throught the night may also not be convenient, but it is necessary for the baby to receive adequate nourishment.

 

[FRLBJ]

There are examples in the 4th Edition of Natural Family Planning by John Kippley of the typical nursing chart. The temperature pattern is jagged and shows no pattern. It looks like a series of jagged mountain peaks and valleys. Also, the mucus is key if you have more than 3 or 4 days of continuos mucus then you should consider yourself fertile.

Here is a link explaining the difference between ecological and cultural breastfeeding.

nfpandmore.org/nfpcomparision.shtml

 

[Rafaela]

I am also frustrated. I was doing ecological breastfeeding. After a year my cycle got back, couple more months I continued, but immediately when I stopped I falled pregnant, with number 3.

Second and Third will have scarcely two years apart, and I am more than worried of how I am able to carry on. Especially since the first one is very active (not exactly hyper-active/hyper-sensitive)but not very far from it either.

Billings worked most of the breastfeeding and after it pretty well, but my cycle never got entirely normal before I got pregnant again.

 

[UbiCaritas]

((hugs)) My sympathies!

I haven’t had to worry about PP charting yet, but (see my siggy ticker ) that time is approaching. My best friend, who also uses the STM, was like you. Not that this is especially encouraging, but she ended up having nonstop fertile mucus the entire time she breastfed, and as they had good reason to avoid at the time, it meant abstaining the entire BFing period. Not fun, to say the least.

Are you familiar with the Marquette method? DH and I used the STM prior to this kiddo, but our plan post-baby is to combine the STM and the Marquette monitor because I intend to BF and, as you’ve discovered, that can do very wonky things to your cycles. If you google “Marquette breastfeeding protocol,” their text will come up as a PDF–it’s available for free online. Which is really convenient, IMHO, because you can read it before deciding if Marquette would be a good fit for you and your family. It is the most expensive form of NFP because you have the initial outlay for the monitor and also have the monthly cost of the dipsticks, but the dipsticks aren’t too pricey, and if they can be fit into your budget might help with your peace of mind, sanity, and, last but not least, your marriage!

Hope that helps, and best of luck to you. It would be kind of cool if we could get a sticky (maybe in the parenting forum?) about breastfeeding and NFP so that we could read about one another’s experiences, get ideas, etc.

 

[UbiCaritas]

If you are breastfeeding ecologically, that is the baby is with you most of the time except for short streches of time, your abstinence is kind of built in. Also don’t use pacifiers. Allow the baby to nurse whenever and also for pacification. Does the baby sleep with you for example? There is a time and a place for the marital embrace, maybe not now IF avoiding pregnancy is so seriously needed.
The baby needs your attention anyway in this most needy of times- postpartum. Hubby needs to realise that this is part of married life. Marriage is not about self-gratification. Instead it is about sacrificial love. It is time to grow up and become an adult. We adults have to do things for others whether it is convenient or pleasing to us out of love. Changing the baby’s diaper at 3:00 am is not convenient or pleasant, but we do it out of love. Allowing the baby to nurse on demand throught the night may also not be convenient, but it is necessary for the baby to receive adequate nourishment.

How is it not “being an adult” to want to use a tool the Church allows–i.e., NFP–to be able to have sex with one’s spouse? The OP wasn’t suggesting that contraception was the answer; she was asking for help with NFP. Sure, there are times when sex isn’t possible, but it’s hardly selfish to ask other people who might have more experience with this or other methods for advice.

Spending time with one’s husband when the baby has been adequately cared for is not neglectful to the baby. If anything, it’s quite the opposite: children thrive best when they are the product of a strong marriage. And even newborns do sleep sometimes; sex and a small baby are not mutually exclusive.

 

[jilly4ski]

((hugs)) My sympathies!

I haven’t had to worry about PP charting yet, but (see my siggy ticker ) that time is approaching. My best friend, who also uses the STM, was like you. Not that this is especially encouraging, but she ended up having nonstop fertile mucus the entire time she breastfed, and as they had good reason to avoid at the time, it meant abstaining the entire BFing period. Not fun, to say the least.

Are you familiar with the Marquette method? DH and I used the STM prior to this kiddo, but our plan post-baby is to combine the STM and the Marquette monitor because I intend to BF and, as you’ve discovered, that can do very wonky things to your cycles. If you google “Marquette breastfeeding protocol,” their text will come up as a PDF–it’s available for free online. Which is really convenient, IMHO, because you can read it before deciding if Marquette would be a good fit for you and your family. It is the most expensive form of NFP because you have the initial outlay for the monitor and also have the monthly cost of the dipsticks, but the dipsticks aren’t too pricey, and if they can be fit into your budget might help with your peace of mind, sanity, and, last but not least, your marriage!

