NFP and Concerns for Married Couples

[maendem]

Since NFP can be used to space or limit your children, how is it not birth control?

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NFP is indeed a form of birth control - insofar as by “control” you mean seeking to space children responsibly, according to one’s economic, financial, emotional, physical, etc. needs. Doing so is in no way condemned by the Church, and is, in fact, encouraged. Of course, there is no such thing as absolute “control,” and we are called to discern the spacing of our children together as a couple under God’s guidance.

But: The Church condemns contraception, not “birth control.”

Yessisan: I didn’t mean to “bait” anyone; as a teacher of NFP, I find I need to make this distinction a lot to searching couples - the proper vocabulary is important, and the lack thereof can be confusing. But I don’t want to derail the thread any more…perhaps I read too quickly, but I thought it was the OP asking the question…

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[yessisan]

Yessisan: I didn’t mean to “bait” anyone; as a teacher of NFP, I find I need to make this distinction a lot to searching couples - the proper vocabulary is important, and the lack thereof can be confusing. But I don’t want to derail the thread any more…perhaps I read too quickly, but I thought is was the OP asking the question…

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Well, I was just reading birth control as artificial birth control. I was just trying to make a point so people don’t get the wrong idea and use NFP with that mentality. Since NFP is only allowed for avoiding if you have serious enough reasons, and of course, everyone’s reasons are different… I avoided because my marriage wasn’t Catholic and my husband wanted to raise our children outside of the Church, now that’s been resolved, so I have no good enough reason to avoid, plus we want a baby really bad…

 

[maendem]

Well, I was just reading birth control as artificial birth control. I was just trying to make a point so people don’t get the wrong idea and use NFP with that mentality. Since NFP is only allowed for avoiding if you have serious enough reasons, and of course, everyone’s reasons are different… I avoided because my marriage wasn’t Catholic and my husband wanted to raise our children outside of the Church, now that’s been resolved, so I have no good enough reason to avoid, plus we want a baby really bad…

Yes, of course - I understand. And my very best wishes that you may be blessed soon with new life!

 

[FrenchGwen]

Hi !

I’ve been married for… 7 weeks and a half and we use Billings.
I began learning it several months ( I charted for… 10 cycles) before the wedding so I could really get to know my body and its reaction in order to avoid incertitude.
Indeed from my own experience, NFP is great, but only if you really master it: if you know these precise days are fertile, it’s ok to abstain, because once they’re over, they’re over, and you can enjoy intimacy. I have to say, I absolutely LOVE being able to know and respect the way my body functions, as well as being able to share this with my husband.
So I would really emphasize on the need to learn the method accurately, which may lead to learn several methods in order to find which one works best for one’s body.

NY25E, first I have to say I really feel for you ! As a newlywed I can understand your frustation… all the more as my first postwedding cycle was a bit of a challenge too: fertile period was much longer than usual (12+3=15 days) and we did feel a bit frustrated. Thanks God the present cycle is making up for it.
Maybe you should turn to another method ? I don’t know much about Creighton, but what I love with Billings is that I’m able to see the difference between fertile and infertile mucus (since I almost always have some sort of mucus). Normally, once you mucus pattern has shown you that you ovulated, you should be able to enjoy around 10 days fully free for intimacy…even if some mucus shows on later, it will be infertile !
my best wishes !

 

[kevinsgirl]

Kevins giirl

what does it mean when it says day 18 of 29day cycle and so many days until testing? this sounds very …I dont know…I cant imagine that catholics in the ancient past did all this charting. what is charting how does it work?

Day 1 of a cycle is when your period starts, so day 18 is just 18 days later. I’ve been charting for over a year and my average cycle length is 29 days.

In the ancient past NFP was not at the level it is today. Many couples employed what is called the rhythm method–unfortunately this method is not very reliable because it is based on a textbook cycle.

Some women have 28 days between each period and ovulate on exactly halfway on day 14. But not all women have this reliability which can lead to assuming you have ovulated at a certain time when you are really ovulating sooner or later. In my case, I just ovulated…on day 18. If I had been using the rhythm method and had been trying to avoid, I would have assumed that it was a “safe” day (thinking I was four days after ovulation) and may have had sex but could have a surprise pregnancy instead because of a delayed ovulation. If I had been using the rhythm method to try to conceive, I would have assumed ovulation had already occurred and could have missed the most fertile days to have sex.

Charting isn’t really that complicated, though. We just have a better understanding of a woman’s cycle than we did in the days of the rhythm method. The method of NFP that my DH and I use is the sympto-thermal method. Basically all it involves is taking my waking temperature each morning and checking my cervical mucous. It has helped us identify some problems that I have with hormones as a bonus!

 

[1ke]

Does NFP in your experience Lead to 10 Kids?

No.

Can you only have sex once a week if you dont want a preganacy?

You can engage in marital relations whenever you want. When avoiding, you would choose not to engage in relations when you are fertile. How many days you must abstain is specific to each woman’s cycle. The “once a week” reference doesn’t make sense in an NFP context. It’s fertile vs infertile.

Is Oral Sex strictly forbidden in Marriage?

Oral stimulation as foreplay in the context of a complete act of intercourse is not a problem. Oral stimulation to climax or without completed intercourse is masterbation, and gravely wrong.

How does this help or hinder your marriage?

It has no impact on my marriage.

Also my next question is a concern I have. Do any of you ever feel your spouse might get needy or not feel like there desires are being met because of NFP And the Church’s Views on Sex and might be tempted to have sex outside of there marriage with someone else?

NFP is not relevant to a person’s decision to commit adultery.

I really hope all the great Catholics can help me with these questions. Im about to be married and these questions are very important to me.

I really hope you reconsider marrying someone who does not fully embrace the Church’s moral teachings.

 

[1ke]

Kevins giirl

what does it mean when it says day 18 of 29day cycle and so many days until testing? this sounds very …I dont know…I cant imagine that catholics in the ancient past did all this charting. what is charting how does it work?

What do you think NFP is?

Have you taken a class together?

Natural Family Planning consists of observing the woman’s fertility signs and determining whether to engage in or refrain from the marital embrace.

 

[sing]

NFP, in my family, did lead to 10 kids. I think the most important part of starting NFP is accepting that you are leaving this in God’s hands, and you may very well have unplanned pregnancies. If you can’t accept that, you might as well give up on having a Catholic marriage. You need to understand this and you need to be honest about it to your fiance. Research the concept of a Catholic marriage. Its not something your fiance seems prepared for.

 

[Alix1912]

I really hope you reconsider marrying someone who does not fully embrace the Church’s moral teachings.

What do you think NFP is?

Have you taken a class together?

Natural Family Planning consists of observing the woman’s fertility signs and determining whether to engage in or refrain from the marital embrace.

Wow…nothing like asking for a little advice and clarification on an issue which is surronded by misinformation and misconception, and getting treated like a stupid child.

The OP asked for advice and information on NFP, not to be told that he shouldn’t get married. How can you tell from the little information that he gave us what his fiance’s status to the church’s teachings are? They obviously had some misinformation about NFP, and honestly, before my husband and I learned what NFP really entailed we both thought it was a little odd too.

Obviously the OP had not taken a class and did not know much about NFP or he would not have posted his question. Be helpful and understanding, these issues are often personal and somewhat embarassing to talk about.

 

[SoulRebel777]

thank you alix, you sound like a really intelligent Woman of God. And Thank you all for all your advice as well. God bless you .

We havent taking the NFP Class yet but Ive learned alot already from you all and have had alot of my concerns addressed here. I’ m going to sign up for the NFP class asap this way my Fiance can begin charting now in preparing for our Spring wedding .

** another Question is …What Method is the Known as the best Method ? I know this might differ from woman to woman. Can you explain why this is ?**

I also want to say that I believe Catholic Women, true Catholic Women are the best kept secret on the face of the Earth. They really inspire men to live worthy Lives , Noble Lives.

So God bless all the great Catholic Women:thumbsup:

 

[FrenchGwen]

thank you alix, you sound like a really intelligent Woman of God. And Thank you all for all your advice as well. God bless you .

We havent taking the NFP Class yet but Ive learned alot already from you all and have had alot of my concerns addressed here. I’ m going to sign up for the NFP class asap this way my Fiance can begin charting now in preparing for our Spring wedding .

** another Question is …What Method is the Known as the best Method ? I know this might differ from woman to woman. Can you explain why this is ?**

I also want to say that I believe Catholic Women, true Catholic Women are the best kept secret on the face of the Earth. They really inspire men to live worthy Lives , Noble Lives.

So God bless all the great Catholic Women:thumbsup:

That’s great news !! Indeed the sooner your fiancée begins to chart, the more confident you will feel once married, and that will spare you a lot of stress !
From a newlywed point of view, I have to say there is a HUGE difference, concerning incertitude regarding a possible pregnancy, whether this incertitude stems from lack of confidence in the method/the signs of fertility/one’s own body or whether it stems from one’s behaviour: not always respecting the rules, ie engaging in intercourse on days marked fertile.
The first one is really difficult to live, and makes God’s will appear as something somewhat scary, whereas, on the other hand, ‘taking a chance’ is just another means of opening up to God’s will.