Hope that helps, and best of luck to you. It would be kind of cool if we could get a sticky (maybe in the parenting forum?) about breastfeeding and NFP so that we could read about one another’s experiences, get ideas, etc.

There are specific breastfeeding protocols for STM. They look a lot like phase one protocals. I was able to successfully chart my return of fertility (despite some early abstaining when we were trying to figure it out) with all 3 of my kids with STM, actually I wasn’t temping, so with just mucus, and cervical position.

 

[gardenswithkids]

… It would be kind of cool if we could get a sticky (maybe in the parenting forum?) about breastfeeding and NFP so that we could read about one another’s experiences, get ideas, etc.

If this goes to a sticky, I want my comments earlier and this one deleted. My older kids know my user name, but unless this goes to a sticky it is not likely they will ever see this. I don’t really want my kids learning that some of them exist because mom and dad found abstinence frustrating. But that is one of the beauties of n.f.p.and the Church teachings. The difficulty of NFP helps many of us consider having larger families.

 

[UbiCaritas]

If this goes to a sticky, I want my comments earlier and this one deleted. My older kids know my user name, but unless this goes to a sticky it is not likely they will ever see this. I don’t really want my kids learning that some of them exist because mom and dad found abstinence frustrating. But that is one of the beauties of n.f.p.and the Church teachings. The difficulty of NFP helps many of us consider having larger families.

Oh, I wasn’t suggesting that this particular thread become a sticky–I was thinking something like the Pregnant Mamas thread! However, I’m sure the mods could help with that; I quite see your point.

 

[becca77345]

((hugs)) My sympathies!

I haven’t had to worry about PP charting yet, but (see my siggy ticker ) that time is approaching. My best friend, who also uses the STM, was like you. Not that this is especially encouraging, but she ended up having nonstop fertile mucus the entire time she breastfed, and as they had good reason to avoid at the time, it meant abstaining the entire BFing period. Not fun, to say the least.

Are you familiar with the Marquette method? DH and I used the STM prior to this kiddo, but our plan post-baby is to combine the STM and the Marquette monitor because I intend to BF and, as you’ve discovered, that can do very wonky things to your cycles. If you google “Marquette breastfeeding protocol,” their text will come up as a PDF–it’s available for free online. Which is really convenient, IMHO, because you can read it before deciding if Marquette would be a good fit for you and your family. It is the most expensive form of NFP because you have the initial outlay for the monitor and also have the monthly cost of the dipsticks, but the dipsticks aren’t too pricey, and if they can be fit into your budget might help with your peace of mind, sanity, and, last but not least, your marriage!

Hope that helps, and best of luck to you. It would be kind of cool if we could get a sticky (maybe in the parenting forum?) about breastfeeding and NFP so that we could read about one another’s experiences, get ideas, etc.

 

[becca77345]

becca77345:
oops! sorry. im not sure if ive pressed a few wrong buttons on my keyboard. Any way i second the use of a fertility monitor if you want extra reassurance.
The one I use though isnt reliable when you are breastfeeding but I dont know about the clear blue one used in Marquette. I have a feeling that your cycles have to be a certain length also but perhaps some of you guys who are Marquette users could chime in here.

 

[Kelfa28]

If you are breastfeeding ecologically, that is the baby is with you most of the time except for short streches of time, your abstinence is kind of built in. Also don’t use pacifiers. Allow the baby to nurse whenever and also for pacification. Does the baby sleep with you for example? There is a time and a place for the marital embrace, maybe not now IF avoiding pregnancy is so seriously needed.
The baby needs your attention anyway in this most needy of times- postpartum. Hubby needs to realise that this is part of married life. Marriage is not about self-gratification. Instead it is about sacrificial love. It is time to grow up and become an adult. We adults have to do things for others whether it is convenient or pleasing to us out of love. Changing the baby’s diaper at 3:00 am is not convenient or pleasant, but we do it out of love. Allowing the baby to nurse on demand throught the night may also not be convenient, but it is necessary for the baby to receive adequate nourishment.

Really? I need to grow up?

I’m well aware of what marriage entails and what it involves to take care of a baby. It’s my second child and not my first rodeo.

If I really wanted the easy way out I could have taken up my midwife’s offer to put me on the pill (as she is required to ask everyone, she knows I chart). If my husband wanted the easy way out he could have gone to CVS and grabbed a package of condoms and used them. I could have let him.

We are abstaining instead. I’m a SAHM and I have a two year old.

I know the EBF rules but I can’t follow them all. The two year old means I don’t share naps with my infant and I have issues with oversupply which means my daughter using me as a pacifier doesn’t always work as she can be overwhelmed with milk. She does 50/50 finger and breast to pacify. But I followed the other rules.