Regarding the different methods… there is a tendency to engage into a so-called “method war”, which is bad, because there are many elements that can make a said method to fit one couple and not another !

I can only talk to you about Billings and STM
method

• Billings is a mucuous only method: the woman charts her mucuous (what she sees), and above all, what she feels (hence the need to get aware of one’s sensations !)
• STM (Sympto-thermal Method) combines several signs: mucuous, temperature (those tell you when ovulation is definitely behind you) a well as cervical position + a statistic calculation to assert the days you can consider “secure” unless any other sign tells you otherwise

efficiency and abstinence

• STM contraints seem a bit heavier too, since you have to take your temperature each morning around the same hour
• both methods are highly efficient, but STM’s Pearl Index is slightly better than Billings.
• some women really appreciate the fact that they can crosscheck and thus feel more secure / other feel insecure when one signs seems to tell one thing and the other one another, and prefere to focus on a single sign
• yet on the other hand, from what I could see, the fact that STM crosschecks different signs implies that you have less days free for intercourse. (as, for example, mucuous sign often tells you earlier that ovulation has already occured, whereas the corresponding temperature rise may only intervene a few days later)

These considerations brought hubby and myself to the choice of Billings, since, in our eyes, the few % less chance with STM weren’t worth the additional abstinence . Yet other couples may feel differently. => a great occasion to talk about your expectations regarding family, sexuality,… !!!

Have a great talk !

 

[dixieagle]

\

NFP is indeed a form of birth control - insofar as by “control” you mean seeking to space children responsibly, according to one’s economic, financial, emotional, physical, etc. needs. Doing so is in no way condemned by the Church, and is, in fact, encouraged. Of course, there is no such thing as absolute “control,” and we are called to discern the spacing of our children together as a couple under God’s guidance.

But: The Church condemns contraception, not “birth control.”

Yessisan: I didn’t mean to “bait” anyone; as a teacher of NFP, I find I need to make this distinction a lot to searching couples - the proper vocabulary is important, and the lack thereof can be confusing. But I don’t want to derail the thread any more…perhaps I read too quickly, but I thought it was the OP asking the question…

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I’m glad you posted this - if you hadn’t, I would have. It is so important - when there is abundant misinformation and misunderstanding anyway - that we not confuse the situation further by using inaccurate terminology.

 

[yessisan]

thank you alix, you sound like a really intelligent Woman of God. And Thank you all for all your advice as well. God bless you .

We havent taking the NFP Class yet but Ive learned alot already from you all and have had alot of my concerns addressed here. I’ m going to sign up for the NFP class asap this way my Fiance can begin charting now in preparing for our Spring wedding .

another Question is …What Method is the Known as the best Method ? I know this might differ from woman to woman. Can you explain why this is ?

I also want to say that I believe Catholic Women, true Catholic Women are the best kept secret on the face of the Earth. They really inspire men to live worthy Lives , Noble Lives.

So God bless all the great Catholic Women:thumbsup:

I’m glad you are signing up for a class! Please, attend with her so you can understand her cycles too. You can be involved in the charting after you are married by jotting down her signs/symptoms, giving her the thermometer, or whatever.

Anyway, I can tell you Creighton is great but if she has some health issues, it might be hard for you guys to follow when you are married.

I like the symtpo-thermal method (STM) better though. It uses the same concept of Creighton and Billings but you have other ways to cross check to confirm ovulation. She’d take her temp every morning, and if she wants she can check her cervix and check the cervical mucus internally if she can’t “read” it externally. I love this one because after 3 elevated temperatures, if the mucus dries up at the same time, you can be sure you are in the infertile phase and don’t have to worry about abstaining.

With Creighton, if my husband and I were avoiding pregnancy, it’d be too hard since I have been having several health issues that mess up my mucus patterns, but even with this problem of mine, I could still do Creighton and try to learn what can be done to make my cycles normal.

And it also depends on your diocese and the city you live in and how far you’re willing to travel. For the STM class, I had to drive a few streets down in my town. For the other one, since it’s more scientific based, I had to drive 80 miles to get there. So it depends on how far you want to travel and what’s available in your area.

 

[jwatza]

First of all, marriage and children go together. Though the Church teaches that it is ok to use the natural rythm of a woman’s fertility cycle to space children, the couple must have serious reason to do so. God calls us to be generous with our fertility, to cooperate with Him in the creation of a new soul for heaven. How awesome is that! Our society is so full of selfishness that we see more than a couple of children as a burden. I am not telling you how many children to have, but to really check your attitude on this. My husband and i have used NFP at times to space our children, but we must always seek the will of God on this. We have 8 beautiful boys and I wouldn’t change that for the world! I would have felt overwhelmed thinking about having 8 kids when i first was married, but you grow into it. Some were planned by us, all were planned by God–after all it is He who puts the soul into the child. He has taught me not to fear having another child, but to see each child as a sweet gift from God above. May God richly bless your soon to be marriage.

 

[Lalting]

thank you alix, you sound like a really intelligent Woman of God. And Thank you all for all your advice as well. God bless you .

We havent taking the NFP Class yet but Ive learned alot already from you all and have had alot of my concerns addressed here. I’ m going to sign up for the NFP class asap this way my Fiance can begin charting now in preparing for our Spring wedding .

** another Question is …What Method is the Known as the best Method ? I know this might differ from woman to woman. Can you explain why this is ?**

I also want to say that I believe Catholic Women, true Catholic Women are the best kept secret on the face of the Earth. They really inspire men to live worthy Lives , Noble Lives.

So God bless all the great Catholic Women:thumbsup:

You are very welcome. We use the method outlined in the “Taking Charge of your Fertility” Book. It seems pretty easy, and the folks I know who use it have had great success both not getting pregnant with it and getting pregnant with it.

I’m not sure about the other methods, but I would find an OBGYN to talk to about it. Just make sure they are one who promotes Natural Family Planning.

Also…I’m not a Catholic woman…I’m a Lutheran Woman married to an awesome Catholic Man. But I do agree with you a good spouse is a rare treasure, and they do inspire us.

 

[yessisan]

You are very welcome. We use the method outlined in the “Taking Charge of your Fertility” Book. It seems pretty easy, and the folks I know who use it have had great success both not getting pregnant with it and getting pregnant with it.

That would be the sympto-thermal method. I am on ovusoft’s site all the time ovusoft.com/ (the site for the above mentioned book) and it’s the same NFP method as STM. The one great thing about TCOYF (“Taking Charge of your Fertility”) is that it comes with sofware to chart and you don’t have to do it manually (beware though, TCOYF is not Catholic, it mentions barrier methods that as a Catholic, of course, you would have to ignore), but if you went thru www.ccli.org (the ones who teach STM), they also have their own cd-rom for computer charting. But ovusoft’s is soooo much better. I only have the free version of it, but still, it has options where you can (name removed by moderator)ut if you have a headache, cramps, etc, whereas the ccli program doesn’t. Also, you can try www.fertilityfriend.com I have this one too and I like it a lot. You can use their free version or buy the VIP version.

 

[SS09]

I started charting 5 months ago, and I have been married for about 3 and a half months, and I have to say that I hate NFP. I like the philosophy behind it, and I do think that it is positive for many couples…but for me, personally, I am extremely frustrated with it and probably will not use it forever. My cycle is one in which the middle phase (I don’t know all the #s you’re all using but I’m going to assume the “white baby” days are during cycle 3) is extremely long (2-3 weeks) and the amount of days that we CAN have sex in a given month is about 4. Now, my husband and I waited 2 and a half years to have sex, and now we are barely having it at all, and when we can, it’s planned and completely unspontaneous. I definitely think that it is negatively affecting our marriage, and whenever we discuss it, we get into a fight. He’s the only one in this marriage that wants to do it, and I don’t think it’s fair of him to push something on me that it doing such negative things to our marriage…
So, sorry to be a downer on here, but I wanted you to be able to see another side of NFP. I would definitely have your fiance start charting, and if her cycle is “normal,” I would say go for it…I just don’t think it’s right for me.

Thank you for posting this! I’ve been using NFP (after 5 years on the pill) for 18 months. I appreicate the naturalness of the method and enjoy knowing what my body is doing. However, it has definitely hurt my marriage. My husband has grown to love the method. It’s all he wants to use. Now, he’s extremely anti oral or manual sex outside of intercourse. He has some health problems that also limit our activitiy. We hardly have sex. I find using only this method is extremely oppressive to women. It forces them to do all of the work (charting, checking mucus–I use the Creighton model, etc).

 

[kage_ar]

I find using only this method is extremely oppressive to women. It forces them to do all of the work (charting, checking mucus–I use the Creighton model, etc).

Yep, spending one or two whole minutes each day is soooooo oppressive Just like that oppressive tooth brusing and flossing. Heavens, how oppressive is THAT.