I’m not even going to address your comment about caring for a baby being a sacrifice. That wasn’t my question or what I was complaining about. Let’s stick to the topic at hand before we start heavily hinting that moms who don’t nurse are bad mothers because their formula fed babies sleep thoroughly.

Even still, hubby and I do find time together alone. We thought we’d be fortunate to have no cycles as I’ve been told by so many people. Not my body being in a constant state of seemingly fertile days since I’ve stopped bleeding.

Also, I don’t really need to get into why it’s imperative that I postpone another pregnancy. I believe my reasons are grave, thank-you.
I don’t care to post here what my reasons are and have people comment that they aren’t grave enough or the age-old argument that there are virtually no reason grave enough to postpone another pregnancy.

I’m just a Catholic woman trying to do what is right by God and, frankly, it is frustrating at times.

 

[jilly4ski]

Really? I need to grow up?

I’m well aware of what marriage entails and what it involves to take care of a baby. It’s my second child and not my first rodeo.

If I really wanted the easy way out I could have taken up my midwife’s offer to put me on the pill (as she is required to ask everyone, she knows I chart). If my husband wanted the easy way out he could have gone to CVS and grabbed a package of condoms and used them. I could have let him.

We are abstaining instead. I’m a SAHM and I have a two year old.

I know the EBF rules but I can’t follow them all. The two year old means I don’t share naps with my infant and I have issues with oversupply which means my daughter using me as a pacifier doesn’t always work as she can be overwhelmed with milk. She does 50/50 finger and breast to pacify. But I followed the other rules.

I’m not even going to address your comment about caring for a baby being a sacrifice. That wasn’t my question or what I was complaining about. Let’s stick to the topic at hand before we start heavily hinting that moms who don’t nurse are bad mothers because their formula fed babies sleep thoroughly.

Even still, hubby and I do find time together alone. We thought we’d be fortunate to have no cycles as I’ve been told by so many people. Not my body being in a constant state of seemingly fertile days since I’ve stopped bleeding.

Also, I don’t really need to get into why it’s imperative that I postpone another pregnancy. I believe my reasons are grave, thank-you.
I don’t care to post here what my reasons are and have people comment that they aren’t grave enough or the age-old argument that there are virtually no reason grave enough to postpone another pregnancy.

I’m just a Catholic woman trying to do what is right by God and, frankly, it is frustrating at times.

I wouldn’t listen too much to that poster, they are a new member with only 11 posts.

I know it is frustrating. But you will see (after much uncertainty and unknown) what is actually fertile mucus and what is just your baseline level. If you have the STM book, see if you can read over the breastfeeding section or I think they might even have a new breastfeeding section out (I took STM about 5 years ago. )

 

[Kelfa28]

Thank-you for all of the other posts.

I actually have some of the books suggested above. I have “Fertility, Cycles and Nutrition” but it doesn’t give much at all by way of postpartum cycles. Only what to do if you have very low temps…something I actually do have an issue with.

I’d love to purchase a Clear Blue Easy monitor but I’m afraid it’s just not in the budget right now.

I’ve been searching online for some help but most of the blogs are about how women want their cycles back but breastfeeding makes it tough to try to conceive again. Everything else is along the lines of any fertile mucus at all means you could be ovulating. It doesn’t say what to do if you have nothing but fertile mucus everyday for weeks on end.

I wish we had Creighton in the area because I could learn the difference between the mucus patterns.

If there is nothing we can do but abstain then that is our cross to carry.

Hubby is along the lines of just putting it all in my hands and whatever I want to do he is fine with it.
It’s nice because he isn’t complaining about the prolong abstinence but it isn’t exactly helpful either.
Believe it or not, I don’t like the abstaining either. Sometimes I think I dislike it more then he does.

 

[Kelfa28]

I wouldn’t listen too much to that poster, they are a new member with only 11 posts.

I know it is frustrating. But you will see (after much uncertainty and unknown) what is actually fertile mucus and what is just your baseline level. If you have the STM book, see if you can read over the breastfeeding section or I think they might even have a new breastfeeding section out (I took STM about 5 years ago. )

Thanks!

Quite a decent way to press my buttons. Usually I look for the post count and whether it could be a troll but my emotions get the best of us all sometimes.

Yeah my STM book isn’t very helpful. It basically goes into detail about how awesome breastfeeding is and that it can suppress fertility for a prolonged length of time. And that is it…nothing about postpartum cycles except that anovulatory cycles are normal if you are postpartum.

I looked on CCL to see if they still have the postpartum book but I can’t seem to find it. I’m not sure if they discontinued it or I’m having issues navigating the site. I took STM about 2 years ago myself.